Will Rob's will surface making Jon King in the North?

[Lord Friendzone]

1 minute ago, yakisikli123 said:

This episode proved that the Stark name hasnt any effect.

Maybe wait for RLJ

You think that Targaryen name will? It's just like Stark name, worthless but not to Daeny. Not to mention how is he going to prove it because he looks nothing like a Targaryen, there better some solid proof or people will laugh at him.

[Smoke317]

If this episode is indicative of the fiery leadership and command that Jon possesses he needs to go back to the wall. Because he didn't seem like much of a King in the North to me. He's my favorite character. So I'm very disappointed that Davos has to bring the passion about the WW's and the real war to come when he's never even seen a fucking wight let alone a WW...

[Lord Lannister]

1 minute ago, Smoke317 said:

If this episode is indicative of the fiery leadership and command that Jon possesses he needs to go back to the wall. Because he didn't seem like much of a King in the North to me. He's my favorite character. So I'm very disappointed that Davos has to bring the passion about the WW's and the real war to come when he's never even seen a fucking wight let alone a WW...

I've actually liked that Jon has been visibly shaken and less sure of himself since the whole dying thing.

[Smoke317]

1 minute ago, Lord Lannister said:

I've actually liked that Jon has been visibly shaken and less sure of himself since the whole dying thing.

He's always been unsure of himself. Wun Wun did call him Snow...  Maybe Jon won't become the man he is supposed to be until he learns his true parentage and stops being "the bastard" and gains some self confidence.  Bran hurry up and help your brother/cousin because Winter is Coming and the North needs a strong leader. 

[Les Météores D]

11 hours ago, ShadowKitteh said:

And who would even have the will at this point? And more importantly, who would care?

I don't think it's mattered in the books since the Red Wedding.

 

Who? The people who left with it just before Robb's death. The Northerner will care if LF tries to control their lands using Sansa.

The will is textbook Chekhov's gun, with either positive or negative results for the Starks (not just Jon). 

 

[ShadowKitteh]

4 hours ago, The Scabbard Of the Morning said:

Even if Robb had a will, it doesn't matter since apparently he's not the beloved Young Wolf that the North loved that was betrayed, he's the guy who everyone in the North hates.

This. 

So harsh blaming the Red Wedding on Robb and that "foreign whore."

[Lord Lannister]

Just now, ShadowKitteh said:

This. 

So harsh blaming the Red Wedding on Robb and that "foreign whore."

I actually liked that line, however harsh it may be. Just the notion that some people are calling Robb on his blunders and most of the North seems reluctant to join up with a side that apparently has little chance to win. If there was a massive anti-Bolton sentiment they all would've joined with Stannis. But the North remembers? Sure, they remember Robb marching south with 20,000 of their sons who never came back. They remember him leaving the North nude to the ironborn's ravagings. They remember the wildlings, who are now beyond the wall, doing the same in their raids. Is it any wonder that some of the Northern lords are hesitant to send what they have left to die in another pointless fight?

[ShadowKitteh]

56 minutes ago, Lord Friendzone said:

You think that Targaryen name will? It's just like Stark name, worthless but not to Daeny. Not to mention how is he going to prove it because he looks nothing like a Targaryen, there better some solid proof or people will laugh at him.

Jon Stark-Targaryen = Henry Tudor.  

It's not the name. It's the joining of two legendary ancient houses. 

And they're pretty much the only ones left, once Jon (BRAN) unites the North.

1 minute ago, Lord Lannister said:

I actually liked that line, however harsh it may be. Just the notion that some people are calling Robb on his blunders and most of the North seems reluctant to join up with a side that apparently has little chance to win. If there was a massive anti-Bolton sentiment they all would've joined with Stannis. But the North remembers? Sure, they remember Robb marching south with 20,000 of their sons who never came back. They remember him leaving the North nude to the ironborn's ravagings. They remember the wildlings, who are now beyond the wall, doing the same in their raids. Is it any wonder that some of the Northern lords are hesitant to send what they have left to die in another pointless fight?

Oh, I agree - I didn't mean to imply harsh = bad, it's great for the story and how the audience needs to be clear how far the Starks have fallen, and why.

I can't figure out what's going to cause them to unite against the Boltons. There'd be motivation if they all find out the truth Ned took to the grave and why, but with THE BATTLE in ep 9 (right?), that's a metric shitload of ground/time to cover in one episode, and zero Bran in the promo. 

 

[yakisikli123]

1 hour ago, Lord Friendzone said:

You think that Targaryen name will? It's just like Stark name, worthless but not to Daeny. Not to mention how is he going to prove it because he looks nothing like a Targaryen, there better some solid proof or people will laugh at him.

Normally I think he should win battles to prove himself without a name, and the only problem of Jon Snow is confidence, I think he will only change (motivated, purpose to fight)  when he knows RLJ

[Lord Friendzone]

17 minutes ago, ShadowKitteh said:

Jon Stark-Targaryen = Henry Tudor.  

It's not the name. It's the joining of two legendary ancient houses. 

And they're pretty much the only ones left, once Jon (BRAN) unites the North.

Oh, I agree - I didn't mean to imply harsh = bad, it's great for the story and how the audience needs to be clear how far the Starks have fallen, and why.

I can't figure out what's going to cause them to unite against the Boltons. There'd be motivation if they all find out the truth Ned took to the grave and why, but with THE BATTLE in ep 9 (right?), that's a metric shitload of ground/time to cover in one episode, and zero Bran in the promo. 

 

Pretty sure Daeny seems more fit to Henry Tudor of Game of Thrones. Largely this is based on War of the Roses and Jon seems to be Elizabeth more likely, Dany Henry Tudor.

As for his heritage. How can he prove it, one way is if he believes Bran or Howland Reed,...other how he can prove it to others. It's like white walkers stories.

 

19 minutes ago, yakisikli123 said:

Normally I think he should win battles to prove himself without a name, and the only problem of Jon Snow is confidence, I think he will only change (motivated, purpose to fight)  when he knows RLJ

I like this approach for Jon. If he'll be too confident, arrogant, cruel it would be like throwing away 5 seasons of character development or books. He's afraid of white walkers and death. He's been there and he knows ther's nothing...how ironic. "You know nothing Jon Snow" Also it goes differently to Daeny who is more confident, seemingly unstoppable and marching on iron throne. Even her resurrection or rebirth was more spectacle than Jon's quiet one.

[blckp]

Don't worry he will have real power once Daenerys learns about R+L=J, she can give him power

[Lord Friendzone]

9 minutes ago, blckp said:

Don't worry he will have real power once Daenerys learns about R+L=J, she can give him power

What makes you think she will even believe it? It's not that easy.

Of course he can't earn it himself right and Daeny will give power to him. Otherwise he's useless, right?  He'll be in position of power (if by that you mean position as King/Warden of the North, he already leads an army as that is some power) comes ending of this season and before meeting her.

[blckp]

16 hours ago, Lord Friendzone said:

What makes you think she will even believe it? It's not that easy.

Of course he can't earn it himself right and Daeny will give power to him. Otherwise he's useless, right?  He'll be in position of power (if by that you mean position as King/Warden of the North, he already leads an army as that is some power) comes ending of this season and before meeting her.

if Bran or Red priests gives her vision of R+L=J, she will believe it

but the north is just empty place, Robb killed off the northern army , being king with just name nah, she can give him real power to influence rest of the world, heck she might even give him 7 kingdom

[yakisikli123]

13 minutes ago, blckp said:

Don't worry he will have real power once Daenerys learns about R+L=J, she can give him power

No no he should earn this power himself, what you mean is Daenerys is queen and he is only a puppet commander, maybe only a a soldier.

I wrote before, he should know the truth only himself for the time being, because he hasnt any purpose of fighting (OK Home back Brother....) but what then. And this lack of confidence makes him only more powerless therefore he should know RLJ.

And most important part is not to be a Targ, its not to be a bastard for him.

[blckp]

16 hours ago, yakisikli123 said:

No no he should earn this power himself, what you mean is Daenerys is queen and he is only a puppet commander, maybe only a a soldier.

I wrote before, he should know the truth only himself for the time being, because he hasnt any purpose of fighting (OK Home back Brother....) but what then. And this lack of confidence makes him only more powerless therefore he should know RLJ.

And most important part is not to be a Targ, its not to be a bastard for him.

she cant control both Essos and Westeros, she will be busy with Essos ,

auntie helping nephew is more believable and logical than Jon somehow gets magical army from lannisters,tyrells,iron isles,dorne or nonexistent army from the north

[yakisikli123]

And what is she expecting from him

[blckp]

16 hours ago, yakisikli123 said:

And what is she expecting from him

expecting him to rule westeros ? they're relative

[yakisikli123]

But no incest 

[Mayura]

Re-Jon and Daenerys, I think the fact they are related and will probably both learn they are related is important for both characters developments. It doesn't necessarily means Dany will help Jon rule or vice-versa.

But both Jon and Daenerys have pretty much felt "lonely" during this whole time. Jon was obviously hurt by the fact he was a bastard and he couldn't even know his mother's name. He never really felt that he belonged  with the Starks, even though most of them did their best to treat him like close family. Show Daenerys thinks she is the last of the Targaryens and she knows she - presumably - can't produce a heir, so she thinks House Targaryen will die with her. So finding out they are related will undoubtedly create a bond between the characters. It will help Jon realize how much Ned loved him and how he sacrificed his honor to protect him. And Dany will realize she is not really the last of the Targaryens. 

I think that their relationship means much more than just "he's my nephew therefore I can expect him to rule the Seven Kingdoms". I think this question will be moot by the time Jon and Dany meet; the WW will be in Westeros (south of the Wall) and KL will likely be destroyed. 

[Lord Friendzone]

2 hours ago, blckp said:

if Bran or Red priests gives her vision of R+L=J, she will believe it

but the north is just empty place, Robb killed off the northern army , being king with just name nah, she can give him real power to influence rest of the world, heck she might even give him 7 kingdom

I don't want Dany to be Stannis 2:0 and starts to believe in visions. Sending the visions? Bran can see the past but sending visions wasn't established so far. Wouldn't count on it.

Jon couldn't care less about controlling the world, rulling. He's doing things out of duty but not because he wants power. Unlike Dany who wants to control it all...I don't blame her in her position, but soon will realize it means nothing. White Walkers threat is bigger thing to deal with.