Kalbear Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 3 hours ago, Hello World said: So what is the explanation for the dream on the circumfix with the monk and the priest and the what do you see? I don't think there is one. Quote A ridge, curved like a sleeping woman’s hip, against the night sky. And upon it two silhouettes, black against clouds of stars, impossibly bright. The figure of a man seated, shoulders crouched like an ape, legs crossed like a priest. And a tree with branches that swept up and out, forking across the bowl of the night. And about the Nail of Heaven, the stars revolved, like clouds hurried across winter skies. And Kellhus stared at the figure, stared at the tree, but he could not move. The firmament cycled, as though night after night passed without day. Framed by the wheeling heavens, the figure spoke, a million throats in his throat, a million mouths in his mouth… WHAT DO YOU SEE? The silhouette stood, hands clasped like a monk, legs bent like a beast. TELL ME… Whole worlds wailed in terror. The Warrior-Prophet awoke, his skin tingling against a dead woman’s cheek… More convulsions. Father!.What happens to me? I don't think there's anything in TGO to answer this or even give it more depth, other than Kellhus believing quite heavily that he is way beyond everyone and everything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baztek Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 What is the Eschaton? What happens in the other head on a pole scenes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 4 minutes ago, Baztek said: What is the Eschaton? What happens in the other head on a pole scenes? The Eschaton is mentioned in the Ish chapters and means the end of the divine plan or the end of the world. The No-God is mentioned as being the limit of the Eschaton and thus invisible to the Gods, as they cannot see anything beyond the divine plan. (I've mentioned this idea before - that the No-God was created outside of the causal frame of the world, but it sounds more like it was simply created outside God's plan). In any case, it is given as an example that the world has a clear end, and that because the No-God exists outside of that end it is invisible. I don't honestly remember what else happened in the other Head on the Pole scene. I think it was a similar refrain to what we already read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Seswatha Jordan Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 @Triskan, I seem to recall as Serwa is being led to the Nonman King, she also has some inner dialogue that the time for singing(mundane) is over. I could be wrong as I don't have the book anymore, but I seem to remember something along those lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Seswatha Jordan Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 Nevermind. I read your post wrong Kalbear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Seswatha Jordan Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 @lockesnow, you should post your theory on how it might've been the Nonmen who split the God. Good stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted July 3, 2016 Author Share Posted July 3, 2016 Something I thought was significant: Gilgaol showing Celmomas in his dying moments a vision of Kellhus and saying "Behold the end of the world." Celmomas, suffering from a concussion and imminent death as well as some kind of religious vision, misinterprets this and gives us the prophecy "An Anasurimbor will return at the end of the world". Which isn't quite the same thing: Gilgaol seems to be saying that Kellhus will bring about the end of the world, not just show up. Of course, being blind to the No-God means that they might have just perceived it wrongly, but it still feels like a significant. moment. Also any ideas on how Akka is seeing things from Nau-Cayuti and Celmomas's point-of-view. You can say that if causality is screwed and Nau-Cayuti is Seswatha's son, then Akka being able to access his memories through Seswatha's Heart is possible. But how on earth can he do it with Celmomas? Quote Also, I have to say now - the image of thousands of men ripping off their armor and clothing to go eat and fuck the sranc bodies was really absurdly funny. I had this weird idea of the riders or Rohan coming down the hill and proceeding to fuck various orc corpses to death while the lotr soundtrack swelled in the background. I didn't get the impression that the Ordeal was doing it en masse, just certain elements in isolation and those who did were put to death. I'm pretty sure Proyas didn't kill half the army for doing this. I'm still trying to work out how the nuke wiped out the Sranc Horde almost in its entirety but most of the Ordeal survived just fine, when the Horde stretched for miles upon miles to the north of the Urokkas and the Ordeal was mostly clustered on the peaks and between them and the shoreline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK. How do i get my hands on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Seswatha Jordan Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 @Werthead, I've put forth the idea that Anagke, Fate is who is guiding Akka's dreams. He is God entangled along with Kelmommas and Sorweel. It would take a God, who can see all of time to give Akka the visions he has been having since TJE. I thought it was clear that when Gilgoal showed Celmommas Kellhus, that he is the end of the 100's world, end of their domain/the Outside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Seswatha Jordan Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 5 minutes ago, Relic said: FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK. How do i get my hands on this? Heard tell they are already stocked at B&N. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Seswatha Jordan Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 The head on a pole behind you.....let's talk about it. 1. In the excerpt it does seem to be a mooring device, something to keep Kellhus's mind from being lost in the Outside. 2. When we have the next chapter where Proyas is basically getting the truth of Kellhus and Kellhus buggers him, Kellhus mentions the head on a pole behind him multiple times. So, it might not be entirely connected to the Outside. 3. Onkis, as many have said she is the goddess represented by a head on a pole. 4. Malowebi. We get a POV of him after his head is cut off. Also, Ptsama says that his destiny is to witness. Could he be a head on a pole? 5. Finally, as @Lockesnow pointed out, at one point when Sammy is trying to dissuade Kelmommas from following the WLW, he bites Kel on the neck. Is Sammy a head on a pole behind Kel? A lot of interesting ideas and ways it could go, love to hear your thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Seswatha Jordan Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 This from @LockeSnow: Much more importantly Quote They did hoist Anarlû’s head high, And poured down its blood as fire. And the ground gave forth many sons, Ninety nine who were as Gods, And so bid their fathers Be as sons… my interpretation:Cunoroi created the Hundred/The Gods --that's the great metaphysical whodunnit (we don't know the whydunnit yet)And just like how the NoGod made slaves of its consult father, the Gods made slaves of their Cunoroi fathers(where now are the dead fathers?,to quote TJE opener)So that is why the Gods are referred to as SONS throughout the text of TGO, they are the sons of the Cunoroi. and this is why we haven't gotten creation myths of the world because its the key to the metaphysical whodunnit.Perhaps this is also why the Nonmen seek oblivion, they're trying to hide from their mistake. and they don't want to destroy their greatest creation.Also, Anarlû is probably the nonman name for Onkis, would be my guess. the goddess of the darkness that comes before. Her head is on a pole. hmm...I'm guessing that Anarlu, she is the great creator of the universe. The Cunoroi hunted her down, killed her, cut off her head, and then created the 99 gods as described. The cunoroi then became the slaves, the bread, of their dread creation. So then. Do the Consult come to exact vengeance upon the fools who condemned the universe to damnation, to exact retribution about the fools who killed the great goddess creator of the universe?Did the Cunoroi do it because they wanted to raise up men above women. Thus SONS and FATHERS being the terminology used to describe the aftermath of their execution of Anarlu? Excellent stuff! Had to share it, hope you don't mind Locke.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Seswatha Jordan Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 12 minutes ago, Triskan said: Random question: what is up with the 99 stones and Koringhus? I have no idea. Is it related to the Gods? Did you notice that Koringhus gave the 100th stone to the boy? And he used it to hit Serwe the Skin-Spy to knock her off the cliff and escape? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted July 3, 2016 Author Share Posted July 3, 2016 4 hours ago, Michael Seswatha Jordan said: @Werthead, I've put forth the idea that Anagke, Fate is who is guiding Akka's dreams. He is God entangled along with Kelmommas and Sorweel. It would take a God, who can see all of time to give Akka the visions he has been having since TJE. I thought it was clear that when Gilgoal showed Celmommas Kellhus, that he is the end of the 100's world, end of their domain/the Outside. Interesting. But if the gods cannot perceive the No-God, how can the No-God be in Akka's visions from Anagke? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lokisnow Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 2 hours ago, Triskan said: Random question: what is up with the 99 stones and Koringhus? I have no idea. Is it related to the Gods? He uses one of the 99 stones to kill a yatwer affiliated bird, so I am guessing, yes it is related to the gods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 6 hours ago, Michael Seswatha Jordan said: Heard tell they are already stocked at B&N. im currently in Slovenia =( The only Barnes were are the ones for cows. Good bye thread, see you when the ebook comes out i guess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Seswatha Jordan Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 35 minutes ago, Werthead said: Interesting. But if the gods cannot perceive the No-God, how can the No-God be in Akka's visions from Anagke? Well Celmommas felt the presence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 5 hours ago, Relic said: FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK. How do i get my hands on this? With difficulty given your location. Probably best shot is to kindle it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baztek Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 So is it pretty much confirmed we went from a philosophical whodunnit to a literal whodunnit now? The One sundering didn't create reality? ayyy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 23 minutes ago, Baztek said: So is it pretty much confirmed we went from a philosophical whodunnit to a literal whodunnit now? The One sundering didn't create reality? ayyy I don't see how that would happen, as what creates the world? What sung the song of creation? The idiotic creationist viewpoint kind of makes sense here - if there is a creation there must be a creator. There are wanky religious ideas that could explain it, but the simplest is that God created everything and then split. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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