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Myrddin

Star Wars Rogue One: Now With Less Rouge

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Not having too much Vader is entirely the point - You want Vader's spectre to be there, more than Vader himself.

I agree that less is more on principle, but given the amount of time the reviewer says Vader is in the movie for, it seems like a waste, especially since this is probably the last movie we'll get to see Vader in. :( 

That said, I've heard nothing but great things about the scenes Vader is in, so it seems to make up for his "Nooooooooooooooooooooooo" moment in Revenge of the Sith. 

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6 hours ago, Stannis Eats No Peaches said:

Obviously I want this film to be great, but if it's just meh I won't really mind because it's not really "important". Episode VIII is a much bigger deal so my expectations will be much higher next year.

I'm going to I have to wait at least 2 weeks from now. :(

 

ETA:

 No spoilers within. He's harsher on it than the other two reviews I've seen.

I think this guy's review will probably have a lot of similarities with mine after I've seen it this weekend.

Of course, he seems negatively surprised by the fact that Vader has such a minute presence in this film but I was expecting something along these lines ever since I read the Kathleen Kennedy interview earlier this year, when we discussed here, how small his role would be. It seems it might possibly be even less than I thought, and I'll find that extremely unfortunate, so I hope the rest of the film will please. It's fair to say that if this guy is right in saying how much time Vader is in this film, for me it will be a massive missed opportunity, but one that I've seen coming.

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I fully expected Vader to have a minimal presence. I was re-watching the original this weekend, and I realized one thing I would like the movie to answer is how Leia's ship got all the way to Tatooine. So unless the planet where the plans are stolen from is in a nearby system, Vader would have to move at ludicrous speed from one planet to the other, so that makes me think we won't have a role in the final battle. I would also like to know how did Leia know about Obi-Wan. Since Bail Organa will be in the movie, maybe he will transmit something to Leia about contacting Obi-Wan. Or we will learn (maybe not in this movie) that Obi-Wan was more involved in the Rebellion that the old movies suggested.

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This clip (SW Rebels Season 1 spoilers) is more or less the reason why I'd want Vader to have a really brief role. The Rebels shouldn't be expecting him, and they shouldn't know what to expect, and when the time comes, it should be time to panic. 

ETA: I could even get on board with him only having one scene right at the end, where Vader's dispatched to clean up the mess. That would work too.

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Corvinus said:

I fully expected Vader to have a minimal presence. I was re-watching the original this weekend, and I realized one thing I would like the movie to answer is how Leia's ship got all the way to Tatooine. So unless the planet where the plans are stolen from is in a nearby system, Vader would have to move at ludicrous speed from one planet to the other, so that makes me think we won't have a role in the final battle. I would also like to know how did Leia know about Obi-Wan. Since Bail Organa will be in the movie, maybe he will transmit something to Leia about contacting Obi-Wan. Or we will learn (maybe not in this movie) that Obi-Wan was more involved in the Rebellion that the old movies suggested.

I guess it depends on where Vader left from, and where Leia's coming from, and where she's going to. Also, the plans were beamed to her ship, so they could theoretically have come from some distance. We've seen some pretty long distance communications in SW before.

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14 minutes ago, ab aeterno said:

I guess it depends on where Vader left from, and where Leia's coming from, and where she's going to. Also, the plans were beamed to her ship, so they could theoretically have come from some distance. We've seen some pretty long distance communications in SW before.

Yes, the beaming part will allow Leia to be anywhere. But the part about her knowing about Obi-Wan is the real mystery. And the tracking of the beaming would have to be done from the source, I would think, but maybe Vader doesn't need to be there, and he can be told.

Also, in the title crawl of the original, this battle in Rogue One is referred to as the Rebellion's first victory against the Empire. My guess is, considering all the stuff we've seen in Rebels, that this will count as the first major battle that was a victory for the Rebellion.

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I think the reviewer is really fair in pointing out from the outset that Star wars means a lot to him and therefore he will treat it differently to other films. Despite him being down on it for a good chunk of the review it still gets a "b" and I think a lot of his criticisms are ones most hardcore fans will probably experience if the film isn't utterly mind-blowing.

I can live with "not much Vader" if his scenes are excellent but it sounds like that's only true for one aspect.

Part of me is curious as to what the "amazing question fans have had" that gets resolved but I think I can wait 48 hours to find out for myself.

Still suspecting Han Solo to turn up even if just for a cameo.

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3 hours ago, Corvinus said:

Yes, the beaming part will allow Leia to be anywhere. But the part about her knowing about Obi-Wan is the real mystery. And the tracking of the beaming would have to be done from the source, I would think, but maybe Vader doesn't need to be there, and he can be told.

Also, in the title crawl of the original, this battle in Rogue One is referred to as the Rebellion's first victory against the Empire. My guess is, considering all the stuff we've seen in Rebels, that this will count as the first major battle that was a victory for the Rebellion.

I don't think it's that unreasonable that Bail would have mentioned Obi Wan at some point, after all, he only mentions him as someone who "served" him in the Clone Wars. Maybe it will be in Rogue One, but it doesn't feel like too much of a mystery to me.

I think it will likely be a victory at a high cost, which ties up with what a lot of reviews have mentioned about the tone at times.

1 hour ago, red snow said:

I think the reviewer is really fair in pointing out from the outset that Star wars means a lot to him and therefore he will treat it differently to other films. Despite him being down on it for a good chunk of the review it still gets a "b" and I think a lot of his criticisms are ones most hardcore fans will probably experience if the film isn't utterly mind-blowing.

I can live with "not much Vader" if his scenes are excellent but it sounds like that's only true for one aspect.

Part of me is curious as to what the "amazing question fans have had" that gets resolved but I think I can wait 48 hours to find out for myself.

Still suspecting Han Solo to turn up even if just for a cameo.

I fell into this trap with TFA at first. I enjoyed it, but I was coming at it from such a hardcore fan angle that I didn't enjoy it as much as I should have. Once I let go of that, and stopped worrying about how it "should" be, I enjoyed it more and more every time I rewatched it. If you focus too much on how you love Star Wars for what it is now, you won't be able to fully embrace something that changes what Star Wars is, which every new film will do. That is the path to the Dark Side.

I think it's likely to be the same with Rogue One. You must unlearn what you have learned. Accept that this is Star Wars now, and enjoy it for what it is, not what it isn't. That has been my approach, at least. :lol:  

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47 minutes ago, ab aeterno said:

I don't think it's that unreasonable that Bail would have mentioned Obi Wan at some point, after all, he only mentions him as someone who "served" him in the Clone Wars. Maybe it will be in Rogue One, but it doesn't feel like too much of a mystery to me.

I think it will likely be a victory at a high cost, which ties up with what a lot of reviews have mentioned about the tone at times.

I fell into this trap with TFA at first. I enjoyed it, but I was coming at it from such a hardcore fan angle that I didn't enjoy it as much as I should have. Once I let go of that, and stopped worrying about how it "should" be, I enjoyed it more and more every time I rewatched it. If you focus too much on how you love Star Wars for what it is now, you won't be able to fully embrace something that changes what Star Wars is, which every new film will do. That is the path to the Dark Side.

I think it's likely to be the same with Rogue One. You must unlearn what you have learned. Accept that this is Star Wars now, and enjoy it for what it is, not what it isn't. That has been my approach, at least. :lol:  

How can one choke on enjoy the Kool Aid when one's cup is already full? :P

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No plot spoilers, just general impressions. (I know some don't care to read even that so early. )

 

First half - good.

Second half - great

Vader - absolutely perfect!

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Everything I read/hear about this just makes it sound better. 

This piece (from Polygon's review) especially: (spoiler tags in case anyone is particularly sensitive, but nothing particularly spoilerish here, except for Vader's approximate screen time.)

Ben Mendelsohn’s Orson Krennic is also unlikely to make anybody’s list of most commanding or compelling Star Wars villains. But it makes a kind of sense that this story of the small heroes who’ve gone unsung in the Star Wars films until now would face an antagonist in the same position, dwarfed by the in-universe power and sheer mythic presence of characters like Darth Vader.

And Rogue One is a movie in which a nuclear holocaust (well, the Star Wars equivalent) is less harrowing to watch than 60 seconds of Darth Vader.

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Got back from seeing the film with Linda. We both enjoyed it. It's very much a genre piece -- war films like The Dirty Dozen or The Great of Escape -- and it's certainly well-constructed with some excellent set-pieces. It's not a deep film in any way, its characters are fairly lightly sketched, but all the actors are quite game to play their parts. It feels like, in this transmedia world, that we'll likely see comics or cartoons or books filling in details for some of the more popular new characters who all hint at having stories of their own. (In fact, I see one of the characters, Saw Gerrera, is actually from Star Wars: Clone Wars).

3 of 4 stars for me, I think. Would certainly be happy to watch it again. Donnie Yen and Alan Tudyk's characters were particularly fun, but all the cast did quite well. 

Spoiler

Bit of uncanny valley with Grand Moff Tarking, but I have to say it wasn't too distracting. Leia was much more obvious. 

I thought Vader was used pretty perfectly. Maybe could have done without his initial use, when Krennic goes to him to try and do an end-run around Tarkin, but that last 60 seconds really, really worked. When he shows up, the Rebels know the shit's hit the fan.

Really liked the production design, which (due to its proximity to ANH) meant that Rogue One was able to really pay exacting attention to how things looked in those films, especially with the depictions of various background characters hunched over displays which provide their primary lighting and so on. I've always liked Gareth Edwards -- his Monsters is a very good film which becomes amazing when you consider what he was able to do VFX-wise while on a shoe-string budget.

I do wonder what exactly was done by Tony Gilroy, of course. He allegedly reshot about 40% of the movie. The early reports were that Edwards's initial film was too "grim" for Disney/Lucasfilm, and he worked to lighten things a bit, but still, it's relatively dark.

 

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10 minutes ago, ab aeterno said:

There's a tie in novel already that fills in Jyn's childhood and the backstory of the Erso family.

Google tells me there'll be a novel about Baze Mablus and Chirrut Îmwe next year, written by Greg Rucka. Just need something for Cassian Andor and/or K-2SO.

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1 hour ago, Ran said:

Got back from seeing the film with Linda. We both enjoyed it. It's very much a genre piece -- war films like The Dirty Dozen or The Great of Escape -- and it's certainly well-constructed with some excellent set-pieces. It's not a deep film in any way, its characters are fairly lightly sketched, but all the actors are quite game to play their parts. It feels like, in this transmedia world, that we'll likely see comics or cartoons or books filling in details for some of the more popular new characters who all hint at having stories of their own. (In fact, I see one of the characters, Saw Gerrera, is actually from Star Wars: Clone Wars).

3 of 4 stars for me, I think. Would certainly be happy to watch it again. Donnie Yen and Alan Tudyk's characters were particularly fun, but all the cast did quite well. 

1 hour ago, Ran said:

Got back from seeing the film with Linda. We both enjoyed it. It's very much a genre piece -- war films like The Dirty Dozen or The Great of Escape -- and it's certainly well-constructed with some excellent set-pieces. It's not a deep film in any way, its characters are fairly lightly sketched, but all the actors are quite game to play their parts. It feels like, in this transmedia world, that we'll likely see comics or cartoons or books filling in details for some of the more popular new characters who all hint at having stories of their own. (In fact, I see one of the characters, Saw Gerrera, is actually from Star Wars: Clone Wars).

3 of 4 stars for me, I think. Would certainly be happy to watch it again. Donnie Yen and Alan Tudyk's characters were particularly fun, but all the cast did quite well. 

  Reveal hidden contents

Bit of uncanny valley with Grand Moff Tarking, but I have to say it wasn't too distracting. Leia was much more obvious. 

I thought Vader was used pretty perfectly. Maybe could have done without his initial use, when Krennic goes to him to try and do an end-run around Tarkin, but that last 60 seconds really, really worked. When he shows up, the Rebels know the shit's hit the fan.

Really liked the production design, which (due to its proximity to ANH) meant that Rogue One was able to really pay exacting attention to how things looked in those films, especially with the depictions of various background characters hunched over displays which provide their primary lighting and so on. I've always liked Gareth Edwards -- his Monsters is a very good film which becomes amazing when you consider what he was able to do VFX-wise while on a shoe-string budget.

I do wonder what exactly was done by Tony Gilroy, of course. He allegedly reshot about 40% of the movie. The early reports were that Edwards's initial film was too "grim" for Disney/Lucasfilm, and he worked to lighten things a bit, but still, it's relatively dark.

 

 

Agree with this B) 

 

So for those who have watched and want to discuss :

what was the name of the base planet vader was on where krennick visited him? 

Seeing ponda baba and dr Everson was wonderful and r2 and 3po. I didn't spot ghost (ship from the Rebels cartoon series) or mention of any of the characters from the show. I've seen screen shots of what could be ghost though. Can anyone confirm?

Yeh tarkin and Leia looked odd but didn't distract too much.

 

Omg vader at the end. My favorite part of the whole thing

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On Tarkin...

 

I was a bit put off by having a CG character interacting with real actors. But my wife didn't realise he was CG, :laugh:

[/spoiler]

On X-Wings

Spoiler

it was cool seeing Red Leader and Gold Leader again. May have been others. Were Biggs and Wedge around? I didn't notice but will try and look more closely when I see it again. 

 

 

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Spoiler fail :-D

Sooo what's up with this conspiracy theory about there being subliminal anti-Trump messages in Rogue One, and that the final scene was reshot to be anti-Trump?

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Yeah... I've spent the past 6 minutes trying to fix it. But the board isn't behaving itself on mobile. :)

It's still not quite there, but at least everything that needs to be hidden is. :P

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