Asma Ben Hamouda Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 2 minutes ago, Risto said: Well, all I can ask as the OP is to leave whore comments outside this thread. Really sorry OP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 2 minutes ago, Jamie Lannister said: Lying about the Vale's knights was just dumb and harmful, and not needed for this storyline to work. She should have admitted that aid was offered from LF, but made it clear that she doesn't think it's worth banking on because she considers Baelish an enemy of the family too. This of course raises the question of whether she's against it for the practical reason of not wanting to trust an unreliable ally, or the more personal issue rooted in the rape and battering she suffered at the hands of the husband LF sold her to, but Sansa outright lying about and obfuscating the mere knowledge of a potentially massive boon to the Starks' efforts just runs contrary to their assertion that she's become a "proper player." I was expecting to see them coming to some sort of mutually beneficial agreement. I don't think that LF manipulated her because she is literally gonna parade with Jon dressed in Ned's clothes. As a Stark, she will be telling people to stand behind Jon and take back the North. So, I think it would be a bit out of character for her to suddenly realize she wants to be Queen and start turning against family. 3 minutes ago, Asma Ben Hamouda said: Really sorry OP No problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolfQueenArya Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 I have tried to like Sansa and I just don't like her. It isn't because I am an Arya fan. And she did revert back to her old self: her bossy, b*tchy self who lies all the time. I thought they were changing her with last weeks episode. I loved how she stood up to Littlefinger, but she lied to Jon meaning Littefinher still has hold of her. Meaning she is starting to become him without her realizing it. And she always wanted to become queen. What do you think will happen once they take back Winterfell? I guess we will wait and see where they take her character further on this season and beyond. I hope they make her realize her foolish mistakes or something because even though Sophie is becoming really good with acting, I still won't like Sansa the character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarandor Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Oh yes, listen to Littlefinger and go to Riverrun. Nothing terrible has ever happened there! Oh... wait. When she lied about it, that sorta sealed the deal that some shit is going to go down. I reallllly hope Brienne is able to talk some sense into her, or at the very least tell Jon who the true source was. I think Sansa is becoming her own, BUT her trying to take matters into her own hands, or take off more than she can chew--she really needs to ask for help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christi84 Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 I didnt really understand why she lied at first. But as I think about it, I dont think she wants anyone to know about LF because he isnt a trustworthy person and she knows that, and if shes shown to be reliant on him and his information no one will take her seriously. Now if LF and the Vale soldiers role up and LF punks her out thats where the reprucussion would be with Jon, but I feel like she does want them to rebuild on their own as much as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asma Ben Hamouda Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 1 hour ago, Risto said: The second scene was also interesting on multiple levels. First one is that lie. Did LF really get to Sansa and made her distrustful towards her own family? there is a mysterious smile at the end of the meeting!!! 1 hour ago, Risto said: but also compared him to Ramsay She compared him to ramsay because they are bastards, Ramsay didn't have any power on dreadfort until his legitmization, so as long as Jon is a bastard he can't rally the northern families, isn't that the truth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asma Ben Hamouda Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 4 minutes ago, WolfQueenArya said: I have tried to like Sansa and I just don't like her. It isn't because I am an Arya fan. And she did revert back to her old self: her bossy, b*tchy self who lies all the time. I thought they were changing her with last weeks episode. I loved how she stood up to Littlefinger, but she lied to Jon meaning Littefinher still has hold of her. Meaning she is starting to become him without her realizing it. And she always wanted to become queen. What do you think will happen once they take back Winterfell? I guess we will wait and see where they take her character further on this season and beyond. I hope they make her realize her foolish mistakes or something because even though Sophie is becoming really good with acting, I still won't like Sansa the character. bla bla bla, focus on stories, don't focus on the characters, they are fictional Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 Just now, WolfQueenArya said: I have tried to like Sansa and I just don't like her. It isn't because I am an Arya fan. And she did revert back to her old self: her bossy, b*tchy self who lies all the time. I thought they were changing her with last weeks episode. I loved how she stood up to Littlefinger, but she lied to Jon meaning Littefinher still has hold of her. Meaning she is starting to become him without her realizing it. And she always wanted to become queen. What do you think will happen once they take back Winterfell? I guess we will wait and see where they take her character further on this season and beyond. I hope they make her realize her foolish mistakes or something because even though Sophie is becoming really good with acting, I still won't like Sansa the character. I am sorry, whether you like Sansa or not is completely irrelevant. Sansa spent the past five years in captivity. Her lies are what saved her life. So, being lying bossy herself is non-withstanding here. Actually, this is quite the departure from what she has been able to pull off so far. Sansa did want to become a Queen at some point of her life. After that, she never expressed any significant ambition towards that goal. I do believe that she is currently doing all in her power to take back North and she is helping Jon to do so. The mere fact that she wants to evoke memories of her father with Jon speaks that the being Queen is not perhaps the priority, or the end game or even the reason why she lied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Jon Snow Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 I'm very interested what will happen with Littlefinger. I feel like this is going to be Petyr's last season. Hopefully this is a greater play at work here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 4 minutes ago, Asma Ben Hamouda said: She compared him to ramsay because they are bastards, Ramsay didn't have any power on dreadfort until his legitmization, so as long as Jon is a bastard he can't rally the northern families, isn't that the truth? But she does expect Jon to help her retake the Winterfell. She does expect Northern families to back him. I am not sure about the Ramsay comparison, unless she wanted to make the point that Jon can rule WF even as a Snow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarandor Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 2 minutes ago, Commander Jon Snow said: I'm very interested what will happen with Littlefinger. I feel like this is going to be Petyr's last season. Hopefully this is a greater play at work here. I think she thinks she can outsmart him, but honestly, I think she has a lot to learn. She has no idea what he's capable of, and what he's done already! I'm really quite worried about this whole situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asma Ben Hamouda Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 1 minute ago, Risto said: But she does expect Jon to help her retake the Winterfell. She does expect Northern families to back him. I am not sure about the Ramsay comparison, unless she wanted to make the point that Jon can rule WF even as a Snow. but the discussion in the meeting was how to rally the northern families, they know that 2000 wildlings can't do anything against Ramsay, the problem is Jon is a Snow, so she suggested that they must use her name to rally them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 Just now, Asma Ben Hamouda said: but the discussion in the meeting was how to rally the northern families, they know that 2000 wildlings can't do anything against Ramsay, the problem is Jon is a Snow, so she suggested that they must use her name to rally them But, they are not just using that. Northerners are also gathering around one bastard - Ramsay, so they wouldn't have the problem gathering around Ned's bastard. With her name and his commanding skills, plus her making him more-Stark with Ned-like cape, people will flock to them. I think that was what she meant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asma Ben Hamouda Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 2 minutes ago, Risto said: But, they are not just using that. Northerners are also gathering around one bastard - Ramsay no man, ramsay is already a bolton and defacto the warden of the north, and the two northern families who joined Ramsay was for their interests and not for the boltons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 Just now, Asma Ben Hamouda said: no man, ramsay is already a bolton and defacto the warden of the north, and the two northern families who joined Ramsay was for their interests and not for the boltons Ramsay was Bolton because Lannisters made him that way. I think that point is that if some lords, whatever their reasons may be, joined one bastard, why others can't join the bastard of the man they respected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Glory Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 I think the reason Jon's status as a bastard was brought up is because unlike Ramsay, Jon has legitimate siblings that are still living. To ensure that all Northern houses are on the same page, the support of Sansa- the only known living child of Ned Stark, is needed. The Northern lords may be hesitant to join Jon if they know Sansa, or Bran, or Rickon are alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asma Ben Hamouda Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 5 minutes ago, Risto said: Ramsay was Bolton because Lannisters made him that way. I think that point is that if some lords, whatever their reasons may be, joined one bastard, why others can't join the bastard of the man they respected. I'm pretty sure of one rule in westeros : if you are a bastard you can't rally any family even if your father is Stark, bolton, lannister or whatever, that why Sansa suggested using her name to rally the northeners and the tullys (her mother is a tully) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel Green Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Sophie's so great in this part. The initial confrontation was really dramatic; even Aidan Gillen's acting was tolerable for once. As to her withholding information, I thought it was an interesting moment particularly in that when Brienne asked about it afterward, she looked genuinely surprised/uncertain about it, like she wasn't sure why she had done it. Her having trust issues makes a lot of sense given all she's been through, though the exact contours of the political situation for the Starks are such that I'm not entirely sure what the niggle picking away in her mind is (perhaps she doesn't either). Is she worried about position? Being in somebody else's power, in general? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newstar Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Pretty much everyone who was supposed to help or who claimed to care about Sansa (Ned, Joffrey, Lysa, LF, Dontos, etc.) has screwed her over or let her down. Not surprising that she would have trust issues and want some insurance against the possibility that Jon will do what every other person she's trusted except Brienne has done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asma Ben Hamouda Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 7 minutes ago, Colonel Green said: As to her withholding information, I thought it was an interesting moment particularly in that when Brienne asked about it afterward they were 2 cliffhangers in this episode : why Sansa didn't tell the truth The name that Varys heard in the flames Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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