UK Politics: Trumpy Cat Trumpy Cat Where Have You Been?

[Isis]

13 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said:

So is Theresa May really going to use security cooperation as a bargaining chip for trade?

For one thing, this apparent threat coming so soon after divorce proceedings were formally initiated smacks of desperation. For another thing, it is a monumentally stupid negotiating position.

I am fucking disgusted with the pair of them (May and Rudd) for mentioning the subject in the first place. It's so incredibly crass. And it's not even something that would happen anyway. So it's basically an empty threat. But it's just a really low-down, scummy thing to imply, 'if you don't give us a good trade deal, we'll sacrifice some European lives as punishment'. A great start to proceedings!

11 hours ago, The BlackBear said:

It was always one of our strengths, so we were clearly going to use it as one of our 'cards,' (as they insist in calling the lives and fortunes of people.) The thing is that it was implicit, she really didn't need to spell it out in the blunt terms we've had.

That's wrong. It's not implicit. And it's not going to happen. In fighting terrorism we are on the same side - there is nothing to be gained from not collaborating with other countries in Europe. It is in our own interests to carry on doing so anyway. And to imply that we would fail to pass on any relevant intelligence which might prevent an attack or save lives in a European country is morally and ethically wrong. That's not something that Teresa May can instruct the intelligence services to do anyway because they aren't civil servants. It's an empty threat. Jesus Christ, what an awful fucking person she is though.

[SeanF]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/oct/07/uk-must-pay-price-for-brexit-says-francois-hollande

When the President of France makes remarks like "There must be a threat, there must be a price, there must be a risk", it's perhaps not surprising that the British government is willing to respond in kind.

Emotional rhetoric is rarely helpful in the run up to negotiations.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

After Brexit are you still godless eurocommies or just plain old godless commies? 

[Maltaran]

Spain is seizing the opportunity presented by Brexit, by threatening to veto any deal unless they get influence over Gibraltar's future

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39453535

[williamjm]

7 hours ago, SeanF said:

When the President of France makes remarks like "There must be a threat, there must be a price, there must be a risk", it's perhaps not surprising that the British government is willing to respond in kind.

Generally 'he started it' isn't the best basis for diplomacy. Even if the Tories might not like something that a European leader says that's no reason to either respond in kind or raise the stakes as they've done here.

Spain is seizing the opportunity presented by Brexit, by threatening to veto any deal unless they get influence over Gibraltar's future

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39453535

While I think the Spaniards are being unreasonable here and it wouldn't be in their best interests to actually use a veto, it's hardly surprising if they take this position and if they want to make a point on Gibraltar badly enough then there's no way that Britain could stop them derailing a deal.

 

[The guy from the Vale]

I'd also note that this French president is a lame duck at this point. He almost certainly won't be involved in negotiations.

[Werthead]

On 30/03/2017 at 11:37 PM, The Anti-Targ said:

For one thing, this apparent threat coming so soon after divorce proceedings were formally initiated smacks of desperation. For another thing, it is a monumentally stupid negotiating position.

Britain's negotiating position is poor. The only thing we have really going for us is that the EU's negotiating hand is really not great either. A free trade deal would benefit both sides and European unity should be maintained as much as possible against the issues of an unpredictable and unstable USA and a more bellicose Russia. The problem is that if the EU lets Britain out with everything it wants, it may inspire other countries to leave the union, so they're a bit unsure on how to handle it.

Gibraltar is a good example of the uncertainties involved here. Apparently Gibraltar rarely came up during discussions of the situation, despite Spain clearly saying the day after the referendum they expect Gibraltar to now be given to them, and May made no mention of it in her letter, meaning that the EU has taken that to mean that discussion of Gibraltar is now on the table.

On the plus side, the issue allowed Boris to say he was "rock-like" in his commitment to Gibraltar, which he seemed inordinately pleased by.

[Werthead]

The Telegraph speculating on if we could beat Spain in a fight.

Something tells me the post-Article 50 negotiations are going to go well.

[Philokles]

I'm sure Spain will return Ceuta and Melilla to Morocco to show that they are truly dedicated to this principle and not just rampant opportunists.

[The Anti-Targ]

5 hours ago, Werthead said:

The Telegraph speculating on if we could beat Spain in a fight.

Something tells me the post-Article 50 negotiations are going to go well.

Hmm perhaps a marriage can be arranged between Harry and the Spanish Infanta. That used to sometimes work to avoid war.

She's a bit on the young side, but they all grow up eventually.

[Blue Roses]

19 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said:

Hmm perhaps a marriage can be arranged between Harry and the Spanish Infanta. That used to sometimes work to avoid war.

She's a bit on the young side, but they all grow up eventually.

Errrr.......last time a Harry married an Infanta of Spain I seem to remember a very bad break with a 'treaty' of Rome and a Spanish Armada eventually sent to convert us back to the heaving bosom of the continent. Didn't pan out terribly well.

Probably best to send a couple of warships to Gib and sign a defence pact with Morocco to build a nice deep water port on the opposite African coast which will of course be suitable for our (eventual) aircraft carriers. We can then of course carry on our much-needed humanitarian duties by helping all those poor struggling African refugees by ferrying them across the straits of Gibraltar and depositing safely in Spanish waters where they can claim asylum in the land of milk and honey which is the blessed EU. The fact that the UK will then operate the Pillars of Hercules would never cross our mind at all. Bit of gunboat diplomacy never hurt did it? 

 

[The Anti-Targ]

4 hours ago, Blue Roses said:

Errrr.......last time a Harry married an Infanta of Spain I seem to remember a very bad break with a 'treaty' of Rome and a Spanish Armada eventually sent to convert us back to the heaving bosom of the continent. Didn't pan out terribly well.

Probably best to send a couple of warships to Gib and sign a defence pact with Morocco to build a nice deep water port on the opposite African coast which will of course be suitable for our (eventual) aircraft carriers. We can then of course carry on our much-needed humanitarian duties by helping all those poor struggling African refugees by ferrying them across the straits of Gibraltar and depositing safely in Spanish waters where they can claim asylum in the land of milk and honey which is the blessed EU. The fact that the UK will then operate the Pillars of Hercules would never cross our mind at all. Bit of gunboat diplomacy never hurt did it? 

 

Perhaps they can find a minor lordling named Edmund to marry her instead.

[The BlackBear]

1 hour ago, The Anti-Targ said:

Perhaps they can find a minor lordling named Edmund to marry her instead.

Don't you mean Osmund?

[The Anti-Targ]

20 minutes ago, The BlackBear said:

Don't you mean Osmund?

That would be a little too cruel wouldn't it?

[Rippounet]

5 hours ago, Blue Roses said:

Probably best to send a couple of warships to Gib and sign a defence pact with Morocco to build a nice deep water port on the opposite African coast which will of course be suitable for our (eventual) aircraft carriers. We can then of course carry on our much-needed humanitarian duties by helping all those poor struggling African refugees by ferrying them across the straits of Gibraltar and depositing safely in Spanish waters where they can claim asylum in the land of milk and honey which is the blessed EU. The fact that the UK will then operate the Pillars of Hercules would never cross our mind at all. Bit of gunboat diplomacy never hurt did it?

Considering the amount of refugees or immigrants whose eventual destination is actually the UK, you might have to close the Channel Tunnel, make sure ferries coming from the continent are thoroughly searched, and keep some of those fancy boats of yours to patrol the Channel...

[The Anti-Targ]

3 hours ago, Rippounet said:

Considering the amount of refugees or immigrants whose eventual destination is actually the UK, you might have to close the Channel Tunnel, make sure ferries coming from the continent are thoroughly searched, and keep some of those fancy boats of yours to patrol the Channel...

You meant to say extreme vetting of course.

[The Anti-Targ]

So Daniel Craig looks set to do one more Bond. And article I read suggested they want to write a story that speaks to Bonds"place in the world" which is also Britain's place in the world.

What better thing to so than make a Bond movie where post-Brexit Britain is about to go to war with Spain over Gibraltar? 

[mormont]

Enough of this Brexit nonsense. Let's discuss the serious political issues of the day.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39487307

Quote

Theresa May has described the decision to drop the word Easter from the name of Cadbury and National Trust egg hunts as "absolutely ridiculous".

Mrs May told ITV News: "I'm not just a vicar's daughter - I'm a member of the National Trust as well.
"I think the stance they have taken is absolutely ridiculous. I don't know what they are thinking about frankly. Easter's very important... It's a very important festival for the Christian faith for millions across the world."

Mrs May, would you care to condemn President Trump's comments about refugees? No? OK, how about attacks on judges? No, no comment on that? OK, well, someone left the word 'Easter' off an egg hunt poster... ah! Now, you're talking! (Literally.)

Quote

Archbishop of York John Sentamu said John Cadbury, a Quaker who founded the firm in 1824, was renowned for his religious beliefs and would not condone dropping the word Easter.
"To drop Easter from Cadbury's Easter Egg Hunt in my book is tantamount to spitting on the grave of Cadbury," Dr Sentamu added.

Tantamount to spitting on his grave. I mean, I was planning a trip to John Cadbury's grave to spit on it, but now I know that omitting to use the word 'Easter' is just as good, that'll save a lot of time and money.

Note that:

Quote

Meanwhile, a descendant of John Cadbury has pointed out that "as a Quaker, he didn't celebrate Easter".

File this one away for the next time someone complains about the PC brigade, folks.

[Which Tyler]

I think it is a slight against all pagans everywhere

[Isis]

Why is she behaving like a total idiot? Every day I am more and more embarrassed by my nationality.