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Lany, so happy for you! Kair too. :)

Nora, sounds like your leaving date can't come soon enough. Best wishes for the new position!

Datepalm: what does "bureaucratic formalities" mean? Without knowing much about the situation, I suggest you keep applying for other positions you like for now. This unwanted internship sounds all very vague at the moment.

I have to write a personal statement to put at the top of my CV: 50-200 words on how great I am etc. Ugh. I found a Guardian article that said describe who you are, where you're at and what you're interested in from a job. This is totally cringey for me. Maybe if I pretend I'm writing it about someone else? Has anyone else done these?

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29 minutes ago, Datepalm said:

It wasn't a formal offer, at least, but a 'we'll be sorting out bureaucratic formalities and will get back to you very soon. So when are you available? Oh, and would you be ok with Bangladesh also?' during the 1.5th interview, which took me by surprise. 

Even if accept, what if I change my mind in the six months between now and the vague start date? Or something comes up? Or I break a leg?

If you don't want it, why would you accept?

Anyway, if you have no interest in taking this internship, write back to them today and say so. I mean, do it diplomatically -- you were given an opportunity elsewhere that aligns perfectly with your interests and skillset (or whatever you feel most comfortable saying) and you will regretfully have to decline their generous offer. That gives the organization the chance to move on and offer the position to the next-most-qualified candidate. You will earn more enemies by dragging your feet than by making a clean diplomatic break early.

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Back when i applied, 3 odd months ago, taking that semester off for an internship was something i would totally have gone for, but things have shifted around a bit, and probably more than i realized when i agreed to the - quite unexpected - interview. Also they said off record im over qualified, and why am i interested in this when ive worked on 'real things', so thats less than enthusiasm-generating. I guess ill politely write that in thinking it over, and taking changes in academic schedule into consideration, i have to focus on finishing my studies and hope they will consider my future applications, degree in hand, for slightly more senior positions with their lovely giant bureaucracy monster organization, and hope for the best. 

Angalin - I could be wrong of course, but my sense was that id made the final cut (there are multiple positions) and it was a matter of figuring out who to assign where pending a few more interviews and final confirmation. so i could bail on them like right now, or wait a week until im formally accepted or rejected, or let it drag out on the odd chance something changes for me by February, or they're willing to let me drag it out to june-july when im done with school, etc. Its a confidence thing, i guess - i have a nail biting tendency to hold on to the first offer i get because i don't think anything else is going to come along. (This was explained to me once at a job interview to run a support group for women entering the workforce, by the interviewing social workers who told me they trustrd i could do it, but thst they wouldn't hire me for my own good.IDEK.)

Edited by Datepalm

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3 hours ago, Angalin said:

Lany, so happy for you! Kair too. :)

Nora, sounds like your leaving date can't come soon enough. Best wishes for the new position!

Datepalm: what does "bureaucratic formalities" mean? Without knowing much about the situation, I suggest you keep applying for other positions you like for now. This unwanted internship sounds all very vague at the moment.

I have to write a personal statement to put at the top of my CV: 50-200 words on how great I am etc. Ugh. I found a Guardian article that said describe who you are, where you're at and what you're interested in from a job. This is totally cringey for me. Maybe if I pretend I'm writing it about someone else? Has anyone else done these?

Describe these things informally - like, right here - and then put it together from what you say when you're not phrasing it for a CV? (Or we will.) Like turning around really fast to catch a glimpse of your back in a mirror. 

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6 hours ago, Isis said:

I would say that if, for example, you were sending your CV with an application for an academic post and you wanted to show that you had direct experience of particular techniques or a specific field of a subject then it would be fine (and even encouraged) to specifically mention your thesis to illustrate this. If it's not for an academic post specifically then I guess you need to decide if it is going to illustrate something about you that sets you above other applicants.

Re. publications - again, if it's for academia they will probably care whether it is a peer-reviewed article or not. Outside of academia then just list them as generic publications.

Re. your contract reports, they don't sound like the type of thing that you should be listing/describing - other than as a skill, ie that you have had responsibility for writing such documents.

Sounds like solid advice to me.  Thanks!

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On 9/14/2016 at 4:06 PM, Datepalm said:

Back when i applied, 3 odd months ago, taking that semester off for an internship was something i would totally have gone for, but things have shifted around a bit, and probably more than i realized when i agreed to the - quite unexpected - interview. Also they said off record im over qualified, and why am i interested in this when ive worked on 'real things', so thats less than enthusiasm-generating. I guess ill politely write that in thinking it over, and taking changes in academic schedule into consideration, i have to focus on finishing my studies and hope they will consider my future applications, degree in hand, for slightly more senior positions with their lovely giant bureaucracy monster organization, and hope for the best. 

Angalin - I could be wrong of course, but my sense was that id made the final cut (there are multiple positions) and it was a matter of figuring out who to assign where pending a few more interviews and final confirmation. so i could bail on them like right now, or wait a week until im formally accepted or rejected, or let it drag out on the odd chance something changes for me by February, or they're willing to let me drag it out to june-july when im done with school, etc. Its a confidence thing, i guess - i have a nail biting tendency to hold on to the first offer i get because i don't think anything else is going to come along. (This was explained to me once at a job interview to run a support group for women entering the workforce, by the interviewing social workers who told me they trustrd i could do it, but thst they wouldn't hire me for my own good.IDEK.)

In the spring I went to a workshop on women and jobs which said similar things. We tend to undersell ourselves drastically.

If you know you don't want this position, let them know asap. I like the line about focusing on your studies. 

On 9/14/2016 at 4:22 PM, Datepalm said:

Describe these things informally - like, right here - and then put it together from what you say when you're not phrasing it for a CV? (Or we will.) Like turning around really fast to catch a glimpse of your back in a mirror. 

Ok, here goes (thank you for the suggestion): I'm a grad student finishing an MSc in history who's worked in both academic publishing and university admin. I guess what I'm looking for are jobs in the same fields but at higher levels (though why an MSc makes me any better at them, I dunno. I'm also tired after a weekend of refereeing between children so this is sketchy). I want a job that requires no overnight travelling and pays relatively well, but that's not what you say in a happy-clappy CV statement.

Thanks for any help, folks.

(sorry, can only be flip due to feeling seriously drained and the cat thinks it's well past time to go to bed)

 

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I'm a grad student finishing an MSc in history who's worked in both academic publishing and university admin. I guess what I'm looking for are jobs in the same fields but at higher levels. I want a job that requires no overnight travelling and pays relatively well, but that's not what you say in a happy-clappy CV statement.

"A recent MSc history graduate of Blobbity University, I am currently seeking mid-career (/management/senior administrative/?) roles in publishing and academia. I have extensive professional experience in academic publishing/etc, where I did Stuff X of Type Y and developed an excellent command of Essential Skills 1 and 2 and Esoteric Skill 3. I am looking for a dynamic/stable workplace with opportunities to join a team/independently lead Developing K-type Projects/Providing L-Type Services/Doing Things."

Something like that? A bit pointless without knowing the jargon, but something to get you started in plugging in industry-specific terms?

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11 hours ago, Datepalm said:

"A recent MSc history graduate of Blobbity University, I am currently seeking mid-career (/management/senior administrative/?) roles in publishing and academia. I have extensive professional experience in academic publishing/etc, where I did Stuff X of Type Y and developed an excellent command of Essential Skills 1 and 2 and Esoteric Skill 3. I am looking for a dynamic/stable workplace with opportunities to join a team/independently lead Developing K-type Projects/Providing L-Type Services/Doing Things."

Something like that? A bit pointless without knowing the jargon, but something to get you started in plugging in industry-specific terms?

that is AWESOME and exactly what I needed, thank you! 

Helps that I'm now officially a graduate, not just anxiously waiting on results. :)

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On 9/14/2016 at 7:08 AM, Datepalm said:

It wasn't a formal offer, at least, but a 'we'll be sorting out bureaucratic formalities and will get back to you very soon. So when are you available? Oh, and would you be ok with Bangladesh also?' during the 1.5th interview, which took me by surprise. 

Even if accept, what if I change my mind in the six months between now and the vague start date? Or something comes up? Or I break a leg?

Like other said, I'd let them know you are no longer interested as soon as possible.

 

So I am totally over-reacting to something that happened today. I'm really upset, and it's an over-reaction because it won't really affect things (I think) (and I am over-tired, over worked, and over stressed)

I am still working on my first deal (they take months to prepare/close). I've had to deal with over 2400 "items" for this deal, and I've done a great job of keeping it all organized. I have worked a lot of extra hours to prove myself, to show that I was the right person for this job, that the transaction manager (TM) can have complete faith in me, especially since I will be working on her next deal too.

We're almost done with my part, and today during the on-line/phone weekly update meeting that is all department heads, the transaction manager, my boss, and me, I gave my update that I had finished my part, with the exception of 8 items that were waiting for items that had been ordered for them. The guy who is the lead for the department that owes me these items butts in and says he shows only 4 outstanding items.

I was floored! First off, this TM is very brisk, just the facts, move on quickly, no discussions of them during this meeting -- conversations are to be at other times (she's very busy and so are the department heads). Secondly, he basically said I was wrong to everyone, something that I feel is very bad work manners. He should have e-mailed me afterwards, asking if we could compare lists, to see where the difference was (which is exactly what I did, copying my boss, and btw, I was right--but I knew that, I have spent many hours just tracking the status of all my items, and double and triple checking everything)

What has me so upset is that he totally undermined me. (I am the low man on the totem pole, so it isn't about advancement or anything, and everyone else involved on the deal has treated me like an equal). I know it is a small thing, and my boss knows I was correct, but still, it just seems like it was not an appropriate time/place for it. (and as a new person, I feel it is so important to make that good first impression) 

Maybe I am too nice or naive, but this just seems like bad professional behavior.  Am I right, or is it ok to do this?

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Lany, it's hard to say without knowing the nature of the meeting. I know that in our staff meetings, I would generally be on the side of bringing up discrepancies, although hopefully in a polite way that doesn't make it sound like someone is being called out. And I wouldn't necessarily expect to resolve it at the meeting, that would happen via a follow-up, but just to raise the issue so that there isn't a false sense of concurrence, if that makes sense. But I can also see how that would be undercutting, and especially for someone new I would expect to help ease them into their role instead of being challenging.

Sounds like you handled it perfectly and I would not dwell on it too much (easier said than done!).

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I agree with Starkess.  It's hard to judge without being there and knowing the tone, but it's not at all unreasonable to signal a possible discrepancy on the call and follow up afterward to check into it.  He may even have been slightly defensive in correcting downward the number of outstanding pieces if he thought you had overstated (he may be posting somewhere right now about the new woman who made him look bad by double counting the items he owed).  Subjective perspective is everything.  I can understand why you might feel self-conscious about how it made you look but unless there was more to it than described I wouldn't dwell on it at all. 

If you were well established in your role and not feeling over-worked and over-stressed, would you still have thought this was "bad professional behavior"?  I would guess it wouldn't have bothered you.  Most people are too busy to remember that the newbie might appreciate some extra consideration, or they might feel that everyone gets treated the same regardless of how new they are.  

I definitely wouldn't stew on it or spend extra effort to make sure everyone knows he was wrong.  That could look unprofessional.  (I had a colleague call me and try to brutally backstab a member of my team earlier this week, while pretending that she was giving helpful career development advice on her (my team member's) behalf, like she was doing everyone a huge favor.  I already knew about the incident, and we both knew my team member was not at fault, and told her flat out that I didn't appreciate her trying to undermine someone like that.) 

I'm glad your new role is going well though. Best of luck with a smooth completion on your first deal. 

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Agreed with Starkess and Isk. I would not see this as undermining -- the whole point of a progress meeting is to make sure those kinds of discrepancies don't propagate in the first place.

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One of my direct peers just announced he's leaving.  It's a real pity to have this kind of disruption in the senior leadership team.  But the impending reshuffle means I need to decide on what role I want to focus next.  

I can stay where I am -- leading a large team who make the high level investment decisions with our clients, move to another role more focused on developing new investment solutions/products (but no longer managing many/any people), or possibly step into the role of the departing  guy - leading the team that executes our investment products. 

I think this is the right point for me to move into one of the new roles to get more hands-on with building or executing  investment solutions rather than always working with clients on designing their portfolio.  But there are trade-offs, and no guarantee that I would get the third role. 

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Thanks.  I do agree, in general, and  I was overly sensitive that day. :P Also, as long as it isn't something that is an immediate threat to the deal (or whatever), I'd always refrain from criticizing someone in public. (but I do speak up in private).

The format of the meetings is such that really only the person running it talks with two small exceptions, when she asks for the due diligence update and the collateral update.  

Anyway, all is well, and I have finally finished with that deal yesterday, just in time to start a new deal next week.  Well, 3 deals actually. My deal has 3 pools, and each pool went to a different investor.  That means 3 times the work. My co-worker who has been there 13 years expressed her sincere sympathy, but she is handling 2 deals of her own. I will have a very busy couple of months, but should finish the first week of December.

I am helping to train the other 3 on our team, so that hopefully they can help us out. Although they have been part of the team much longer, they don't have the overall background and experience we do. (they worked on the collateral part previously)

Been an interesting 4 months, and going to get more so over the next few. 

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Women with shaved heads - Unprofessional looking? Yes or no?

I want to shave off my hair. I work and volunteer in a museum and am currently co leading school workshops. I have no tattoos or piercings and I dont want to be judged as unprofessional looking I just...really, really want to shave off my hair. My hair is so fine and ive tried to grow it out but it always looks better shorter. 

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I don't think it looks unprofessional, but people are going to stare and make comments -- and usually not in a good way. (speaking from experience, here.) It's up to you if you want to deal with that. I suggest getting a pixie cut, which can still be very short but still has enough hair to deflect attention from all but the biggest wankers.

Edited by Xray the Enforcer

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Ive had a pixie before and really liked it. I just fancied giving it a try. I honestly hate my hair and would quite like to be rid of it. I dont mind comments from strangers/friends/family. Well, I do. But not enough to deter me really, I was only worried about work. The museum is reasonably laid back and pretty cool though. 

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I guess winter is the best time to try it as you can always wear a cute hat if your employer has any issue with it, or if you don't actually like it yourself. 

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3 minutes ago, Isis said:

I guess winter is the best time to try it as you can always wear a cute hat if your employer has any issue with it, or if you don't actually like it yourself. 

That's what I was thinking haha :D

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I'm growing out my hair atm - only as long as an ear-length bob. But I feel like I have LOADS of hair and it still totally disappears under a hat - I may as well have no hair at all when I am wearing a hat.

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