Craster is a Stark

[Black Crow]

The corollary was that by so eating the food the Sin Eater was taking upon himself the sins of the deceased and despised and reviled accordingly.

What I'm suggesting here is that Craster was committing incest to produce the sons which he offers to the Cold Gods and whilst despised and reviled for it by the other Wildlings, he is as necessary to them as the sin eater because his sacrificing his sons means that the blue-eyed lot don't come knocking at their doors.

[Jon Fossoway]

Craster for me is a chaman-like figure. Chamans usually lived on the border of the tribe (sometimes physically on the border, isolated and feared), were deemed as insane but tolerated because they actually kept the whole thing together, but the cost is sacrificing their own sanity. And they were connected to the tribe's deities. And lots of them were clairvoyants. Craster is all this: he lives isolated, he is feared, he's deemed as a "informant" in the Night's Watch, he's sacrificing his sons to the 'gods' and he literally says he's a godly man. He is a point where the Night's Watch, the freefolk and the Others converge. When that point is shattered by the Watch, the faint equilibrium north of the Wall is, for us readers, definitely broken.

Where am I going. No, I don't think he is a Stark. I believe Martin planted Craster as a chaman like figure that get eventually trashed and mark the beginning of the Great Turd Flying Fest in the region. When some tribes loses the chaman, the equilibrium is lost and the group crumbles.

This is a naive reading, I know, but at least I am against the Craster Stark Night's King thing.

[Clegane'sPup]

14 minutes ago, Black Crow said:

he is as necessary to them as the sin eater because his sacrificing his sons means that the blue-eyed lot don't come knocking at their doors

Thanks. I can go along with what you said because citizens of modern day often turn their head at atrocities.

15 minutes ago, King Merrett I Frey said:

This is a naive reading, I know, but at least I am against the Craster Stark Night's King thing.

Don't sell yourself short. BS aside, Craster is an abomination.

 

[Clegane'sPup]

49 minutes ago, King Merrett I Frey said:

Craster for me is a chaman-like figure.

Lillie triskey person do you be speaking of a shaman or do I need to google again? Damn I never can tell how deep the waters are.

[Jon Fossoway]

26 minutes ago, Clegane'sPup said:

Lillie triskey person do you be speaking of a shaman or do I need to google again? Damn I never can tell how deep the waters are.

Right, a shaman. My bad, it's chaman (chamán) in spanish, my first language. 

[Stubby]

[MOD]

No more personal attacks please.

Feel free to criticise each others' arguments, but stay away from the personal remarks.

[/MOD]

[Clegane'sPup]

22 hours ago, King Merrett I Frey said:

Right, a shaman. My bad, it's chaman (chamán) in spanish, my first language. 

I know very few words of Spanish. I gotta tell ya that when the cat is acting up before he goes to what he seems to believe is his invisible space in the card board box filled with gift wrap tissue I tell him he a silly gato.  He meh’s.

[nlspeed]

Regarding Waymar Royce possibly being seen as the Lord Commander by the Others - isn't it likelier that the Others were looking for the First Ranger? It would explain why the Others wait for blood to be drawn (Stark blood - or not, in this case) instead of the effect of the sword. And it would also tie into the whole 'Starks sacrifice themselves as part of the pact signed by Brandon the Builder'-theory.

[Lord Wraith]

I still think Craster is bloodravens bastard. 

[Ser Walter of AShwood]

1 hour ago, Lord Wraith said:

I still think Craster is bloodravens bastard. 

That would only make sense is Craster was born after Bloodraven disappeared from the Nights watch. He was after all the Lord Commander of the NW and it would be silly to assume this man would've been left alone beyond the wall (let alone with a wildling woman).
Bloodraven disappeared in 252 AC, Craster died in 299 AC.
According to your theory, Craster would be a maximum of 47 years old. he is described as a once powerful-looking man, nearing the end of his life. His hair is grey turning to white.

47 is not that old in current civilization, but I do not think that 47 would be considered old in Westeros (or beyond the wall), especially with the description of Crasters hair.

Other people with white hair (with known years of birth) are:

• Barristan Selmy, born in 236 or 237 AC, while old, never described as near to the end of his life;
• Olenna Tyrell, born in 228 AC, also old, but still with a lot of spirit, and also not near the end of her life;
• Erik Ironmaker, the oldest of the bunch still alive, born in 211 or 212 AC, the main reason he has to be carried is because he can no longer stand up. But he believes he is still capable enough to become king of the iron islands.

These people are (a lot) older then the 47 years between BR's disappearance and Crasters death and are never described as 'nearing the end of their lives'. I would assume that Craster is therefore quite a lot older, especially since he has 19 wives (quite a lot of which are his daughters).

Also, when BR disappeared during a ranging mission, don't you think it would be odd for him to go to a well known wildling village, near the wall and have a child with a women there? I would assume that Crasters mother would've mentioned the father being the Lord Commander when she tried to bring Craster to the NW, but got chased away.

Yes, Craster is a bastard of a NW member and a woman from Whitetree, but I think it is highly unlikely that BR is his father. Not impossible, but unlikely.

[Slowpoke Martin]

People can doubt Craster being a Stark as much as they want, but there is something massively important about his blood IF the Others are in fact turning his boys into more White Walkers. This guy has been purposely keeping his blood as pure as possible with the absurd amounts of inbreeding. The focus on Craster's incestuous inbreeding and his offerings to the Others must be a hint that their bloodline is important, but why?

 

[ravenous reader]

Craster is derived from 'aster' which means 'star' in Greek.  So on a wordplay level, Cr-aster (the corrupt or crass star) is related to the Star-ks.

[Ice Queen]

2 hours ago, ravenous reader said:

Craster is derived from 'aster' which means 'star' in Greek.  So on a wordplay level, Cr-aster (the corrupt or crass star) is related to the Star-ks.

From http://www.surnamedb.com/Surname/Craster

In spite of its slightly occupational appearance, this surname is locational. It derives from the old fishing village of 'Craister' in Northumberland, and is recorded in a number of spellings of which the two most popular are Craister and the dialectal Craster. The first recording of the village appears in the rolls known as the 'Feet of Fines' in 1242, and the name itself is clearly Roman. It originates from the Latin 'cestre' meaning a fort or camp, plus the Olde English 'cra' meaning 'crow'. This suggests that the original site was a look-out post, a 'crows nest', which given its proximity to Hadrians Wall is a logical analysis. 

[Black Crow]

As  it happens I currently live a ways down the coast from Craster, and just a little ways inland from the village is Craster's keep or tower

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craster_Tower

[Coolbeard the Exile]

15 hours ago, Lord Wraith said:

I still think Craster is bloodravens bastard. 

He must be why else would coldhands kill the night's watchmen so brutally.

[Ice Queen]

1 hour ago, Black Crow said:

As  it happens I currently live a ways down the coast from Craster, and just a little ways inland from the village is Craster's keep or tower

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craster_Tower

That's pretty cool !

The name "crow fort" or "crow's nest" is pretty appropriate considering how he is with the NW. He's their lookout, their main source of information on what's going on beyond the Wall.

[Aetta]

22 hours ago, Ser Walter of AShwood said:

That would only make sense is Craster was born after Bloodraven disappeared from the Nights watch. He was after all the Lord Commander of the NW and it would be silly to assume this man would've been left alone beyond the wall (let alone with a wildling woman).
Bloodraven disappeared in 252 AC, Craster died in 299 AC.
According to your theory, Craster would be a maximum of 47 years old. he is described as a once powerful-looking man, nearing the end of his life. His hair is grey turning to white.

47 is not that old in current civilization, but I do not think that 47 would be considered old in Westeros (or beyond the wall), especially with the description of Crasters hair.

Other people with white hair (with known years of birth) are:

• Barristan Selmy, born in 236 or 237 AC, while old, never described as near to the end of his life;
• Olenna Tyrell, born in 228 AC, also old, but still with a lot of spirit, and also not near the end of her life;
• Erik Ironmaker, the oldest of the bunch still alive, born in 211 or 212 AC, the main reason he has to be carried is because he can no longer stand up. But he believes he is still capable enough to become king of the iron islands.

These people are (a lot) older then the 47 years between BR's disappearance and Crasters death and are never described as 'nearing the end of their lives'. I would assume that Craster is therefore quite a lot older, especially since he has 19 wives (quite a lot of which are his daughters).

Also, when BR disappeared during a ranging mission, don't you think it would be odd for him to go to a well known wildling village, near the wall and have a child with a women there? I would assume that Crasters mother would've mentioned the father being the Lord Commander when she tried to bring Craster to the NW, but got chased away.

Yes, Craster is a bastard of a NW member and a woman from Whitetree, but I think it is highly unlikely that BR is his father. Not impossible, but unlikely.

I don't love the theory myself, but as to Bloodraven doing the horizontal tango with a chick beyond the Wall...he certainy did not have to be on his final ranging when he did it and he certainly didn't have to have guardians making sure he wasnt fucking anyone, given that he was surrounded by his Raven Teeth homies who could've told any nosey companions to go find a tree to piss on.

[Seams]

17 hours ago, Crazy Cat Lady in Training said:

From http://www.surnamedb.com/Surname/Craster

In spite of its slightly occupational appearance, this surname is locational. It derives from the old fishing village of 'Craister' in Northumberland, and is recorded in a number of spellings of which the two most popular are Craister and the dialectal Craster. The first recording of the village appears in the rolls known as the 'Feet of Fines' in 1242, and the name itself is clearly Roman. It originates from the Latin 'cestre' meaning a fort or camp, plus the Olde English 'cra' meaning 'crow'. This suggests that the original site was a look-out post, a 'crows nest', which given its proximity to Hadrians Wall is a logical analysis.  

This is fascinating and, obviously, a significant factor in GRRM's thinking about the people around the Wall and the North. The crow connection is particularly interesting, as the Craster character in the books is so hostile toward the "crows" of the Night's Watch.

I think it does not exclude ravenous reader's interpretation, though. The more I dig into the details of the books, the more I believe that GRRM invested significant time and thought in building a set of links among symbols. There is no doubt that the star (and sun) motif runs throughout the books, and a literate guy like GRRM would almost certainly make the connection between "sounds like aster" and "Craster."

So I suspect there are several layers of meaning in the name of this keystone character, and that we will eventually see links from Craster to others in the story that will make some of these layers of symbolism even clearer.

[Roswell]

On 12/4/2016 at 10:02 PM, Heavy D said:

If all the White Walkers needed were sacrificial material to raise the dead, then any human child would do.  And it wouldn't even need to be voluntary.  They can just seize a village full of the Free Folk and have all the sacrificial offerings they could want. Instead, they make a deal with Craster.  And instead of simply taking the babies by force they make a deal that would allow Craster to willingly give his boys.  Why?  Because they want to keep Craster alive so he can continue to provide them with his babies.  It's clear that Craster's DNA is very important to the white walkers.  Craster is special.  He's a Stark.

Good reasoning.  It may be that the Stark line will have to end in order to end the white walker threat for good. 

[Ice Queen]

20 hours ago, The Transporter said:

Good reasoning.  It may be that the Stark line will have to end in order to end the white walker threat for good. 

If that's trying, then the Targ line must also come to an end (for real this time). The dragons and the Others go out together.