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Doctor who Series 10; He has been away for a while but he is back! Contains spoilers.

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7 minutes ago, Roose Boltons Pet Leech said:

Pleased to see that no-one objects to my relatively high placement of The Gunfighters, The Space Museum, and The Underwater Menace, which are commonly regarded as awful! Even the infamous Twin Dilemma doesn't crack my bottom ten.

Well, I lived for a number of years (seven) in Tombstone, Arizona, so even though it's not historically accurate, "The Gunfighters" gets some "local love" from me. Plus, it's cool that Doctor Who was trying an American adventure so early in its history; the show wasn't seen much in this country until the 1970s, so they were ahead of their time.

Second season Doctor Who is just classic, including "The Space Museum". The combo of Doctor/Ian/Barbara/Vicki is one of my favorite companion groups. Not sure I ever saw "The Underwater Menace".

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I over all liked this finale, there were some really strong notes, the Master and Missy's interactions, the use of the duel perspectives when it came Bill, and I loved the Doctor at the end, I feel that it so perfectly portrayed who the 12th Doctor is, a man who fiercely wants to hold on so he can help others, all the while raging against the cosmos. He's an aging punk rocker who doesn't know when to admit defeat.

 

Spoiler

I kind of felt like Moffat killing off Missy like he did was actually a massive dick move. I get that in the end, they'll just bring the Master back if they want to use the character, but it still feels kind of like Moffat decided that if he was leaving the basketball game, he might as well put a hole in one of the balls so no one else can use it.

I kind of felt that the whole Bill becoming a Cyberman thing was rather derivative, considering what happened with Mr. Pink just last season. That said, I really liked her ending, and I hope that we get to see her again.

Excited for the Christmas special, I think it will be really good.

 

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Well, I thought it was a better made finale than just about any other, but it had so much cheese that it sort of undercut how well it was crafted.  The Doctor pirouetting around blowing stuff up with his sonic, and yet another Deus Ex Machina ending just rubbed me the wrong way.  

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I suppose the door is left open for both Bill and Nardole to come back in the future if they wish (probably easier in plot terms for Nardole). Might be a bit more difficult to explain bringing Missy back, but The Master has been killed off before and that hasn't stopped him coming back.

 

The Radio Times proposed an excellent idea: Missy is the last Master and this is how he/she dies, for real and forever. However, John Simm's Master doesn't regenerate into Michelle Gomez (she even lampshades this by saying she can't remember if she's the next one along from him). Instead there's multiple other Master incarnations inbetween who can cause problems for the Doctor.

10 hours ago, Roose Boltons Pet Leech said:

Pleased to see that no-one objects to my relatively high placement of The Gunfighters, The Space Museum, and The Underwater Menace, which are commonly regarded as awful! Even the infamous Twin Dilemma doesn't crack my bottom ten.

I'm more concerned by the low placement of The Dominators, one of Doctor Who's absolute best "stories to watch whilst drunk". Disappointing this wasn't factored into your consideration. Especially when you had the awful The Mind Robber so high and The Ark in Space so relatively low. I approve of the love for the criminally underrated Day of the Daleks though. That was a great story, arguably the first Doctor Who story to really delve into time paradoxes and do it well, and one that always seems to be under-appreciated.

 

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yet another Deus Ex Machina ending just rubbed me the wrong way.

 

The ending had problems, such as being a near-exact repeat of Clara's departure, but it's really not a deus ex machina. It was set up 11 weeks ago in the first episode of the series.

Edited by Werthead

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I'm still not certain how I felt about the ending.  I k ow I didn't lime Bill's ending.  Nardole seemed to simply fade away...

Christmastime can't come soon enough...

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Nobody can top this doctor, so Cindy Lauper next?    Sad for Missy.    Water space lesbian appears godlike, why not have her take over the show.

Uh oh: mid- episode and against my will, an appreciation blossomed for the bald egg sidekick weirdo alien.    Hmmmm.    

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I really liked the two-part finale but had a few issues with it. A great farewell to Capaldi's doctor but I'm irritated that the regeneration has been delayed and teased out so much (event though 12 is my favorite doctor). I've really enjoyed the character development for both him and Missy over the last three series. Missy is also my favorite incarnation of the Master (I really, really do not enjoy John Simm's version of the character but he was good enough later on in this episode). Until Missy the Master was always far too much of a mustache-twirling villain. I hope they don't bring the character back for another incarnation as it would undo all the character development Missy went through. But if they do, I hope they don't scratch all that and revert back to the muahahaha evil top hat trope. Maybe a future incarnation of the Master could actually be an ally of the Doctor instead of an antagonist. 

Shame to see BIll go already too -- even with just one season, she was my second favorite companion after Amy. 

Oh, also, a  relatively minor quibble, but I really hate how the Doctor says he doesn't like guns when the little girls asks for one then gives her an apple implying that it's "knowledge" and then it turns out to be a friggen bomb. Last time I checked, bombs usually do more damage than guns.

ETA: Oh and instead of the Pilot trope which wrapped up Bill's plot arch a little too cheaply, I much rather wish the rumors were true and that 12 regenerated into Bill as a tribute to her for getting two companions killed in a row. I think Pearl Mackie would have made a wonderful doctor and it would give us our first female and non-white doctor. Also would have been happy with him transforming into Missy as Michelle Gomez would also be a wonderful Doctor. Plus either of them would have had the advantage of already being well-received by fans. 

Edited by All-for-Joffrey

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1 hour ago, All-for-Joffrey said:

Oh, also, a  relatively minor quibble, but I really hate how the Doctor says he doesn't like guns when the little girls asks for one then gives her an apple implying that it's "knowledge" and then it turns out to be a friggen bomb. Last time I checked, bombs usually do more damage than guns.

Yeah, I had a sudden vision of the Doctor channeling Ron Swanson from Parks and Recreation. "Take this apple-shaped hand grenade, little girl, and use it to defend your property." 

Though when I watched the scene, I had the impression that the apple was just a distraction/bait - the actual explosion was caused by Nardole doing stuff on his laptop. 

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My understanding of DW history is there wasn't any explanation for why One regenerated, so perhaps we'll finally learn that.

Another thing is that the character of the Valeyard is the darker side of the Doctor created sometime between Twelve & Thirteen.  So maybe in the Xmas special we'll see both the One's cause of death and creation of the Valeyard?  And he'll go off to put the Doctor on trial before becoming Thirteen.  Maybe One's death was a punishment required by the Trial?

Edited by SpaceChampion

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14 minutes ago, SpaceChampion said:

My understanding of DW history is there wasn't any explanation for why One regenerated, so perhaps we'll finally learn that.

It was basically old age. I don't think it really needs any other explanation, though I wouldn't be surprised if we get one.

14 minutes ago, SpaceChampion said:

Another thing is that the character of the Valeyard is the darker side of the Doctor created sometime between Twelve & Thirteen.

Between his twelfth and final incarnations. At the time it was assumed the thirteenth would be the final, but obviously that's not the case. But since his future has changed at least once (we saw his grave at Trenzalore, which no longer happened), it seems likely that the course of events leading to the Valeyard's creation has been averted. In fact, the Valeyard interfering with his own past might have been enough to undo his creation.

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I'd hate that. He doesn't seem Doctory at all.

Same reason why I don't understand why so many people think that if there's gonna be a woman Doctor it should be Hayley Atwell. I think she's a much better actor than Madden but still, she just seems too... normal.

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3 minutes ago, polishgenius said:

I'd hate that. He doesn't seem Doctory at all.

Same reason why I don't understand why so many people think that if there's gonna be a woman Doctor it should be Hayley Atwell. I think she's a much better actor than Madden but still, she just seems too... normal.

True. However he will bring so many fans and tumblr will love him. After of course they stop screaming about not being a woman.

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On 7/2/2017 at 3:07 AM, Werthead said:

The ending had problems, such as being a near-exact repeat of Clara's departure, but it's really not a deus ex machina. It was set up 11 weeks ago in the first episode of the series.

I disagree that it was "Set up."  The sentient godlike engine oil from the first episode "dies" at the end, stops following them throughout time, and as it's dying splashes Bill in the face.  Then in the last episode, she magically shows up, having been uh...living? in Bill's tears? and fixes Bill then flies off into infinity hand in hand, after turning her into a godlike engine oil person too?  Just because a thing was *there* in the first episode doesn't mean there was something "Set up" to deliver in the last episode.  This was even *less* set up than Bad Wolf.  There was *zero* in between to indicate that such a thing was possible.  Bill seeing her in the background?  In mirrors?  In dreams?  In her Better Than Life adventures?  Nada.  Just "Here I am silly, been living in your tears, and I'm back, let's be engine oil-sprites into infinity!"  Incredibly lame, weak storytelling, but I've just come to expect that with Moffat, and heck, even nuWho in general. 

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10 hours ago, Spaßvogel said:

I disagree that it was "Set up."  The sentient godlike engine oil from the first episode "dies" at the end, stops following them throughout time

It didn't die, it accepted that Bill didn't want to go with it at that time and went off to do its own thing. So its reappearance at the end of the season was technically plausible, though I agree there should have been more indication that it was keeping an eye on her during the season. The focus on her tears in the last episode would have been more effective if they hadn't had crying cybermen before. There were worse problems with the episode than Bill's fate, like the Doctor running around shooting cybermen with his sonic screwdriver. Quite a disappointment after a very strong opening installment.

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On 07/07/2017 at 7:44 PM, Jon's Queen Consort said:

There is a rumour that Robb Richard Madden will be the next Doctor. I would like that. 

I think there's probably a rumour going around that I'm going to be the next Doctor. The Sun is as good at naming candidates as The Daily Mail is at listing things that cause/prevent (often both) cancer.

Guess we'll find out tomorrow after Wimbledon. Geeks are going to RAGE if the final runs overtime and makes them wait.

I'm surprised there hasn't been any strong last minute news items on the new Doctor. Popular opinion (backed by some rumours of scary bets) is that it's kris marshall has the job. Seems a very safe, almost too safe choice. But I felt the same way about Matt Smith getting the gig and he turned out to be a very good Doctor.

The actress who stars/created "fleabag" seems like an excellent choice if they were to do the gender switch as she maintains that "young" appeal that the show seems to do best with since the 2005 relaunch. Although she's apparently in the Han Solo film so that could be a bit tight schedule wise - especially if she's trying to crack the film industry. It'd also be a shame if it meant no second season of fleabag which is apparently filming in November so again it seems like scheduling rules her out.

So I'll be surprised if it isn't Kris Marshall. But pleasantly surprised.

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2 hours ago, red snow said:

I'm surprised there hasn't been any strong last minute news items on the new Doctor.


Jodie Whittaker has made a late surge to be betting favourite overnight. Apparently that also happened with Smith and Capaldi, and she has prior with Chibnall on Broadchurch, so it's possible.

I really hope it's not Kris Marshall, who just seems too normal and bland. Or Richard Ayoade, who's the opposite and seems to have been living his entire life till now as an audition for Doctor Who, and as such feels like he's trying too hard.

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28 minutes ago, polishgenius said:


Jodie Whittaker has made a late surge to be betting favourite overnight. Apparently that also happened with Smith and Capaldi, and she has prior with Chibnall on Broadchurch, so it's possible.

I really hope it's not Kris Marshall, who just seems too normal and bland. Or Richard Ayoade, who's the opposite and seems to have been living his entire life till now as an audition for Doctor Who, and as such feels like he's trying too hard.

I'd be fine with Whittaker, she seems a good actress so while I can't say she has a "Dr" factor she could easily be capable of it. The working relationship with Chibnall helps

Ayoade is too sarcastic and oddly too alien for the role. I'd like to see him guest star maybe even as another timelord but I agree he'd be a bit too much and probably come off as insincere.

 

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I got into Doctor Who somewhere around 2012, so I was able to watch the first several series all in a row with very little clue of when regeneration was coming and who it was going to be (I had a vague idea that David Tennant was the Doctor at some point, and I had bought the DVDs so I saw him on them, but for example I didn't know that Eccleston only did 1 season and I had no clue about Matt Smith). It was nice, and I kind of wish I could go into the next season unspoiled. Moreso about companions than the Doctor, as there is at least a chance of mid-season companion changes. But I don't see how it will be possible to avoid this announcement. So I guess I might as well just enjoy it! I have no clue who it will be--I did hear the Kris Marshall rumors which was not my favorite idea, but it seems like those have died down so ??

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2 hours ago, red snow said:

Ayoade is too sarcastic and oddly too alien for the role. I'd like to see him guest star maybe even as another timelord but I agree he'd be a bit too much and probably come off as insincere.

I like Ayoade's comedy work, but I've not seen him show the acting range needed to play The Doctor.

2 hours ago, Starkess said:

I got into Doctor Who somewhere around 2012, so I was able to watch the first several series all in a row with very little clue of when regeneration was coming and who it was going to be (I had a vague idea that David Tennant was the Doctor at some point, and I had bought the DVDs so I saw him on them, but for example I didn't know that Eccleston only did 1 season and I had no clue about Matt Smith).

I agree it would be nice to find out who the new Doctor is in the actual show, I remember the reveal of John Hurt as the War Doctor being very effective in whichever season finale it was.

I can't remember now if we knew at the time the first season was shown that Ecclestone was going to be replaced with Tennant? I've a vague memory that it wasn't announced in advanced, but it's been a long time so I might not be remembering correctly.

5 hours ago, red snow said:

I think there's probably a rumour going around that I'm going to be the next Doctor. The Sun is as good at naming candidates as The Daily Mail is at listing things that cause/prevent (often both) cancer.

Guess we'll find out tomorrow after Wimbledon. Geeks are going to RAGE if the final runs overtime and makes them wait.

Given that it's being announced after Wimbledon, I'm surprised there isn't a rumour that Roger Federer is going to be the next Doctor (with Rafael Nadal playing The Master).

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