(SPOILERS) Criticise Without Reprecussion

[Paxter Redwyne]

8 hours ago, Elisabetta Duò said:

Yes you're right, they are older in the show than in the books, but when they disappeared they were still childs, I think in the show they're still younger than Tommen and they were childs when they vanished (Bran was about 8-9 I guess and Rickon is even younger than him). You were considered a child until 12 yo in the medieval times in the UK, I think Westeros is more or less the same. People even claim Sansa should have been considered a child (and she was 14, so not a child in that kinda medieval universe), definitely Bran and Rickon would be.

That interaction with Bronn, the fact itself he had to ask Bronn, he had to know, shows he was concerned about it just because he doesn't approve of it (otherwise why would he ask? he wouldn't care) and the way he treated JSlint also shows that he's against child murder. Plus, I'm not sure Bronn said the truth (I think it was an half truth).

Of course the producers thought about that alleged murder, because they put it in the dialogue and made Tyrion expressly mention it to Theon.

Tyrion: " last time we saw each ohter was in Winterfell, yes? You were making jokes about my height I seem to recall …"

Theon: (not denying he was an as** but saying it was a long time ago like 'I'm not that man anymore'): "it was a long time ago"

Tyrion:  "and how have things being going for you since then? Not so well I gather.  I can't imagine you would have murdered the Stark boys if things had been going well".

Theon: "I didn't murder the Stark boys …"

If Tyrion didn't care, he wouldn't bring it up. 

He sees Theon after years and he takes advantage of his position as the adviser of the Queen to bring up what bothers him about the guy, aka the fact that Theon made jokes about him being a dwarf and the fact he murdered the Stark boys (as far as Tyrion knows).

Which is not weird imo, even if he's a Lannister and in his own way proud to be one; trying ot explain myself better, I don't think it's weird he was bothered by the fact Theon (allegedly) killed them because - even considering the show only:

- he obviously remembers Bran (he designed a saddle specifically for him after Jon asked him to help his brother and he gave the project to the boy himself) and he had sympathy for him because he was a cripple (so not unlike himself, an outcast);

- he and Jon, being both outcast and bonding at the Wall, called each other 'friend';

- he is against child murder;

- he didn't approve of Ned's murder by Jeoffrey, he didn't approve of Bran's attempted murder by Jeoffrey and he didn't approve of the red wedding and called Robb and Catelyn's murder a 'crime';

- he felt sorry for Sansa having her family murdered (and they are also still married, at least to his knowledge - and I think he's not wrong in the end, but that would be for another thread), he tried to comfort her and was bothered by that sharade about the Starks losing the war during Jeoffrey and Maergery's marriage feast; he had also suggested Tywin to trade Sansa for Jamie, tried to protect her from Jeoffrey, never asked anything from her and didn't 'force' her in any way;

- besides Sansa, Jon and Bran, to whom he felt more connected to for various reasons, he has always been as respectful of the Starks as he could be in his position, he basically treated them fairly as competitors/enemies he admired and respected (as I said, he thought Ned honorable, had his ashes sent to Catelyn, wanted to give back Ned's sword, didn't undestimate Robb's skills when talking with Tywin, etc.);

- nowadays, if he had to choose, I think - that's just my personal opinion, though - that he'd align himself with Sansa and Jon against Cersei, Lannister or not. Especially if Jamie changed sides as well thanks to Brienne or Cersei's unfaithfullness or for whatever reason, but maybe even without him.

That's just to explain I don't find it weird that he was bothered (I don't know if angered is the right word) by the fact Theon was - allegedly - the murderer of the Starks boys.

Btw, the 'missing brothers' tihng is (another…) thing that align Sansa with Elizabeth of York.

As I was saying, it would be nice if he and Theon had the chance to really talk to each other but I doubt there will be screen time enough for that.

But still it was Tyrion who insulted Theon, not other way. He should speak only about killing bran and rickon. 

Tyrion talk with Theon would be nice, but show do not give a fuck about motivations or logic so i doubt that it will happen.

[teemo]

18 hours ago, Survivor92 said:

D&D clearly liked the Red Wedding scene from the books (I believe it led them to start the show in the first place) but took this way too far. They seem to think that GRRM's modus operandi is that "everyone can die" and they've been trying to reproduce the shock of the RW ever since. However, unlike D&D, GRRM understands that the shock factor is something that has to be earned and killing off characters left and right is not something people like to read. For example, D&D's treatment of kin(g)slaying, especially this season, absolutely destroys the internal logic and consistency of the show. It seems that every episode, someone has to die which has caused my response to these deaths to always be the same "oh, whatever". A death isn't so shocking anymore when it happens all the time.

Plus D&D are sadly failing at making their shocks unpredictable. It's like the complete opposite. Who was really surprised by Rickon's death or the Vale army arriving at this point? Who honestly thought WunWun wouldn't be shot by Ramsay after he entered the gates?

So yeah, I agree with you that D&D don't give a damn about the characters and would happily kill off Ghost "for the shock effect". Next week, we're gonna see them try to reproduce the Red Wedding.

For being so obsessed about wanting to recreate the Red Wedding, they really fucked it up.  The Red Wedding was so powerful in the books partially because of the subtle (and not so subtle) foreshadowing and ominous feel surrounding the entire deal....Robb's relationship with Jeyne, the way Grey Wind acted,  it was just  so....creepy.  Almost horror-like, which makes sense considering GRRM has horror experience.  

In the show, they fucked up a LOT by replacing Jeyne with that idiot for one thing, and then there was absolutely no foreshadowing or anything until the doors shut.  It was also such a trope how Robb and that idiot stood there talking all mushy about how they were naming the baby Eddard a few minutes before she gets brutally stabbed in the stomach.  There was really no reason for any of that except for their pathetic attempt to pull at people's heartstrings.  In GRRM's world, it's more "realistic."  People don't usually get a chance to talk to their loved ones before they die....there aren't any final last words or romantic departures....in the show though, it's pretty common.  Personally, I think the inability to have cheesy final words is much more heartbreaking, but whatever.

There were a lot of other problems, but I haven't watched it in so long because it's just depressing for me.  

Gah, they couldn't even do the most epic scene in the books justice!  

[Neds Secret]

On 20 June 2016 at 9:01 PM, McBaine said:

In Mereen:

Yara:“Hey, Dany, you're super cool and I'd like to be a strong female ruler like you, because girl power and stuff.“

Dany:“Awesome, that's my plan too, but why not wait for the bigger fleet of your uncle?

Yara:“Because he's totally a mean chauvinist pig and doesn't respect you and shows this by wanting to fuck you.“

Dany:“Yikes, okay, that seems reasonable, that's not really my cup of tea, I'm all about being respected. You will give me your ships just so I can burn your uncle and make you a warden?

Yara:“Yep, but I'd fuck you too – in a totally respectful way of course, because I'm a woman and not a man, it is advisable to speak like that to a ruler. Then I will ask my brother if he thinks that is okay? Yes? Good then.“

Dany:“Awesome. Then I will quickly ask Tyrion if... oh, he nods his head, then it is decided! From now on we are empowered super besties forever!
 

Before the battle in the War Tent:

Sansa:“It's totally mean that you didn't ask my opinion about the battle. It didn't even occur to you you chauvinist!

Jon:“Ok, you're right. What do you think about the battle plan?

Sansa:“Battle plan?! How should I know? I know nothing about that stuff! But beware of Ramsey!

Jon:“Err, yes, thanks for the good advice, but I fought worse than Ramsy.“

Sansa: „But not Ramsey, because, he's totally mean and a monster and plays his games...“

Jon:“Sansa, I fought against tireless ice zombies and their commanders – beings immune to normal weapons because the cold from their bodies makes even steel splinter and break in seconds! Ramsey is a sick and brutal lunatic, everyone except Littlefinger from here to Dorne knows this! I think Ramsey has a strong third place in the threat olympics, but he is not as dangerous as the army of the walking dead.“

Sansa:“But a battle is dumb! Rickon is as good as dead and we have not enough men!“

Jon:“We asked everywhere! Where else should we pull more more fighters from?! Sansa, by the old gods and the new, if you know of any other troops we can use, now is the right moment to tell me about it. Many lifes and the victory depends on this!

Sansa:“I wrote to Littlefinger and he's on his way with an army of Vale Knights...“

Jon:“Did you say something?“

Sansa:“What? No, nothing“

 

Before the Battle:

Ramsey lets Rickon go.

Ramsey:“ Now my boy, run to your brother. I have a bow and will try to shoot you. Off you go.“

Rickon starts to sprint and thinks:“Okay, he is shooting arrows at me. Gotta get to Jon fast! Under all circumstances I have to run in a straight line – otherwise I will lose valuable time and it takes longer to reach Jon! Go in a straight line – get as much distance between yourself and Ramsey as possible. I can make it! I can make it and have some lines and a plot again! In a straight li... Argh! An arrow! How?! I sprinted so fast?! Why has only Arya inherited the healing powers of our ancestor Dire Wolverine Stark?!“
 

Ramsey:“Haha, great shot, I have to praise myself! I would have been screwed if he hadn't run in a straight line or I'd overestimated my aim. I didn't bring my hounds as backup and the Stark heir would have escaped. How embarassing and stupid would that have been?! XD“

''I could kill the bastard Jon Snow while I'm at it. It wasn't my plan (?), but while he stands in an open field and is a unmoving target... Nah! I let my 20 good men do it. Go on and shoot the bastard, while I pat myself on the shoulder. You missed?! All of you? Well, you are better at sneaking and malicious arson.“
 

During the Battle:

Jon:“Shit, we talked about a pincing maneuver, but now we are caught between slow marching Bolton soldiers in phalanx formation?! This wouldn't have happened if there wasn't a 40 feet high hill of corpses – out of the blue no less!“

''Hey, there's Sansa. I think I'm the only one who is suprised that she got the Vale Knights to help her. Ice zombies Sansa! ICEZOMBIES! Would have been great if we had have fewer losses to fight against the supernatural undead threat from the north!“

 

Meanwhile Sansa sits on her horse next to a smirking Littlefinger and is proud of herself.

Sansa:“I am so smart, S-M-R-T! A genius move. I did that all by myself.“

 

Sometimes I can't even...

Well done, that was superb!

[kissdbyfire]

31 minutes ago, teemo said:

For being so obsessed about wanting to recreate the Red Wedding, they really fucked it up.  The Red Wedding was so powerful in the books partially because of the subtle (and not so subtle) foreshadowing and ominous feel surrounding the entire deal....Robb's relationship with Jeyne, the way Grey Wind acted,  it was just  so....creepy.  Almost horror-like, which makes sense considering GRRM has horror experience.  

In the show, they fucked up a LOT by replacing Jeyne with that idiot for one thing, and then there was absolutely no foreshadowing or anything until the doors shut.  It was also such a trope how Robb and that idiot stood there talking all mushy about how they were naming the baby Eddard a few minutes before she gets brutally stabbed in the stomach.  There was really no reason for any of that except for their pathetic attempt to pull at people's heartstrings.  In GRRM's world, it's more "realistic."  People don't usually get a chance to talk to their loved ones before they die....there aren't any final last words or romantic departures....in the show though, it's pretty common.  Personally, I think the inability to have cheesy final words is much more heartbreaking, but whatever.

There were a lot of other problems, but I haven't watched it in so long because it's just depressing for me.  

Gah, they couldn't even do the most epic scene in the books justice!  

Agree. And speaking of final cheesy lines,  Jaime & Myrcella was so ridiculous on top of everything else! She knew she was a treasonous incest baby all along and she's totes kewl with it! And boom, dead.

[Ser Quork]

2 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Agree. And speaking of final cheesy lines,  Jaime & Myrcella was so ridiculous on top of everything else! She knew she was a treasonous incest baby all along and she's totes kewl with it! And boom, dead.

Actually, that was one of the most egregious concoctions of D$D - and demonstrates their incomprehension of the source material (not to mention the real-world prejudices it was based upon).

[teemo]

4 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Agree. And speaking of final cheesy lines,  Jaime & Myrcella was so ridiculous on top of everything else! She knew she was a treasonous incest baby all along and she's totes kewl with it! And boom, dead.

Haha, sounds awful.  I think I stopped watching the show before that happened.  

[Neds Secret]

On 21 June 2016 at 7:25 PM, Armand Gargalen said:

I said it last week and I will repeat it again. For me, the most disgusting part of the episode and of the direction the show has been taking the last couple of seasons is that they are completely reversing what IMHO is one of the key themes of ASOIAF: Revenge is pointless, people unnecessarily die for it and leaves a bitter taste in your mouth.

A lot of good posts here have pointed out how the writers, once again, went out of their way, defying the laws of logic and archery, to show us how EVIL Ramsey is, so we are supposed to enjoy him being killed by his own dogs. It does not matter that her dear brother Rickon just died, Sansa has every reason to be happy because she took revenge on Ramsey raping her.... puke... 

On the other hand, we have Jon making a heap of stupid mistakes, but plot armor and LF save the day and it is all good and dandy. Well, that is not how things work in real world or Martinverse. Rememeber Rhaergar: 

“Rhaegar fought valiantly, Rhaegar fought nobly, Rhaegar fought honorably. And Rhaegar died.”

The books gritty realism is there for a reason. If you fight honorably, you will lose and and your family, friends and allies will pay for it. Therefore, if you go to war, there are only two outcomes: you either die or you end up the winner but a worse person. 

By giving Jon such an easy victory despite he behaving as an utter useless commander just for the shock value of Sansa getting revenge on Ramsey is just the opposite of what I love about ASOIF. It is not the same story anymore, just garbage.

I agree, the essence of the story is totally lost, I am glad Jon is still alive but it's just through Plot Armor. The writers had Ramsay be Hawkeye, and a Spartan General and Napoleon level militiaty schemer and planner, ridiculous! Even as Jon was beating him to death he was still stoic and smiling and his bravery remained until his dogs were polite enough to wait for Sansa to stop talking and consume him, Realism? Bullshit realism, D$D would not know realism if it bit their throats like Ramsays hounds!

[Neds Secret]

On 21 June 2016 at 8:42 AM, massoir said:

Ive been lurking in the shadows like batman (except without the physique or the money) for a while now, but this travesty has finally brpught me into the light.

 

apologies if i go over anything thats already been mentioned:

 

where did the wall of bodies come from (300 spartans anyone?)

 

what is with the bolton pike testudo that surrounded them, now im no julius caesar, but once they had surrounded jon and co why didnt they slaughter them, they only moved like 3 foot once they'd set up!

 

sans-ugh - im sure she didnt care about rickon, because if he lived she wouldnt be lady of winterfell...

 

ghost like the snow round winterfell has disappeared.

 

mereen - what was with the 8 sons of the harpy, who were they killing outside the gates, why were they even out there???

nice to see that the sails of the yunkai warship was more flame retardant than the hull.

 

thats me done for now, im dreading next week

Welcome, and thank you for your honesty 

[Neds Secret]

On 21 June 2016 at 6:27 AM, Simon Steele said:

Oh yeah, you're a hundred percent right. Tormund would be bragging about his member to Davos, and Manderly would wander in and proclaim, "you know what they say, the fatter the hock, the meatier the...." well, something like that. Davos and Tormund might throw up their hands and look at the screen and say, "Lord Manderly!" So we knew who he was.

Nice, nice, it's like you walked straight out of a D$D scripting brainstorming session, that was right on point!

[kissdbyfire]

1 hour ago, teemo said:

Haha, sounds awful.  I think I stopped watching the show before that happened.  

Yeah, that was s 5. You're much smarter than I am, I only stopped now, after Summer's stupid as fuck death and the dumb Cats of the Forest/WW reveal.

[Neds Secret]

On 21 June 2016 at 6:38 AM, Xcorpyo001 said:

I’m starting to believe that most of the GoT reviewers I’m watching are being paid by HBO to say only positive things about the show. No one can be this blind.

I will not say much about Slaver’s Bay, it’s not even worth my time. They made only Bran a warg in the show, although most(if not all) Stark kids have this power, but made Dany one? Or they gave her some sort of psychic powers to control her dragons, although no other Targ before her could do such a thing?!? I think the director thought he was filming an X-Men scene. And she doesn’t even need a saddle to mount her dragon and not fall off from his back. Are we to assume that Drogon, whose head and neck are an amalgamation of spikes and ridges, has a built in leather saddle that Dany can occupy during her flight? No more unruly dragons, no saddles and or harness, no dragon training, no riders needed for the other dragons(what were those idiots during the Dance of Dragons war thinking when looking for riders for their extra dragons, they could just bring them alongside their own dragons). WTF?

Also, when Dany and notAsha clasped hands, I was half expecting one to shank the other or at least one should try to insert their fingers in the other’s ass, then smell it and…well, you know the rest. No continuity whatsoever.

And the North. Sansa is bitching about everything, and of course Jon has to become a suicidal moron so Sansa can have a “told you so” moment later. Who cares about his character development? Kill the child and let the man be born. Lol, better charge by yourself against a 6000 strong army to save a kid that has no chance of surviving. Of course, he could have sent Ghost to attack Ramsay and keep him busy while he was trying  to save Rickon, Or command Wun Wun to join him and act as a wall against enemy arrows, or tel Mel to do some hocus pocus to momentarily blind Ramsay, or maybe Rickon could just realise he’s dead anyway, be a headstrong Stark and die like a man, without running, or maybe strafe left or right during his run, or maybe try to fight Ramsay after he was released, or any other 1000 things. It would have been better if Ramsay would have made a mistake and look like a fool in front of his men, but nooo, a villain’s plan never fails, except when faced with a superior villain, aka LF.

I still don’t understand how Sansa is able to know so much about Ramsay’s battle tactics from his sexual habits? After all, it’s not like she was invited to the Bolton battle strategy sessions. And her complaining doesn’t make any sense. ‘You don’t listen to me?’ line is silly. She is pissed by the fact Jon doesn’t trust her enough to ask her opinion, when she’s holding back information as well, precisely because she doesn’t trust him, even if he never once show her any cause for concern. Well, she could have spoken, if she wanted to. I don’t think Jon told her to keep quiet during their battle panning talks. And when Jon says that he is listening to her, she tells him that she has nothing to say. Just that Ramsay is a trickster. Some examples could help, Sansa. As the information about the Vale troops could help as well. Even she wasn’t sure about it’s arrival, they could at least try to see what’s what.

If we had a subtitle with Ramsay’s thoughts when he saw the Vale troops, it would have been something like “So this is how the Starks felt like for the last six seasons. This really sucks. I almost pity them. Almost.”

But back on track. Sansa promised Jon the Blackfish and the Tully army. You know the Blackfish, her mother’s brother, as stated in her letter send to him. Honestly, adding the small direwolf head, it’s like the prop department joined D&D in having no more fucks to give about the show continuity. The show mentions the Manderlys several times. Missing. GNC. Missing. The Vale army camped at MC(Reed’s territory) for weeks/months. Howland Reed still missing. Brienne missing from the fight. Remember when Mel told Stannis that if she was in the battle at BWB, he would have won? Well, Jon didn’t said she couldn’t participate. And yet she does nothing. Dany can use a CGI Drogon as a pedestal to give a speech to the dothraki, but Jon can’t count on Ghost’s help in a life and death battle?

And in the parts after the show, when they said Jon acted like a Stark when he fell for such a obvious trap, one that even Sansa could have seen coming a mile away. WRONG. Ned never lost a battle, neither during the rebellion against the Targs, nor later during the Greyjoy rebellion.  Robb not only matched him, but obliterated any enemy in every military encounter. And he had Grey Wind at his side in every battle. He crushed Jaime’s siege at RR, or as Bronn would put it, fucked him up his ass so hard he couldn’t sit for months after. He then proceeded to outsmart Tywin fraking Lannister, by sacrificing some of his forces to win a decisive battle later. Only Edmure’s attack saved Tywin for a certain ultimate defeat. Later, he destroys a second Lannister army on their own turf, conquers some castles and mines in the Westerlands, and was ready to march on Lannisport itself, but was called back for the wedding. And Jon learned from the same guys Robb learned from. Granted, Robb could simply be a genius strategist, but Jon should not be a slouch either.

I might skip over Ghost’s absence, hell, I might even thank them for it, at least he’s still alive. But why nerf Wun Wun so much if they decided to use him in battle. Giants could use weapons several seasons ago. Remember that giant that could fire a bow and kill a guy on top of the Wall(with the angle, the distance should be around 800-1000 feet?) Neither does Wun Wun. So the king of the fraking giants has no weapon or a mammoth he can ride? But I guess that would mean he can stand a chance of winning or at least break the lines if he had a weapon, and it has to be a certain defeat in order for LF to save the day. And remember Jon teaching everybody to fight, and putting so much importance on the shields and how they are used in battle? Neither does he, nor the rest of his troops. No matter, his plot armour will protect him anyway. Grrr.

And the shield wall. O look, a slow moving enemy phalanx trying to surround us. I guess we have to stay around doing nothing until they do that, it’s only sporting to do so. And some idiots thinking they could stop Wun Wun with 3 spears pointed at him. If at least they didn’t give him a weapon, why not have him use all those bodies in that pile next to him as projectiles against the shield wall, making openings the wildlings or himself  could then exploit.

Ramsay has such a good aim that he can kill a running Rickon with a arrow through the heart. But he chooses not to kill Jon, a stationary target 1 meter away from Rickon’s dead body because…reasons.

And Wun Wun’s death. They enter the castle, Wun Wun is riddled with arrows and is about to die. Jon is on one of his side, Thormund on the other. Ramsay can kill any of them, but chooses to kill an already dying giant and not Jon because reasons. And no The last of the Giants song in the end credits. Remember when you still cared about that sort of stuff, D&D? That would have been an epic ending for this episode.

Ramsay then start shooting arrows at Jon, but not one of Jon’s archers decided that it should be a good idea to shoot back, because Ramsay decided he would fight Jon one on one. With a bow. Because reasons. At least Jon remembered that shields exist in this universe, so that’s that.

It takes Wun Wun a minute to destroy the gate, another minute to die, then a minute for Jon to kick Ramsay’s ass. But he stops because he sees Sansa looking at him. Since when is she part of the party charging the walls of Winterfell? No one in their right minds will let her enter WF until the castle would be secured and any all enemies accounted for.

Davos finds a wooden horse inside the remains of a huge pyre. So that off screen chat he and Mel had about Shireen’s fate the show apologists try to force feed us every time something doesn’t make sense didn’t happened huh? What a surprise! Not.The next morning they are ready to fight outside the walls of WF. So Stannis burned Shireen just so his troops could advance the last 300 meters?!? Hell, if he would have built a trebuchet in the middle of his camp, the projectiles fired by it could have reached the damn walls. WTF?

Jon’s actor said in the part after the episode that he stopped from killing Ramsay, defenceless at the time, because he didn’t want Sansa(who shouldn’t even be there at that point in time) to see him turn into a monster. Later, Sansa kills a defenceless man and leaves with a smirk because empowerment and BAB. Hmmm. I understand that she couldn’t hold hope that Rickon might survive, but she could at least show some pain for his loss and morn his passing. But she’s too damn busy getting her revenge. Sansa smirks while she watches Ramsay being devoured by his own men, but doesn’t kill LF and get control(or at least help from) of the Vale troops because reasons.  

And the scene with Ramsay entering WF and ordering his soldiers to close the gate. Everything behind him, trees, buildings, ground, are covered in snow. But 500 meters further, where the battle happened, we have green grass as long as the eye can see. These seasons in Westeros are really weird. Remember how the land looked like when Sansa escaped? With snow all around? Why is Jon afraid of snow storms, it seems all the snow is melting at a rapid pace. Is as if the winter not only came(during Stannis’ march), but is already over, and spring is on it’s way.

I think that it could be a way to make Sansa seem more empowered, get her revenge, and make Jon seem more capable and maintain his character development at the same time. But D&D could not be bothered to try and find a way to do it. So they fucked every single character in the north, all this starting from decision to have Sansa in the North, and get rid of Stannis so show Jon and show Fandra could be seen doing something. Gah, this is not a butterfly flapping his wings, this is a dinosaur stampede destroying everything in its path.

Thank god that we still have the book version. Even if the book series is never completed, I would rather write my own fanfic than have this show as a canon ending to this epic saga.

Brilliant summation mate! First rate and completely relevant criticisms and opinions, Bravo! 

[Liver and Onions]

Above summary is really awesome and on point.

I guess that Ramsey shooting Rickon and not Jon makes sense, though, since Ramsey is a horrible person. He is essentially being a big giant battlefield troll at that point. "Hah hah, killed yer brother!" But that's all I'm willing to give them. Nothing else makes sense. Being eaten by his own dogs was not satisfying enough. 

I hope Rickon survives the books to be King in the North/Lord of Winterfell/the Wild Wolf Lord whatever floats his boat. And that Theon feeds Ramsey to the dogs. Sansa is too busy organizing tournaments for that nonsense. 

I've been watching Showtime's The Tudors and The Borgias lately, and, while the shows aren't perfect, they're enjoyable and dramatically satisfying on many levels. 

[Red Tiger]

On 20-6-2016 at 9:25 PM, adamr said:

Behold: Jon's floppy sword.

http://imgur.com/w54N0Se

That is just sad. How embarassing. Painfully so.

[LadyDoom]

I masochistically went back to the books and re read the chapters where Jon advises Stannis about how to win the Northmen, how well he knows them, how many men they have, and best way to approach, not to mention how good he is at retorting Stannis. He did not earn my respects and love in the book for nothing. And it's just so painful to see Jon going "humm" and staring blankly in defeat at them this season. 

[kissdbyfire]

On 20 June 2016 at 4:25 PM, adamr said:

Behold: Jon's floppy sword.

http://imgur.com/w54N0Se

Perfect, totally GoT!

[kissdbyfire]

20 minutes ago, LadyDoom said:

I masochistically went back to the books and re read the chapters where Jon advises Stannis about how to win the Northmen, how well he knows them, how many men they have, and best way to approach, not to mention how good he is at retorting Stannis. He did not earn my respects and love in the book for nothing. And it's just so painful to see Jon going "humm" and staring blankly in defeat at them this season. 

Come on, give poor Emo Pup a break. He died and came back, and there was nothing after death I do wonder how can he remember nothing? If there's nothing, he gets stabbed and dies, and wakes up on that slab, end of story as far as his 'memories of the hereafter' can exist. But I digress... So, yeah, his experiences have left him deflated, depressed, and dumb.

[LadyDoom]

4 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Come on, give poor Emo Pup a break. He died and came back, and there was nothing after death I do wonder how can he remember nothing? If there's nothing, he gets stabbed and dies, and wakes up on that slab, end of story as far as his 'memories of the hereafter' can exist. But I digress... So, yeah, his experiences have left him deflated, depressed, and dumb.

You're right, poor emo pup, he just wants to go back to the nothingness of death (?) where the other half of his brain rests. 

maybe it's just a spell, just like dragons awoke magic everywhere in the books, maybe in the show it causes heavy brain cell loss in male characters with the possible side effect of reverting back to previous instances of themselves, emo season 1 Jon, lovesick Jaime, Tommen "I won't lift a finger as my mom is humiliated, I shouldn't have let them humiliate her, I should kill them all, I will let them further humiliate her and join them for... reasons" and causes female characters to merge personalities and become just one character cloned throughout the world, the vengeful boss ass bitch. 

 

[Lord Freypie]

About "Ramsay being a tactical genius"... Hum...

In their source of inspiration, Braveheart, the king send expendable infantry first (irish, mercenaries, etc...), then order his archers to fire at the melee. Then send his regular english infantry.

Ramsay send his most valuable troops first (the famous heavy cavalry Thormund was afraid of in the council, troops requiring long training and which can be key in future battles), and despite that cavalry having a large numeric advantage (as stated x times in the show Boltons are supposed to have more heavy cavalry than anyone in the north) decide to make his archers fire at them, turning a probable victory into a draw.

After such stupid sacrifice, I wonder why any infantryman obeyed him. If Ramsay was ready to make archers fire at his most valuable men, how can they expect he won't make them fire again once they join the melee ?

[Ruhail]

3 hours ago, LadyDoom said:

I masochistically went back to the books and re read the chapters where Jon advises Stannis about how to win the Northmen, how well he knows them, how many men they have, and best way to approach, not to mention how good he is at retorting Stannis. He did not earn my respects and love in the book for nothing. And it's just so painful to see Jon going "humm" and staring blankly in defeat at them this season. 

[Lord Syv Aldlark]

HahahahhHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH 10 MILLION DOLLARS AND EPISODE.

 

AND WE GET A FLOPPY SHIT SWORD HAHAHAHAAHAHAAHHAAHHAHAHHAHAHHAAHAHAH