Rant and Rave without Repercussions [S7 Leaks Edition]

[Bear Claw]

4 hours ago, Suzanna Stormborn said:

Can we all agree that given how D&D are all about giving the fans what they want this is how it will play about with Jon and Dany; 

1. HE gets there and she is mean, they hate each other

2. They have dinner, (Dany will not wear her Bavmorda Battle Gown......remember in the books when Dany always cared about what she was wearing, and always hated uncomfortable unnecessary clothes?) start the dinner off hating each other and bitching back and forth, by the end of dinner there is massive sexual tension

3. Get naked.

Yes, almost all of the  romances on the show are like Sam and Diane from Cheers. 

[LucyMormont]

41 minutes ago, Tijgy said:

And what is wrong with choosing for staying at home and taking care for the children? People should indeed be able to chose who they are. And no matter, if they are woman or man, they should also be able to chose for such life. It is only a problem if they are forced to make such choice. 

The article actually even says GOT does show one side of feminism: the fact that women can also have the traditional masculine traits. And it actually does celebrate them. 

The issue with GOT is that it doesn't celebrate women or men with traditional feminine traits, like empathy, motherhood, ... things I actually admire much more than blood and destruction.  

This!

I hate that their idea of "empowering women" is to give them tradicional masculine characteristics...Never the traits of an Empress Theodora or an Elizabeth of Castile, but rather of a Countess Bathory are what they prefer.

 

[Le Cygne]

42 minutes ago, Horse of Kent said:

That D&D's opinion of traditionally femininity is pretty low is revealed by the stripping of all those elements from two of the sympathetic 'badass' women - Arya and Brienne. Instead of the well rounded book characters they are flattened out almost into wannabe men, and the former is given lines disparaging feminine girls (in sharp contrast to book-Arya who deeply respects and envies those who have those skills).

Agreed. I gave up on both of them, and I liked them in the books. What flat scenes with Hot Pie and Nymeria, what lost opportunities. Going for cutesy plays on lines instead of just letting her seem real for a change. The last time she seemed real was hiding Needle, and then they ruined it on the outside the episode by making it about revenge instead of Jon Snow's smile.

[Stubby]

[MOD]

Again, this thread is not a debate forum.

Rant as much as you want, but do not try and change people's minds or debate points.  There are other threads for that.

[/MOD]

[sagaz]

1 hour ago, Tijgy said:

And I actually really dislike to hear a Mormont Lady say this. They are just the example  in the books that both male and female traits could get hand in hand: the woman in a bear skin on the gate with a child chucking in one hand and a battleaxe in the other, Dacey being one of Robb's guards and being a graceful dancer at the same time, Aly being a commander and a mother at the same time, ... They show to defend your people and to take of your children are of equal importance. 

And I miss this, the celebration of both sides, in the show. 

1 hour ago, Horse of Kent said:

That D&D's opinion of traditionally femininity is pretty low is revealed by the stripping of all those elements from two of the sympathetic 'badass' women - Arya and Brienne. Instead of the well rounded book characters they are flattened out almost into wannabe men, and the former is given lines disparaging feminine girls (in sharp contrast to book-Arya who deeply respects and envies those who have those skills).

Don't make me start with Asha/Yara.

She's the leader of very tough men but in her intimate, private moments is very feminine, starting with the relationship with Qarl (a pretty boy!), Tristifer's place in her life, her anxieties and preocupations.

Luckily (?) this sister of Theon never got to the show, they went with another.

 

[Suzanna Stormborn]

I have a big problem with the poor Captain-ing of Yara/Asha. And the whole Ironborn scene

1. She was below deck with no lookouts

2. Even when she came on deck her and THeon just stood there watching Euron board them, like shoulder to shoulder not moving

Captain Jack is literally better than them, him and Barbosa are constantly shouting orders every time an enemy ship gets near. Yara never shouted even 1 order.

3. even without lookouts, how did they get rammed without seeing an entire GD fleet approaching?

4. Where were those fireballs coming from?

5. Did Euron take an arrow in the neck and walk it off?

6. Theon jumping overboard made me LOL

7. My guess is that there were many many chapters in the books devoted to Dorne which were squashed down into one stupid scene where 3 daughters and Ellaria were killed.

8. I thought Euron was going out to get Cersei a 'Great Gift', is that supposed to be Yara? Dont think Carol gaf about her.

9. Wondering if the Unsullied Fleet went the same way? Was behind Yara's Ironborn Fleet or what? Why didnt they just march?

10. In the books I would say this does not bode well for Victarion or the Dornish

[Cas Stark]

I think in terms of the books, that once the show killed Doran, when you add in no Arianne, killing the rest of the Martell family and now killing the sand snakes and probably Ellaria as well, plus the show saying they had intended to omit Dorne from the show altogether....that Dorne is going to be just as much of a dead end as I always thought, even Aegon, which is a shame.

Victarian I think has always been on borrowed time, he's Quentyn II....only Euron is going to have some staying power and affect on the main plot.

[Suzanna Stormborn]

22 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

I think in terms of the books, that once the show killed Doran, when you add in no Arianne, killing the rest of the Martell family and now killing the sand snakes and probably Ellaria as well, plus the show saying they had intended to omit Dorne from the show altogether....that Dorne is going to be just as much of a dead end as I always thought, even Aegon, which is a shame.

Victarian I think has always been on borrowed time, he's Quentyn II....only Euron is going to have some staying power and affect on the main plot.

I'm wondering if on the show, killing off the leading family of Dorne = killing off all of its citizens?

Like there is no more Dornish army now that Ellaria is dead? It's so dumb, they have certainly never mentioned any other family names in Dorne, except Dayne I guess, but no backstory of any kind.

-----

Another problem I have is why does Arya eat and drink like a dirty man now? and who eats bread like that? diving in from the middle instead of the sides while constantly getting it all over your face? what does that even show about her? Now that she is an assassin she is also a slob? I would think quite the opposite, if anything she should be acting more like Beatrix Kiddo/Oren Ishii, not a pig who cant even get her food in her mouth properly. And why couldnt she at least pet/touch Nymeria? Not in the budget? man these guys ruin everything

 

[Lady Fevre Dream]

1 hour ago, Suzanna Stormborn said:

I have a big problem with the poor Captain-ing of Yara/Asha. And the whole Ironborn scene

1. She was below deck with no lookouts

2. Even when she came on deck her and THeon just stood there watching Euron board them, like shoulder to shoulder not moving

Captain Jack is literally better than them, him and Barbosa are constantly shouting orders every time an enemy ship gets near. Yara never shouted even 1 order.

3. even without lookouts, how did they get rammed without seeing an entire GD fleet approaching?

4. Where were those fireballs coming from?

5. Did Euron take an arrow in the neck and walk it off?

6. Theon jumping overboard made me LOL

7. My guess is that there were many many chapters in the books devoted to Dorne which were squashed down into one stupid scene where 3 daughters and Ellaria were killed.

8. I thought Euron was going out to get Cersei a 'Great Gift', is that supposed to be Yara? Dont think Carol gaf about her.

9. Wondering if the Unsullied Fleet went the same way? Was behind Yara's Ironborn Fleet or what? Why didnt they just march?

10. In the books I would say this does not bode well for Victarion or the Dornish

LOL  I don't blame you on being confused with that darkened, helter skelter battle, but........Ellaria and her daughter (? LOL) Tyene did survive and were shown being rounded up by some IB henchmen.  They are THE GIFT.  I guess St. Tyrion will be surprised, and even relieved, that for once THE GIFT that keeps on giving isn't him. 

[Lady Fevre Dream]

The long look and wait for Theon to do his shark jumping moment was hysterical. 

[Suzanna Stormborn]

5 minutes ago, Lady Fevre Dream said:

LOL  I don't blame you on being confused with that darkened, helter skelter battle, but........Ellaria and her daughter (? LOL) Tyene did survive and were shown being rounded up by some IB henchmen.  They are THE GIFT.  I guess St. Tyrion will be surprised, and even relieved, that for once THE GIFT that keeps on giving isn't him. 

I dont know their names on HBO. The Bad Pussy was with Ellaria, they are both dead (they were the ones hanging from the bow of the ship at the end right?), then Euron was battling one and killed her, the 3rd was taken hostage? no I didnt see that. And I dont see how her or Yara would be considered good 'gifts' for Carol, like what good are they to her?

[Lady Fevre Dream]

Just now, Suzanna Stormborn said:

I dont know their names on HBO. The Bad Pussy was with Ellaria, they are both dead, then Euron was battling one and killed her, the 3rd was taken hostage? no I didnt see that. And I dont see how her or Yara would be considered good 'gifts' for Carol, like what good are they to her?

I did have a bit of help with a bit of understanding of this from the leaks.  (I'm not full abreast of them, just vaguely aware, LOL).  Obara and Nym definitely died.  Ellaria and Tyene wound up below together, and yes, beat up, but not dead.  They, mother and daughter in showverse, will be the gifts for Cersei as Ellaria killed Cersei's daughter.  You know, that dead daughter that Cersei doesn't much seem to care about anyway.   It's my understanding a bit of Ellaria watching her daughter die will be Cersei's revenge.  Yara is just a bit of fun for Euron as I understand.  It was hard to see what was going on in that darkened battle and crappy camera work.

[Cas Stark]

7 minutes ago, Suzanna Stormborn said:

I'm wondering if on the show, killing off the leading family of Dorne = killing off all of its citizens?

Like there is no more Dornish army now that Ellaria is dead? It's so dumb, they have certainly never mentioned any other family names in Dorne, except Dayne I guess, but no backstory of any kind.

-----

Another problem I have is why does Arya eat and drink like a dirty man now? and who eats bread like that? diving in from the middle instead of the sides while constantly getting it all over your face? what does that even show about her? Now that she is an assassin she is also a slob? I would think quite the opposite, if anything she should be acting more like Beatrix Kiddo/Oren Ishii, not a pig who cant even get her food in her mouth properly. And why couldnt she at least pet/touch Nymeria? Not in the budget? man these guys ruin everything

 

I think the show is finished w/Dorne.  They will torture/kill Ellaria and Dagger Spice, and that's that.  Dorne will fade out. 4 years of plot all for nothing.

I mean, Mance had a 100,000 wildlings and we've only seen half a dozen since the wide shot of his camp in whatever season that was....all but Tormund have disappeared from sight.

I thought the Nymeria scene was stupid, I thought that 'call back' line was stupid, no one speaks like that, I'ts not you.  Terrible line.  I get what they wanted to get across, but give her maybe two complete sentences and forget the cutesy call back.  I guess Arya has no manners because she's not a 'lady' or some s**.   I'm sure it was done to remind the audience about the direwolf so that at some point in the future we will see a dark, barely visible CGI wolf pack do something badass.

 

[Cas Stark]

5 minutes ago, Suzanna Stormborn said:

I dont know their names on HBO. The Bad Pussy was with Ellaria, they are both dead (they were the ones hanging from the bow of the ship at the end right?), then Euron was battling one and killed her, the 3rd was taken hostage? no I didnt see that. And I dont see how her or Yara would be considered good 'gifts' for Carol, like what good are they to her?

Bad Pussy and Revenge Mom will be gifts to Cersei because she can then get her revenge on over Myrcella.  And he will have more ships to offer as well, whatever is left of the fleet.  

[Lady Fevre Dream]

I do wonder if the show will forget about the supposed Dornish army with all of the known nobility of Dorne being dead.  We have Randyl Tarly as the stand in for a Reach/Tyrell army, so we know they will not be forgotten.  I suspect that Dornish army will disappear quicker than Doran did.  Or, some noname will take charge of it, if it's ever mentioned again? 

[Low Sparrow]

29 minutes ago, Suzanna Stormborn said:

I dont know their names on HBO. The Bad Pussy was with Ellaria, they are both dead (they were the ones hanging from the bow of the ship at the end right?), then Euron was battling one and killed her, the 3rd was taken hostage? no I didnt see that. And I dont see how her or Yara would be considered good 'gifts' for Carol, like what good are they to her?

When they introduced the Power Ranger girls, they let us know one was Spear Girl, one was Whip Girl and the other was Dagger Girl. No further character developent necessary. Thus, they thought they were telegraphing who was dead at the end pretty well by having one impaled with a Spear and the other hanging by a Whip. Yea, pretty cheesy and stupid, probably why so many were confused at the end. Obviously, Euron watches the show, so he remembered their intros and took the time to arrange them in said manner.

 

25 minutes ago, Lady Fevre Dream said:

I did have a bit of help with a bit of understanding of this from the leaks.  (I'm not full abreast of them, just vaguely aware, LOL).  Obara and Nym definitely died.  Ellaria and Tyene wound up below together, and yes, beat up, but not dead.  They, mother and daughter in showverse, will be the gifts for Cersei as Ellaria killed Cersei's daughter.  You know, that dead daughter that Cersei doesn't much seem to care about anyway.   It's my understanding a bit of Ellaria watching her daughter die will be Cersei's revenge.  Yara is just a bit of fun for Euron as I understand.  It was hard to see what was going on in that darkened battle and crappy camera work.

And, I get the feeling Cersei watches the show too, as otherwise, neither she, or Euron would have any way of knowing exactly who killed Myrcella, or in what specific manner they did so.

[Suzanna Stormborn]

8 minutes ago, Low Sparrow said:

When they introduced the Power Ranger girls, they let us know one was Spear Girl, one was Whip Girl and the other was Dagger Girl. No further character developent necessary. Thus, they thought they were telegraphing who was dead at the end pretty well by having one impaled with a Spear and the other hanging by a Whip. Yea, pretty cheesy and stupid, probably why so many were confused at the end. Obviously, Euron watches the show, so he remembered their intros and took the time to arrange them in said manner.

 

And, I get the feeling Cersei watches the show too, as otherwise, neither she, or Euron would have any way of knowing exactly who killed Myrcella, or in what specific manner they did so.

lolzzzzz, Tyrion too. Somehow he knew for a fact that Ellaria killed Myrcella with poison and how she did it.  I guess maybe Ellaria posted on her Facebook about it after Jaime sailed away?

34 minutes ago, Lady Fevre Dream said:

I did have a bit of help with a bit of understanding of this from the leaks.  (I'm not full abreast of them, just vaguely aware, LOL).  Obara and Nym definitely died.  Ellaria and Tyene wound up below together, and yes, beat up, but not dead.  They, mother and daughter in showverse, will be the gifts for Cersei as Ellaria killed Cersei's daughter.  You know, that dead daughter that Cersei doesn't much seem to care about anyway.   It's my understanding a bit of Ellaria watching her daughter die will be Cersei's revenge.  Yara is just a bit of fun for Euron as I understand.  It was hard to see what was going on in that darkened battle and crappy camera work.

O.o, I see now, yes that makes more sense, I thought it was Ellaria and Bad Pussy dead at the end, but it was the other 2 sisters, whom BP was saying 'she should kill them so she wont have to share' oh the sweet irony of that bad writing!

So Cersei will take super-evil revenge by killing BP in front of Mom, since Mom killed Myrcella, even though Cersei doesnt care(?) about Myrcella anymore and wants to have a Dynasty with no children. WTF HBO? Sex and City literally had better storylines...anyway

[Suzanna Stormborn]

LOLZZZ ok, and Euron somehow knew (and was sensitive enough) to bring Cersei the woman who killed Mycella, how sweet of him.!! I had no idea punk rockers could be so sweet!

 

Here I was thinking that the 'Gift' would be the Dragon binder horn to steal one of Dany's dragons, silly me.

[Cas Stark]

I can see that Cersei would know/blame Ellaria and the Spice Snakes for Myrcella, but it's a good point that one wonders how Tyrion, who was across the narrow sea, would have those details......did the Dornish Strong Women tell him about it during their sea voyage?  

Ah well, at this point, when people are saying they know Stormborn is landing at Dragonstone but doing nothing about it, sailing up, down, back and around for no discernable reason, Mystique Stark doesn't find out about the King in the North from any of the Freys she infiltrated but from Hot Pie, and on and on....that truly is a nit pick.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

3 minutes ago, Suzanna Stormborn said:

LOLZZZ ok, and Euron somehow knew (and was sensitive enough) to bring Cersei the woman who killed Mycella, how sweet of him.!! I had no idea punk rockers could be so sweet!

 

Here I was thinking that the 'Gift' would be the Dragon binder horn to steal one of Dany's dragons, silly me.

LOL  I thought THE GIFT would be the previously established one.......Tyrion, LOL  Still, the little I knew about the leaks did rule that out.  As much as they love their little word games, I'm surprised Tyrion wasn't THE GIFT again. 

What a show, eh?