[Spoilers] EP607

[JMJ]

I get the feeling that this season, more than most, has been a lot of build up to who knows what (?Snowbowl, ?Cleganebowl) for Episodes 9 and 10. Too much choppy exposition. That being said,

1) I am more and more convinced that Arya has been planning this ruse.

2) Sansa likely write to LF - this goes back somehow to her not telling Jon that she met LF in Mole's Town.

[SerJeremiahLouistark]

25 minutes ago, mck said:

You have a good point. They probably should have spread Jon & sansa's plot about getting others in the north to rally for them across a few episodes so as not to milk so much time in this one. I have a feeling a lot of this seasons twists and turns will be revealed in eps 9 & 10 though. I really hope they can pull it together and make the series end on a high note, because they have muddled in mediocrity for a little too long now.

I do too, I look at a show like Peaky Blinders that seems to able to pull off more in 6 episodes than this show does in 10.  Again just my opinion but it seems to me like so much time is wasted on insignificant things.  Like Dorne, or Tyrion and his drinking games, or Yarasha and Theon at a whorehouse.  

 

I guess i should be fair and say that Peaky Blinders revolves around 1 family whereas Game revolves around many.  

Edited June 6, 2016 by SerJeremiahLouistark

[Ser Creighton]

9 hours ago, Ser Knute said:

Agree totally.  While there have been some decent moments, the season so far has been a lot of very little.  Almost every arc altered just enough to probably not be the same as the books so book readers aren't spoiled much if at all.

If we're down to roughly 10-11 episodes, a lot of material was wasted... and there seems to be even fewer reasons to have diverged from a lot of these plots that they have.  Dorne could not exist at all excepting for killing Myrcella.  The Sons of the Harpy are supposed to be filling me with terror at who they'll kill next... but no, they're content for now.  It won't even surprise me if the show just leaves Missandei or some unnamed advisor in Meereen while Dany takes her Khalasar west finally... they've got a 7 year deal with the slaver's, why should the show even bother with the knot?

Same with the North.  Of course they're having difficulty rallying the North to the Stark cause, if they all said yes too quickly there'd be very little drama.

All of Lady Olenna's appearances this season, pointless.  She came, made a crack about how she can smell the shit 5 miles away from KL and that was about as good as it got.  Acting as if Tommen didn't follow the Faith so he can be 'converted' then become the HS's pawn-king... that may happen in the books in some fashion, but it seems clear as a book reader this whole arc was/is filler, what was wrong with the faith withholding their blessing like the books?  A show of force by the Tyrells/Lannisters just nullifies any judgment Margaery had coming... all pretty easy changes that alter how the book's chapters will compare... but what are they waiting for?  Apparently they know the ending so why the stalling, unless to give time for TWoW to be out by next year's season start... 

I do like many aspects of the show but some of the choices they make are baffling.  If we're down to two seasons, shortened ones at that, they seem to be wasting time and material... but as long as we see a brothel and some tits, we'll forget all that might have been! 

Agree for the most part, and I am not going after the show, I have enjoyed this season. But like that show of force between the Tyrells and the Sparrows, it was pointless filler. I think in some ways they are waiting on Martin, I think it is clear now that they have some of the broad strokes, but little of the finer points of the stories has been made available to them, so they are trying to fill in some time gaps.

I think the Vale will fight with the North, but last year they needed something for Sophie to do, and did not have enough of her book arc to work with. So they put her in a different role. They say they always planned it, but I am not so sure that is true. Jon needed a story for this year and part of last year. I understand the need to create Hardhome, they were looking for something to make a splash, Jon sitting around the Wall would have just been KL North, without as many players. So last year they gave him an altered Hardhome arc and this year he is taking Stannis's place. In the long game Jon more than likely has more significance than Stannis, so they sacrifice his story and that will allow more time for Jon's actual arc down the road as their are less players to deal with.

Jon gets some northern support to fight Ramsey and his Northern support. The Wildlings fill in for the Hill clans.

Dorne literally has fallen off the map. Though perhaps they like Asha are heading for Dany. Then Theon a eunuch who needs some love and acceptance. Greyworm, high welcome to the world where sociopathic slavers have taken children, tortured, mutilated and abused them for years on end, and yet we find purpose to our lives. Yara, Dany, and the Sand Snakes, time for girl power. "

Dany: Yo, I'll tell you what I want, what I really, really want
Yara: So tell me what you want, what you really, really want
Dany: I'll tell you what I want, what I really, really want
Yara: So tell me what you want, what you really, really want
Dany: I wanna, (I) I wanna, (I) I wanna, (I) I wanna, (i)
I wanna really, really, really wanna Iron throne ah

Dany: If you want my future, forget my past
If you wanna be my people, better make it fast
Now don't go wasting my precious time
Get your act together we could be just fine

I'll tell you what I want, what I really, really want
So tell me what you want, what you really, really want
I wanna, (I) I wanna, (I) I wanna, (i) I wanna, (i)
I wanna really, really, really wanna Iron Throne ah
If you wanna be my Kingdom, you gotta get with my friends
(Gotta get with my friends)
Make it last forever, Dothraki never ends
If you wanna be my Kingdom, then have got to give
Taking is too easy, but that's the way it is

Oh, what do you think about that
Now you know how I feel
Say, I see a red door, is that door for real
(Are you for real)
I won't be hasty, I'll give peace a try
If you really bug me then kiss your ass goodbye

Yo I'll tell you what I want, what I really, really want
So tell me what you want, what you really, really want
I wanna, (I) I wanna, (I) I wanna, (I) I wanna, (I)
I wanna really, really, really wanna Iron Throne ah

If you wanna be my Kingdon, you gotta get with my friends
(Gotta get with my friends)
Make it last forever, Dothraki never ends
If you wanna be my Kingdom, you have got to give
(You've got to give)
Taking is too easy, but bitch that's jow it is

So, here's my story from A to Z
You wanna get with me, you gotta listen carefully
We got Drogo in the place who likes it in your face
You got Qarth like Locks whos heads are on the blocks
Slaves comes for free if your Silver Lady
And as for me, Westeros is gonna see

Slam your body down when Drogon is around
Slam your body down when drogon is around

 

[CrypticWeirwood]

4 hours ago, Imp Beyond the Wall said:

Tommen.  She is legally still Lady Lannister.  Little lady Mormont called her ought on her bigamy.  

Good call.

[Black Crow]

5 hours ago, conceptualinertia said:

I think they are trying to show that since he died, Jon's a lot more of a pessimist. Understandably.

Agreed. While death may no longer be what it once was, having died is bound to knock Jon sideways.

Now that being said, I have a suspicion as to where this is going. In the book, when Mance Rayder is about to attack Castle Black Jon is called upon to take command, but is reluctant until Aegon Targaryen proclaims "You are a son of Winterfell. It must be you or no-one!" It is such a splendid line I was surprised and puzzled that the mummers didn't use it.

Instead, however, we know from the trailer that Sansa is going to succeed in getting herself an army but we've also seen the reservations about her on the one hand and about "Lord Snow" on the other. Therefore I can easily see the line being used by Sansa to rouse Jon and get the army to follow him as a son of Winterfell.

[JamesD2020]

I thoroughly enjoyed the episode a lot!  Lady lil miss mormont was such a scene stealer I am highly impressed with the show's uncanny abilities at finding gifted children actors.   So my impressions...

Cleganebowl -  Yup, this is a given...  Who else will Champion for the High Sparrow vs the FrankenGregor.

Cersei - Setup for her losing her mind and dousing the entire city up in wildfire?  She nearly lost it during S2 Blackwater when she was about to poison her son and commit suicide.  If the tables are turned during the Cleganebowl and her son kills himself because Margery is no longer "in love with him", I think the noose will tighten enough for Cersei to drown out the entire city in wildfire.  It isn't beyond her to take desperate actions because she loses everything and everyone.  It will be interesting to see if Jaime can survive this or will he too continue on a path for revenge even if there is nothing left for him to do so.

Bastardbowl - It appears evident that Jon will lure Ramsay out now that he knows that the latter likes to take a frontal approach given the Bolton's last victory vs stannis.  I think that Jon will anticipate this and have like an epic Braveheart moment (when Wallace uses long spears to take out the calvary rush) but despite 'tactics' ramsay's ground intranfy have superior numbers and start to gain favor again.  It is in this moment we will have another 'army' rescue moment when the Vale Knights pop out seemingly out of no where and storm the battlefield.

Lastly Arya - She clearly planned this out.   She absolutely knew that the FM will come after her, even if she was to flee to westeros, how can you deal with having a cult who can change faces at will be on the back of your mind wherever you end up?  I mean that would bring great fear knowing that at every retreat, village, life milestone that she could have could be potentially threatened by people who can assume new identities to ensure the 'mission' is carried out.  Obviously Arya has to deal with these FM before she can even think about returning to Winterfell.  I think her plan is brilliant; feign her death and prep up for her retaliatory move if any.  I say if any because I believe she know's Jaqen will ask the Waif if the mission is complete, which the reply will be a yes.  I don't believe he will be convinced either by his deity influence or the waif might give it away in a smirk that speaks passion.  Either he will end the waif's life then and there and let Arya be free OR we will get the epic Arya takes revenge on the Waif with needle in hand.   Still I don't believe she could escape from Jaqen unless it was clearly a violation on the Waif's part to take pleasure in Arya's suffering as well as not killing her outright.  She might get the FM's pardon and let her be on her merry way.

 

[Marius Tarceatu]

I didn't read the whole thread but, am i the only one who thinks that priest is a Frey, and that he was hanged because of ... reasons?

Think book 3

[JMJ]

 

3 minutes ago, JamesD2020 said:

Bastardbowl - It appears evident that Jon will lure Ramsay out now that he knows that the latter likes to take a frontal approach given the Bolton's last victory vs stannis.  I think that Jon will anticipate this and have like an epic Braveheart moment (when Wallace uses long spears to take out the calvary rush) but despite 'tactics' ramsay's ground intranfy have superior numbers and start to gain favor again.  It is in this moment we will have another 'army' rescue moment when the Vale Knights pop out seemingly out of no where and storm the battlefield.

 

Another Stannis plot device we might see for this - recall how in the scene at Stannis' camp there was a passing mention by Davos that the camp site was chosen specifically because of it's defensibility. I wonder if they will use the battle strategies suggested from the books - ice lakes with holes cut out, other natural defenses as one of their "secret weapons".

[SerJeremiahLouistark]

Wun Wun will charge through the Bolton defenses and rip Ramsay apart.  His men will flee like frightened bitches.  Wun Wun will single handedly win this war and all wars to come.  Wun Wun FTW 

[Red Tiger]

52 minutes ago, Marius Tarceatu said:

I didn't read the whole thread but, am i the only one who thinks that priest is a Frey, and that he was hanged because of ... reasons?

Think book 3

Septon Ray = Raymund Frey

AMAZEBALLS

[hallam]

18 hours ago, Winter Is Overdue said:

I still don't understand why Jaqen allows the Waif to be the one to assassinate Arya. The Waif seems pretty emotionally invested in having Arya dead, something I thought Jaqen was tasking Arya to task for (in regards to her list). I thought being "No One" meant you had no emotion about who you were assigned to kill. And that sure isn't the Waif.

I think that is so obvious that it is part of the plot. The Waif has screwed up the kill really badly. She didn't kill Arya quickly, she didn't check she was dead, she didn't get the face for the wall.

18 hours ago, Lady White Wolf said:

Wasn't that Gendry in the coming attractions?

I am sure Gendry reappears for the endgame. And it looks like there is a Gendry/Hound/Arya team up coming.

The Hound has absorbed Arya's sense of justice. He is fighting again but not to follow orders and not for the seven (no Clegganebowl).

18 hours ago, White Boy said:

Looks like the Mountain takes out Lancel and his buddies next week

It occurs to me that Cersei has much less interest in the survival of Loras than Margery. And with the QoT out of the way, She is going to have the HS stabbed to death in his sept.

18 hours ago, White Boy said:

She will get around to telling Jon Littlefinger screwed her over, Jon will take care of him.

I suspect that the deal is to forget the earlier betrayal in return for the troops.

LF's end game is the Iron Throne, not Winterfell. And at this rate he will be the only person left in the seven kingdoms left to sit on it. I expect he will marry Cersei after Tommen gets iced.

18 hours ago, Arya Gendry said:

Arya is GRRM's wife's favorite character, so I doubt it. She's young and very fit, and the blade was short. Plus she's been drinking all manner of funky FM juice, so she may have super powers. I would be incredibly shocked if that's the end of her.

Of course its not the end of her.

The blade was much too short for that attack to work. The Waif was told to make it quick and she chose an approach that couldn't possibly work.

18 hours ago, Arya Gendry said:

Same here. I'm also unreasonably concerned about her money. I hope she didn't lose it!

She obviously stole it, can steal more if needed.

17 hours ago, Zombies That Were Promised said:

No Sam, Bran, Dany, or Euron.

Bran is probably only 1 more appearance, the finale, when he reaches The Wall.

Sam is probably only 1 more appearance as well, signaling his arrival to The Citadel.  We need to feel the threat of the WW before Sam uncovers the secret of how to beat them.  So Oldtown is really S7..

And Euron is just waiting around to replace Ramsay's screentime, my guess.

No, Euron is the link to Danny's invasion force. So he is probably still a baddie but a very different one. Also I think Ramsay doesn't get killed this season.

16 hours ago, CrypticWeirwood said:

Is it just me, or is there something peculiar about Yara telling her uncocked brother Theon that (as she herself so saltily put it) she's gonna go off and fuck that whore's tits off?

Not exactly tactful. Though to be fair, she doesn't have a cock either.

[CrypticWeirwood]

4 minutes ago, hallam said:

Not exactly tactful. Though to be fair, she doesn't have a cock either.

So what's holding Theon back from doing the same thing, eh?

Does this mean that Grey Worm and Missandei really will marry? 

Edited June 6, 2016 by CrypticWeirwood

[Lady Fishbiscuit]

18 hours ago, Ser Creighton said:

It's the Brotherhood without Manners, they are very rude.

[All-Bran]

19 hours ago, Winter Is Overdue said:

I still don't understand why Jaqen allows the Waif to be the one to assassinate Arya. The Waif seems pretty emotionally invested in having Arya dead, something I thought Jaqen was tasking Arya to task for (in regards to her list). I thought being "No One" meant you had no emotion about who you were assigned to kill. And that sure isn't the Waif.

Completely agree doesn't make sense that the waif can be allowed that kill, unless this was still part of arya's training and JH is throwing the waif under the bus to get arya to her potential?

18 hours ago, HowdyGareth Bale said:

I think that having this season's significance is enough to justify his time in this episode. I personally think that we are going to get a Hound/Mountain Champion fight, and being that this is inspired by ASoIF, I'd put money on the Mountain crushing our hopes yet again.

 

More than likely that cleganes are gonna have it out....can almost guarantee that the hound and Arya will see off at least one of 'the list' in an awesome tag team encounter tho. I would say cersei if I didn't think Jamie will be at least be involved in some way

[All-Bran]

19 hours ago, Winter Is Overdue said:

18 hours ago, Arya Gendry said:

Ned and Cat were too nice to play the game. Still, it was a dumb move. That said, I think Littlefinger didn't hesitate to cross Ned because he genuinely hated him for "stealing" Cat. On the flip side, I think he really does love Sansa. He may be IN love with her. Maybe naive, but he looked truly upset when she told him about Ramsay. And despite the fact that he seemingly knows everything, when he first saw Ramsay at Winterfell, he said something to the effect of "I don't know a lot about you." So maybe he will do the honorable thing for once and try to make it up to Sansa

......Hi there, let me introduce you to Littlefinger, you obviously haven't met

19 hours ago, HowdyGareth Bale said:

 

[hallam]

59 minutes ago, CrypticWeirwood said:

So what's holding Theon back from doing the same thing, eh?

Does this mean that Grey Worm and Missandei really will marry? 

No, Theon marries Grey Worm.

[All-Bran]

Theon, varys, and greyworm the brotherhood without members...

[Fisch]

Thoughts while watching:

 - I was fine with the idea of the Hound being dead, in books and show. Frankly, I've never quite understood the affection some fans have for him. I found him a very interesting and effective character, but a lot of folks seem to cross the line from appreciating a good supporting role to loving Sandor. The man, complex as he was, was still quite the horrid human being in many respects. And I really don't understand the "SanSan" people. All that said - nothing wrong with the way his reintroduction was handled, and the dialogue wasn't bad (at least not in the first scene). But until I see what the final payoff is, this storyline isn't doing much for me. And it seems silly to build up Ian McShane's part so much if it's only going to last the one episode.

 - If Arya were going to die, we'd see it this episode. The show isn't that subtle.

 - If Lyanna Mormont was defiant enough to reaffirm her House allegiance to the Starks to Stannis, why does she need convincing? Why does Davos have to do the convincing for Jon and Sansa? Why does the North need to be reminded of their oaths instead of remembering? Why doesn't Sansa trust Jon about the damn knights of the Vale? Why was the storyline I have the most interest in given the worst dialogue and sloppiest directing of the episode?

 - Still don't care about KL.

 - I'm of two minds about Riverrun. On the one hand, they're actually adapting material from ADwD. On the other hand...

1. This makes Dorne last season all the more pointless.

2. They really neutered Jaime and his bargaining position with the Blackfish compared to the source; I'm not sure where this is going.

 - Look at us! We have a lesbian leading the Ironborn! Aren't we progressive (never mind the gratuitous nudity and objectifying of the woman Yara was after)? And look! She forces her c**kless brother to drink and prove himself a man! Isn't that empowering of her? We get feminism!*

Overall: a lot of set-up for the punchlines to come in later episodes. Pretty boring set-up too. Remember when the set-up was suspenseful and compelling? I do. I want that back.

* Lest this be misconstrued: it's the way the lesbianism was handled I find objectionable, not the fact that the character is a lesbian. Though I'm not sure why they re-worked a character who was straight in the books (so far as I remember).

[hallam]

8 hours ago, Imp Beyond the Wall said:

Tommen.  She is legally still Lady Lannister.  Little lady Mormont called her ought on her bigamy.  

I have been thinking that she ends up married to Tyrion. Certainly, LF can't marry her until Ramsay is dead.

7 hours ago, Darksky said:

I immensely enjoy the way the show keeps shitting on Stannis, even after his death.

'Stannis....who lost the Blackwater, who murdered his own brother, who doesn't have a head.' kek

Now the final act would be for Ramsay to have him on one of those crosses.

I only hope they will shit on the guy from a higher height. Show or book, Stannis is obviously a shit.

7 hours ago, DutchArya said:

That was the Waif's first big mistake. She is getting too confident, not retreiving the body or bringing Jaqen Arya's face. Sloppy. I feel like this is ALL a test for the Waif. She is farther along in her apprenticeship and I think Jaqen was ready to see if she is No One. Signs point to the fact that she is NOT behaving like someone who has no identity. She is taking personal pleasure in torturing Arya. She was told not to let her suffer and failed that request. 

Look at the way "Arya" is walking, talking, and generally caring herself. It doesn't feel like her. Where did she get two bags of silver coin? Her clothes are different and look expensive. She wants to travel first class? The real Arya wouldn't give a damn how she is travelling, especially with the FM threat hanging over her. Getting OUT is her main priority. Unless that wasn't Arya buying a seat on the ship or casually strolling the streets when the last time we saw her she was hiding in some underground alcove in the dark.

 

Lastly. Where is Needle? 

The cabin comment did it for me. Arya wanted to be seen. She did it in public as well. Why draw attention to herself?

Come to that, if she did use a bag of blood, why run through the crowd clutching her chest, if not to let Jaq'un know that the Waif failed?

I am thinking that maybe the Waif knows the hit isn't done yet and will follow her. Arya plus needle can easily beat a Waif who thinks she is mortally wounded.

7 hours ago, Nerevanin said:

I don't feel like going through the 18 pages, so sorry if it was already asked but can someone explain to me what happened to Melisandre? I don't I've seen her in any scene, although she was among those leaving Castle Black....

Getting ready to be the first kill for Arya in Westeros, I guess. Unless the hound decides to start on Arya's hit list for her.

6 hours ago, Gi_Varotti said:

I don't know if someone else already said this (I'm too many post behind) but what if Sansa was writting the letter to Theon? The "gratitude" we saw there would also fit him.

As for Arya, I'm not sure about what will happen to her but some ideas that crossed my mind are:

1. She'll die and the girl will wear her face to fulfill the theatre contract
2. She'll die and the girl will go to Westeros disguised as Arya
3. It wasn't Arya (not sure if you can have someone's face without killing him/her first)
4. The theatre folks will help her

I mean, she's been in the House long enough to know how things work there. She wouldn't be so careless and naive.

I think it is the theatre troupe she goes back with. 

Arya wouldn't be so careless but the Waif would think her so. And whats more, what happened to the other hit Arya was supposed to do? Shouldn't the Waif close the contract?

[AGS Martell]

I think it's clear the person Sansa is writing to is LF, in order to get the Arryn army to support them. Ravens were already sent to other northern houses (like Manderly) and there is NO ONE else who'll support her.

As for Arya... How could she be so careless!? My guess is either the theatre troupe will aid her, or Jaqen.