The Fattest Leech Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 32 minutes ago, SerMixalot said: Why didn't Jon sleep with Melisandra and make a shadow baby? Could have killed Ramsey and saved his brother. He does have royal blood in him as, as far as anyone knows, he is the half brother of King Robb. And don't give me that he don't believe in Rholler stuff, She brought him back from the dead AND could have saved his brother. Seriously. It's not like tvJon ever thinks about or relates himself to being if the old gods. And, tvJon does like Mel's boobs by the way gaped slack jawed and caressed the last season. (she doesn't know she is 1,000 years old) And, Mel made sure Jon was not a virgin last season by just asking. So what's the problem here? Why haven't they done IT yet???? Clearly there are no limits on power, magic or flame retardancy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear42 Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 Every week I think, "this is the week it will all turn around and I can start enjoying this again," and every week I'm wrong. Jon falls for the most obvious bait/trap of all time and proves himself to be a horrendous leader who doesn't deserve any of the loyalty the rest of the characters keep showing towards him. What was he going to do other than get himself killed? If he doesn't care whether he lives or dies why would he bring 2000 people with him to die as well? No one in their right mind would follow him onto a battlefield again after that debacle. Sansa is probably the worst character on the show at this point, I said before this episode I would rather have her killed off than Ramsay. They all know they stand no chance against the Boltons with the army they have and she can't mention "Oh by the way I have a Vale army trump card that might be usefull." Even if they can't trust Littlefinger that is information that needs to be shared. She shows no interest in saving Rickon, clearly has no interest in Jon's well being, attempts to undermine the trust between Jon and Davos, and doesn't value the lives of the very few truly loyal northerners who rallied to her cause. This show used to be awesome because (for people who hadn't read the books) it was unpredictable. Ned Stark dies, Tywin shows up to save Kings Landing, Red Wedding, the Mountain kills the Viper after it looks like it's over, the army of the dead shows up out of nowhere and kick off an epic battle, but this was the most played out cliched resolution to a story arc you could've had. Of course the heavily foreshadowed Vail army bail out comes just as it looks like Jon's army is doomed. Who didn't see that coming? Why wouldn't you give the giant a tree or something to swing around? Where was Ghost? This is Ned's Stark's son and Robb Stark's brother? Guess the battle commander gene passed him by. They have clearly abandoned storytelling in favor of cinematography. The battle scene had great visuals and was fairly immersive but cost them so much money to make the rest of the season suffered. Why not go with the northern conspiracy story line? It's as made for TV as it gets. Have the two sides line up for a pitched battle, with the Boltons and Karstarks in the middle, and as soon as Ramsay gives the order to attack all the other houses turn inward and slaughter the traitors. Give the Ramsay kill to Smalljon, since the Umbers are famously loyal, and he could give some awesome one liner about the "north remembers" as he guts him and then lay down their arms for the Stark return to Winterfell. So much more budget friendly and more satisfying anyway. Or do something different, I don't care as long its not something that has been the obvious resolution for over half the season. I hate being so negative about a show I've enjoyed so much in the past but it has lost its way. Between the Arya garbage the last two episodes and the character assassination of Jon Snow I'm not sure which character I'm supposed to enjoy anymore? Maybe Gendry? Truth be told the Zombie Mountain is the only one whose scenes I look forward to anymore, just in hopes that he'll crush more sparrows. Plus he never gets stuck with the terrible dialogue we've been getting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Cygne Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 Yeah, Dany mind controlling three dragons, yet, as someone mentioned on the other thread, saying Dracarys. When did the mind control take place? And why does she have to tell them this one thing? Alternatively, they got their assignments in the dragon briefing room, they heard all the war plans and carefully studied their role. And she patted them on the backs and said, good luck, men! I'll give this command. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperMario Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 7 minutes ago, YOVMO said: I would buy that if winterfell fell to seige. Not really, but for a show fine. But what did they put up for a door? They knew it would come to war. although how well the boltons can do anything is up for debate. Littlefinger and 4000 Knights of the vale rose through 500 miles of Bolton controlled northland to show up for a battle against the boltons totally unmolested. Wouldn't Bronze Yohn maybe raise an eyebrow at riding through the entire north unimpeded considering Littlefinger told him he lost Sansa because the Boltons ambushed him while he was technically still in the Vale? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperMario Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 5 minutes ago, Le Cygne said: Yeah, Dany mind controlling three dragons, yet, as someone mentioned on the other thread, saying Dracarys. When did the mind control take place? And why does she have to tell them this one thing? And she said Dracarys with the decibel level of a basically a whisper. Apparently, three dragons can hear that over a war going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lockjaw of House Boltagon Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 I liked the episode a lot for the most part. The battle was hnnnng, corpse-wall and all, but my nits to pick are as follows: Rickon going to the Prometheus School of Running Theon and Yara not saving Dany's bacon and just showing up like sup, which offers further proof that Dany is playing the game in Easy Mode Tyrion's revisionist memory forgetting he was a bigger dick to Theon back in Winterfell Sansa earning the Doran Martell Award for keeping things waaay too close to the chest Jon forgetting that Melisandre exists after being presented with Rickon's body Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerMixalot Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 I was annoyed that the Bolton men did nothing when Ramsey ordered his bowman to fire on his own troops. I know that is standard villain fare and kin slaying and is all the rage this year, but I wish a northern lord had said, "Hey that is my brother out there leading your horsemen" and lopped off Ramsey's head Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaynsa Starne Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 6 hours ago, McBaine said: In Mereen: Yara:“Hey, Dany, you're super cool and I'd like to be a strong female ruler like you, because girl power and stuff.“ Dany:“Awesome, that's my plan too, but why not wait for the bigger fleet of your uncle? Yara:“Because he's totally a mean chauvinist pig and doesn't respect you and shows this by wanting to fuck you.“ Dany:“Yikes, okay, that seems reasonable, that's not really my cup of tea, I'm all about being respected. You will give me your ships just so I can burn your uncle and make you a warden? Yara:“Yep, but I'd fuck you too – in a totally respectful way of course, because I'm a woman and not a man, it is advisable to speak like that to a ruler. Then I will ask my brother if he thinks that is okay? Yes? Good then.“ Dany:“Awesome. Then I will quickly ask Tyrion if... oh, he nods his head, then it is decided! From now on we are empowered super besties forever! Before the battle in the War Tent: Sansa:“It's totally mean that you didn't ask my opinion about the battle. It didn't even occur to you you chauvinist! Jon:“Ok, you're right. What do you think about the battle plan? Sansa:“Battle plan?! How should I know? I know nothing about that stuff! But beware of Ramsey! Jon:“Err, yes, thanks for the good advice, but I fought worse than Ramsy.“ Sansa: „But not Ramsey, because, he's totally mean and a monster and plays his games...“ Jon:“Sansa, I fought against tireless ice zombies and their commanders – beings immune to normal weapons because the cold from their bodies makes even steel splinter and break in seconds! Ramsey is a sick and brutal lunatic, everyone except Littlefinger from here to Dorne knows this! I think Ramsey has a strong third place in the threat olympics, but he is not as dangerous as the army of the walking dead.“ Sansa:“But a battle is dumb! Rickon is as good as dead and we have not enough men!“ Jon:“We asked everywhere! Where else should we pull more more fighters from?! Sansa, by the old gods and the new, if you know of any other troops we can use, now is the right moment to tell me about it. Many lifes and the victory depends on this! Sansa:“I wrote to Littlefinger and he's on his way with an army of Vale Knights...“ Jon:“Did you say something?“ Sansa:“What? No, nothing“ Before the Battle: Ramsey lets Rickon go. Ramsey:“ Now my boy, run to your brother. I have a bow and will try to shoot you. Off you go.“ Rickon starts to sprint and thinks:“Okay, he is shooting arrows at me. Gotta get to Jon fast! Under all circumstances I have to run in a straight line – otherwise I will lose valuable time and it takes longer to reach Jon! Go in a straight line – get as much distance between yourself and Ramsey as possible. I can make it! I can make it and have some lines and a plot again! In a straight li... Argh! An arrow! How?! I sprinted so fast?! Why has only Arya inherited the healing powers of our ancestor Dire Wolverine Stark?!“ Ramsey:“Haha, great shot, I have to praise myself! I would have been screwed if he hadn't run in a straight line or I'd overestimated my aim. I didn't bring my hounds as backup and the Stark heir would have escaped. How embarassing and stupid would that have been?! XD“ ''I could kill the bastard Jon Snow while I'm at it. It wasn't my plan (?), but while he stands in an open field and is a unmoving target... Nah! I let my 20 good men do it. Go on and shoot the bastard, while I pat myself on the shoulder. You missed?! All of you? Well, you are better at sneaking and malicious arson.“ During the Battle: Jon:“Shit, we talked about a pincing maneuver, but now we are caught between slow marching Bolton soldiers in phalanx formation?! This wouldn't have happened if there wasn't a 40 feet high hill of corpses – out of the blue no less!“ ''Hey, there's Sansa. I think I'm the only one who is suprised that she got the Vale Knights to help her. Ice zombies Sansa! ICEZOMBIES! Would have been great if we had have fewer losses to fight against the supernatural undead threat from the north!“ Meanwhile Sansa sits on her horse next to a smirking Littlefinger and is proud of herself. Sansa:“I am so smart, S-M-R-T! A genius move. I did that all by myself.“ Sometimes I can't even... LMAO A strong third in the threat olympics.... Too perfect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maicao Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 Did they just killed Rickon without giving him any lines this season??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkerStar Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 6 hours ago, McBaine said: In Mereen: Yara:“Hey, Dany, you're super cool and I'd like to be a strong female ruler like you, because girl power and stuff.“ Dany:“Awesome, that's my plan too, but why not wait for the bigger fleet of your uncle? Yara:“Because he's totally a mean chauvinist pig and doesn't respect you and shows this by wanting to fuck you.“ Dany:“Yikes, okay, that seems reasonable, that's not really my cup of tea, I'm all about being respected. You will give me your ships just so I can burn your uncle and make you a warden? Yara:“Yep, but I'd fuck you too – in a totally respectful way of course, because I'm a woman and not a man, it is advisable to speak like that to a ruler. Then I will ask my brother if he thinks that is okay? Yes? Good then.“ Dany:“Awesome. Then I will quickly ask Tyrion if... oh, he nods his head, then it is decided! From now on we are empowered super besties forever! Before the battle in the War Tent: Sansa:“It's totally mean that you didn't ask my opinion about the battle. It didn't even occur to you you chauvinist! Jon:“Ok, you're right. What do you think about the battle plan? Sansa:“Battle plan?! How should I know? I know nothing about that stuff! But beware of Ramsey! Jon:“Err, yes, thanks for the good advice, but I fought worse than Ramsy.“ Sansa: „But not Ramsey, because, he's totally mean and a monster and plays his games...“ Jon:“Sansa, I fought against tireless ice zombies and their commanders – beings immune to normal weapons because the cold from their bodies makes even steel splinter and break in seconds! Ramsey is a sick and brutal lunatic, everyone except Littlefinger from here to Dorne knows this! I think Ramsey has a strong third place in the threat olympics, but he is not as dangerous as the army of the walking dead.“ Sansa:“But a battle is dumb! Rickon is as good as dead and we have not enough men!“ Jon:“We asked everywhere! Where else should we pull more more fighters from?! Sansa, by the old gods and the new, if you know of any other troops we can use, now is the right moment to tell me about it. Many lifes and the victory depends on this! Sansa:“I wrote to Littlefinger and he's on his way with an army of Vale Knights...“ Jon:“Did you say something?“ Sansa:“What? No, nothing“ Before the Battle: Ramsey lets Rickon go. Ramsey:“ Now my boy, run to your brother. I have a bow and will try to shoot you. Off you go.“ Rickon starts to sprint and thinks:“Okay, he is shooting arrows at me. Gotta get to Jon fast! Under all circumstances I have to run in a straight line – otherwise I will lose valuable time and it takes longer to reach Jon! Go in a straight line – get as much distance between yourself and Ramsey as possible. I can make it! I can make it and have some lines and a plot again! In a straight li... Argh! An arrow! How?! I sprinted so fast?! Why has only Arya inherited the healing powers of our ancestor Dire Wolverine Stark?!“ Ramsey:“Haha, great shot, I have to praise myself! I would have been screwed if he hadn't run in a straight line or I'd overestimated my aim. I didn't bring my hounds as backup and the Stark heir would have escaped. How embarassing and stupid would that have been?! XD“ ''I could kill the bastard Jon Snow while I'm at it. It wasn't my plan (?), but while he stands in an open field and is a unmoving target... Nah! I let my 20 good men do it. Go on and shoot the bastard, while I pat myself on the shoulder. You missed?! All of you? Well, you are better at sneaking and malicious arson.“ During the Battle: Jon:“Shit, we talked about a pincing maneuver, but now we are caught between slow marching Bolton soldiers in phalanx formation?! This wouldn't have happened if there wasn't a 40 feet high hill of corpses – out of the blue no less!“ ''Hey, there's Sansa. I think I'm the only one who is suprised that she got the Vale Knights to help her. Ice zombies Sansa! ICEZOMBIES! Would have been great if we had have fewer losses to fight against the supernatural undead threat from the north!“ Meanwhile Sansa sits on her horse next to a smirking Littlefinger and is proud of herself. Sansa:“I am so smart, S-M-R-T! A genius move. I did that all by myself.“ Sometimes I can't even... This right here. Every bit of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperMario Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 3 minutes ago, maicao said: Did they just killed Rickon without giving him any lines this season??? Yes. A guy who had warts on his cock had more lines than one of the remaining Starks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerMixalot Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 4 minutes ago, maicao said: Did they just killed Rickon without giving him any lines this season??? Yep, and they saved a lot of money on being able to pay the actor as a featured extra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nami Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 5 minutes ago, maicao said: Did they just killed Rickon without giving him any lines this season??? Rickon who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lockjaw of House Boltagon Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 5 minutes ago, SerMixalot said: Yep, and they saved a lot of money on being able to pay the actor as a featured extra A lot of money? He's Art Parkinson, not Scarlet Johansson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gargarax Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 29 pages already, wow. Got a lot of reading ahead of me. I get why, though. This might have been one of the worst episodes ever. Jon seems to have lost his brain back in his old life. Sansa will be the new Cersei, she's gotten so good at torture-speak. LF was there exactly when the plot demanded him. I guess he had watched The Return of the King and thought that Riders-of-Rohan thing would be kinda cool. Too bad Davos hadn't watched Braveheart, he would have had a nice deja-vu. But the Mereen stuff was even worse. Nothing about that battle made any sense. Emilia Clarke may not be the best actor, but look at what she is given to work with - she's basically been repeating the same lines for four seasons now. Only now she looks at Tyrion whenever she hears something interesting or is about to make an important decision. When he nods, she goes ahead. But well, the episode gets 10/10 ratings all over the place. I need some ice cream now. And a few hours of listening to the awesome unabashed booksnobbery podcast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masha's apron Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 What I am having a real problem with is that the thematic segments of the story are not being brought together at all. Perfect example is the parley with Ramsey. Here we have Jon Snow, Tormund, Davos and Sansa. Take a look at what those people know. They know that the white walkers are coming. They know the North needs to stand behind a non-psychotic warden of the north in order to have a chance of survival. They know how white walkers work and how they can be killed. Jon, himself, has been resurrected by the Lord of Light. Sansa knows what Ramsey is like, where his weaknesses are and what he wants. Yet they have this parley with Ramsey and none of this knowledge influences the exchange (and did not particularly influence the exchanges with the other Houses pledged to the Boltons). They don't even attempt to unnerve Ramsey or spread rumour through his attendants by mentioning the white walkers, or that Jon has been resurrected. They don't even attempt to charge Ramsey with being unable to protect the North through Winter. They play their weakest hand, which is that they want Winterfell back because it's Sansa's home and that they want Rickon. So, of course, the first thing Ramsey does is kill Rickon. Then we have Melisandre, a woman who once birthed shadow babies to kill kings. Somehow she now cannot do anything like this to torment Ramsey; she doesn't even try and no-one asks. Sansa theoretically has "King's blood" to use; her ancestors were once Kings in the North. Then there is the situation in Mereen. Theon and Asha have turned up, yet Danys makes a deal without knowing exactly what the current state of play is in Westeros or who this pair really are. Theon is a hive of information, yet Tyrion (who prides himself on knowing things) takes him to task for making dwarf jokes. Seemingly neither Theon nor Asha realise the one most precious thing they have to trade is more up-to-date information about Westeros. And then lets look at Kings Landing -- a place that seemingly has no idea of what is happening in the North nor across the sea with Danys and whom has a child king with no regent, no viable regency council, nor any foreign policy consideration at all, a boy who is now being directed by a religious cult leader whose sole concern seems to be picking off noble Houses. This absence is all the more strange considering that Robert Baratheon knew what was happening with Danys when he was alive. And some of the dropped plotlines are infuriating. What ever happened with the Iron Bank of Bravos and Stannis' debt and the Crown's debt? An interesting development would be for this to explain Arya's "escape" from the FM, that she hasn't "escaped", she's actually being used unknowingly as an agent of the FM who have accepted a contract from the IB and Arya's "list" somehow works to their advantage, but hey ... Again, the Crown itself is supposedly still in deep financial doo-doo and I thought that was part of the reasoning for the marriages to Marg -- to secure supplies from the Reach to Kings Landing. Yet, in this climate, we have the HS imprisoning Marg and Loras, and threatening Olenna, while Crown forces just stand by? Why has nobody said: "Erm, High Sparrow? If you piss off Olenna, there is a good chance we will all starve?" I am sorry, but the show is just unraveling. None of the decisions characters make seem to make sense, and when they do make sense, they are for really weak reasons. I mean, the masters invading Mereen by sea in wooden ships and staying on board when Danys has dragons that breathe fire? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rory Snow Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 I loved the episode but my one complaint.. where the hell was Ghost? Grey Wind went to battle with Robb repeatedly, no way Ghost couldn't have been an asset Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Louis II (KLII) Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 2 hours ago, SerMixalot said: Respectfully, since you asked a question and I am not debating. I think the issue is that Sansa, in show, pushed Jon to attack WF and then throughout the entire planning process for that attack withheld the fact that she had the Vale Army in her control and was on its way. That is the sign of someone who is betraying their family. compound that with her complaining that no one was listening to her and Jon was literally saying we need more men puts Sansa in a very bad light. I understand, and agree in some aspects actually. I was just think that to say that "she wants Jon to fail" or "to be the sole ruler of the north" it is a stretch. I also don't agree that she is a "Bitch" because of she is tough. But everything you said make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Loin Steak Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 6 hours ago, McBaine said: In Mereen: Yara:“Hey, Dany, you're super cool and I'd like to be a strong female ruler like you, because girl power and stuff.“ Dany:“Awesome, that's my plan too, but why not wait for the bigger fleet of your uncle? Yara:“Because he's totally a mean chauvinist pig and doesn't respect you and shows this by wanting to fuck you.“ Dany:“Yikes, okay, that seems reasonable, that's not really my cup of tea, I'm all about being respected. You will give me your ships just so I can burn your uncle and make you a warden? Yara:“Yep, but I'd fuck you too – in a totally respectful way of course, because I'm a woman and not a man, it is advisable to speak like that to a ruler. Then I will ask my brother if he thinks that is okay? Yes? Good then.“ Dany:“Awesome. Then I will quickly ask Tyrion if... oh, he nods his head, then it is decided! From now on we are empowered super besties forever! Before the battle in the War Tent: Sansa:“It's totally mean that you didn't ask my opinion about the battle. It didn't even occur to you you chauvinist! Jon:“Ok, you're right. What do you think about the battle plan? Sansa:“Battle plan?! How should I know? I know nothing about that stuff! But beware of Ramsey! Jon:“Err, yes, thanks for the good advice, but I fought worse than Ramsy.“ Sansa: „But not Ramsey, because, he's totally mean and a monster and plays his games...“ Jon:“Sansa, I fought against tireless ice zombies and their commanders – beings immune to normal weapons because the cold from their bodies makes even steel splinter and break in seconds! Ramsey is a sick and brutal lunatic, everyone except Littlefinger from here to Dorne knows this! I think Ramsey has a strong third place in the threat olympics, but he is not as dangerous as the army of the walking dead.“ Sansa:“But a battle is dumb! Rickon is as good as dead and we have not enough men!“ Jon:“We asked everywhere! Where else should we pull more more fighters from?! Sansa, by the old gods and the new, if you know of any other troops we can use, now is the right moment to tell me about it. Many lifes and the victory depends on this! Sansa:“I wrote to Littlefinger and he's on his way with an army of Vale Knights...“ Jon:“Did you say something?“ Sansa:“What? No, nothing“ Before the Battle: Ramsey lets Rickon go. Ramsey:“ Now my boy, run to your brother. I have a bow and will try to shoot you. Off you go.“ Rickon starts to sprint and thinks:“Okay, he is shooting arrows at me. Gotta get to Jon fast! Under all circumstances I have to run in a straight line – otherwise I will lose valuable time and it takes longer to reach Jon! Go in a straight line – get as much distance between yourself and Ramsey as possible. I can make it! I can make it and have some lines and a plot again! In a straight li... Argh! An arrow! How?! I sprinted so fast?! Why has only Arya inherited the healing powers of our ancestor Dire Wolverine Stark?!“ Ramsey:“Haha, great shot, I have to praise myself! I would have been screwed if he hadn't run in a straight line or I'd overestimated my aim. I didn't bring my hounds as backup and the Stark heir would have escaped. How embarassing and stupid would that have been?! XD“ ''I could kill the bastard Jon Snow while I'm at it. It wasn't my plan (?), but while he stands in an open field and is a unmoving target... Nah! I let my 20 good men do it. Go on and shoot the bastard, while I pat myself on the shoulder. You missed?! All of you? Well, you are better at sneaking and malicious arson.“ During the Battle: Jon:“Shit, we talked about a pincing maneuver, but now we are caught between slow marching Bolton soldiers in phalanx formation?! This wouldn't have happened if there wasn't a 40 feet high hill of corpses – out of the blue no less!“ ''Hey, there's Sansa. I think I'm the only one who is suprised that she got the Vale Knights to help her. Ice zombies Sansa! ICEZOMBIES! Would have been great if we had have fewer losses to fight against the supernatural undead threat from the north!“ Meanwhile Sansa sits on her horse next to a smirking Littlefinger and is proud of herself. Sansa:“I am so smart, S-M-R-T! A genius move. I did that all by myself.“ Great job with this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordToo-Fat-to-Sit-a-Horse Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 Is this the worst episode ever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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