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OtherFromAnotherMother

Perfumed Seneschal

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9 hours ago, OtherFromAnotherMother said:

But how would Jorah fit the description of perfumed seneschal?

He doesn't, but he was on the perfumed seneshal (the ship's name is perfumed seneschal). Moqorro or Tyrion don't fit the description either.

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27 minutes ago, Balerion's Whiskers said:

I think it is Reznak mo Reznak or Varys, but for the reasons that LM states above, I'm leaning toward Reznak, although we do know that Varys is on Team fAegon and chances are, that may prove troublesome for Dany at some point. GRRM likes to give us fake leads and clues and that's what I think the Selaesori Qhoran is.

I don't think it is Varys. Dany doesn't know Varys. I suppose she could know OF him through Jorah and Selmy, but she has never been around him to know that he is perfumed. 

"Beware the perfumed seneschal." It's someone she already knows.

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3 minutes ago, Balerion's Whiskers said:

I think it is Reznak mo Reznak or Varys, but for the reasons that LM states above, I'm leaning toward Reznak, although we do know that Varys is on Team fAegon and chances are, that may prove troublesome for Dany at some point. GRRM likes to give us fake leads and clues and that's what I think the Selaesori Qhoran is.

I agree. The Selaesori Qhoran is a red herring. The ship doesn't make it, and dark flame joins kraken, and lion continues on to Slaver's Bay, arriving around the same time as the sun's son. 

However, notice that dark flame provides the translation, "Qhoran is ... not a ruler, but one who serves and counsels such, and helps conduct his business. You of Westeros might say steward or magister." Emphasis added, Tyrion VIII, Dance 33

Of course, "Beware the perfumed magister," would be a bit too obvious, no?

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1 hour ago, OtherFromAnotherMother said:

Thanks LM. 

I had always thought it was Reznak as well but was always bothered by how obvious it seemed. It's the first person Dany thinks of, way too easy. 

I think it's Illyrio. 

I agree but don't discount Reznak mo Wynstumuch entirely just because Daenerys thinks it's Reznak. She was right about the sun's son, no?

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Lets assume it is the ship.

We have excluded Tyrion and Moqorro.

Jorah would be kinda pointless since she knows not to trust him.

Who else do we have that was on ship and that very likely might be near Daenerys in future? Penny.

What I never understood is why she was on Selaesori Qhoran in the first place? I mean widow of waterfront sent her but why? Does she need to spy on Daenerys? Kill her? Why would widow like slavery to be abolished, she is slaver herself (yes, she might feel so e sympathy for slaves but that doesnt change the fact that her present and future depend on slaves).

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8 hours ago, dariopatke said:

Lets assume it is the ship.

We have excluded Tyrion and Moqorro.

Jorah would be kinda pointless since she knows not to trust him.

Who else do we have that was on ship and that very likely might be near Daenerys in future? Penny.

What I never understood is why she was on Selaesori Qhoran in the first place? I mean widow of waterfront sent her but why? Does she need to spy on Daenerys? Kill her? Why would widow like slavery to be abolished, she is slaver herself (yes, she might feel so e sympathy for slaves but that doesnt change the fact that her present and future depend on slaves).

I think if the widow wants daenerys to be killed,(which is unlikely IMHO) she has  better options than Penny. Penny isn't really a killer, ok she tried to kill Tyrion but we know how that went...

Daenerys is bigger and probably stronger than penny not to mention that she has a dragon and a shitload of loyal soldiers/guardsmen around her at the time when penny met the Widow of the waterfront.

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Just now, Bironic said:

I think if the widow wants daenerys to be killed,(which is unlikely IMHO) she has  better options than Penny. Penny isn't really a killer, ok she tried to kill Tyrion but we know how that went...

Daenerys is bigger and probably stronger than penny not to mention that she has a dragon and a shitload of loyal soldiers/guardsmen around her at the time when penny met the Widow of the waterfront.

I am just saying that maybe she was on a mission that has goal to harm Daenerys.Widow has no reason to back her and Penny has no reason to be on that ship. I do not know what is happening and I do not have idea, but something is suspicious there.

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11 minutes ago, dariopatke said:

Lets assume it is the ship.

We have excluded Tyrion and Moqorro.

Jorah would be kinda pointless since she knows not to trust him.

Who else do we have that was on ship and that very likely might be near Daenerys in future? Penny.

What I never understood is why she was on Selaesori Qhoran in the first place? I mean widow of waterfront sent her but why? Does she need to spy on Daenerys? Kill her? Why would widow like slavery to be abolished, she is slaver herself (yes, she might feel so e sympathy for slaves but that doesnt change the fact that her present and future depend on slaves).

The widow is a former slave who continues her deceased husband's ship insurance trade. I don't recall her being a slaver. In fact she seems to want Daenerys to come and free the slaves of Volantis. I am not entirely what the point of Penny is either. Other than to put Tyrion in Daznak's Pit. 

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3 minutes ago, dariopatke said:

I am just saying that maybe she was on a mission that has goal to harm Daenerys.Widow has no reason to back her and Penny has no reason to be on that ship. I do not know what is happening and I do not have idea, but something is suspicious there.

Umm, see my post above about the widow.

Edited by Lost Melnibonean

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6 minutes ago, Bironic said:

I think if the widow wants daenerys to be killed,(which is unlikely IMHO) she has  better options than Penny. Penny isn't really a killer, ok she tried to kill Tyrion but we know how that went...

Daenerys is bigger and probably stronger than penny not to mention that she has a dragon and a shitload of loyal soldiers/guardsmen around her at the time when penny met the Widow of the waterfront.

I have seen a bit of crackpot about Penny being a faceless man. 

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17 minutes ago, dariopatke said:

I am just saying that maybe she was on a mission that has goal to harm Daenerys.Widow has no reason to back her and Penny has no reason to be on that ship. I do not know what is happening and I do not have idea, but something is suspicious there.

If the widow wants to harm Daenerys, which is unlikely because of what Lost melnibonean said about her in the quote below, why should she send Penny? She does not even know her!

The widow is rich enough to put a bounty on Daenerys head, hire a real assassin, or support the Anti-Daenerys coalition with ships, money and sellswords. No need to send mummers/dwarf women.

16 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

The widow is a former slave who continues her deceased husband's ship insurance trade. I don't recall her being a slaver. In fact she seems to want Daenerys to come and free the slaves of Volantis. I am not entirely what the point of Penny is either. Other than to put Tyrion in Daznak's Pit. 


Agree with the above.

13 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

I have seen a bit of crackpot about Penny being a faceless man. 

Can faceless men change their body size as well as their face? Or are there growth-restricted FM?

Seriously everybody is a FM in some crackpot theory...

7 minutes ago, maegiithefrog said:

It's the dragon peppers. Definitely beware of those dragon peppers.

This on the other hand sounds perfectly reasonable.:D

Edited by Bironic

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The SElaesori Qhoran is a Red Herring designed o hide a clue  to the true Perfumed Seneschal.


 

Quote

 

Tell me, was Selaesori Qhoran a triarch or a turtle?”

The red priest chuckled. “Neither. Qhoran is … not a ruler, but one who serves and counsels such, and helps conduct his business. You of Westeros might say steward or magister.”

King’s Hand? That amused him. “And selaesori?”

Moqorro touched his nose. “Imbued with a pleasant aroma. Fragrant, would you say? Flowery?”

“So Selaesori Qhoran means Stinky Steward, more or less?”

Fragrant Steward, rather.”

 

 

Its Illyrio Mopatis. We know he has been backstabbing Dany from the start.

Edited by LordToo-Fat-to-Sit-a-Horse

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19 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

The widow is a former slave who continues her deceased husband's ship insurance trade. I don't recall her being a slaver. In fact she seems to want Daenerys to come and free the slaves of Volantis. I am not entirely what the point of Penny is either. Other than to put Tyrion in Daznak's Pit. 

So you think she has no slaves at all and she can without any problem continue bussoness as usual if slavery is abolished? Lets be generous and assume it will happen, but people around her arent gonna be that lucky, Volantis will eurupt into chaos if slavery is abolished and she, woman who lives from counting how big risk is and what reward can she get from risking, just doesnt seem like someone who would think everything will be great and people will be happy and everyone will live long and peaceful live with husband/wife and many many healthy children.

I do not say if there is so ething more ti her story, all I am saying is that some thing are not clear there.

9 minutes ago, Bironic said:

If the widow wants to harm Daenerys, which is unlikely because of what Lost melnibonean said about her in the quote below, why should she send Penny? She does not even know her!

The widow is rich enough to put a bounty on Daenerys head, hire a real assassin, or support the Anti-Daenerys coalition with ships, money and sellswords. No need to send mummers/dwarf women.

Can faceless men change their body size as well as their face? Or are there growth-restricted FM?

Seriously everybody is a FM in some crackpot theory...

But why would she give her wine and clothes? She tried to kill a man under her roof, see how it went for Sam for far lesser form of agression. Why would she get to drink and clothes for free?

What makes you think she didnt do some of those things? We have absolutely no proof that she isnt in slaver coalition. I did not claim she is suppoused to kill Daenerys, only to harm her or her cause somehow since it is likely she will eventually come in her proximity, and if not... well she lost a cup of wine, some clothes and a ship ticket.

Those FM thoeries always crack me up, when I hear someone is FM I usually think about one minute about it and dozen reasons that make it impossible come on my mind.

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15 minutes ago, LordToo-Fat-to-Sit-a-Horse said:

The SElaesori Qhoran is a Red Herring designed o hide a clue  to the true Perfumed Seneschal.


 

 

Its Illyrio Mopatis. We know he has been backstabbing Dany from the start.

Well put. As usual. 

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15 minutes ago, LordToo-Fat-to-Sit-a-Horse said:

The SElaesori Qhoran is a Red Herring designed o hide a clue  to the true Perfumed Seneschal.


 

 

Its Illyrio Mopatis. We know he has been backstabbing Dany from the start.

Agreed. Getting fAegon on the Iron Throne was his end-game from the beginning. Dany has foiled his plans (for her doom) several times without even knowing it. :)

Edited by maegiithefrog

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57 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

I agree but don't discount Reznak mo Wynstumuch entirely just because Daenerys thinks it's Reznak. She was right about the sun's son, no?

She didn't figure out the sun's son until she met Quentyn.

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14 minutes ago, dariopatke said:

So you think she has no slaves at all and she can without any problem continue bussoness as usual if slavery is abolished? Lets be generous and assume it will happen, but people around her arent gonna be that lucky, Volantis will eurupt into chaos if slavery is abolished and she, woman who lives from counting how big risk is and what reward can she get from risking, just doesnt seem like someone who would think everything will be great and people will be happy and everyone will live long and peaceful live with husband/wife and many many healthy children.

I do not say if there is so ething more ti her story, all I am saying is that some thing are not clear there.

But why would she give her wine and clothes? She tried to kill a man under her roof, see how it went for Sam for far lesser form of agression. Why would she get to drink and clothes for free?

What makes you think she didnt do some of those things? We have absolutely no proof that she isnt in slaver coalition. I did not claim she is suppoused to kill Daenerys, only to harm her or her cause somehow since it is likely she will eventually come in her proximity, and if not... well she lost a cup of wine, some clothes and a ship ticket.

Those FM thoeries always crack me up, when I hear someone is FM I usually think about one minute about it and dozen reasons that make it impossible come on my mind.

I was trying to help you out with your theory that the widow sent a young female dwarf to assassinate the Mother of Dragons. 

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1 minute ago, OtherFromAnotherMother said:

She didn't figure out the sun's son until she met Quentyn.

I wonder if she'll figure out kraken, dark flame, and lion. 

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1 hour ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

I agree. The Selaesori Qhoran is a red herring. The ship doesn't make it, and dark flame joins kraken, and lion continues on to Slaver's Bay, arriving around the same time as the sun's son. 

However, notice that dark flame provides the translation, "Qhoran is ... not a ruler, but one who serves and counsels such, and helps conduct his business. You of Westeros might say steward or magister." Emphasis added, Tyrion VIII, Dance 33

Of course, "Beware the perfumed magister," would be a bit too obvious, no?

Illyrio 

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