dbunting Posted March 3, 2017 Share Posted March 3, 2017 1 minute ago, Rhom said: What was the deal with talking about the "native child" and the white child that made the dad think she had been unfaithful then? Man you are right, I forgot about that whole thing. I thought that was his/their mother that was being referenced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted March 3, 2017 Share Posted March 3, 2017 9 minutes ago, dbunting said: Man you are right, I forgot about that whole thing. I thought that was his/their mother that was being referenced. So I am right you think? She came first and then he just showed up in the mom later? So weird this show... even the "normal" mutants aren't normal!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveSumm Posted March 3, 2017 Share Posted March 3, 2017 I was starting to think that his power was imprinting realities onto other people, so he has these delusions and is unconciously projecting them into others so they misremember things. So maybe there was no Lenny, but he not only experiences her but also forces others to as well...? I dunno. What was with the hand on his shoulder at the end, it looked like Yellow Eyes hand but Lenny's face? Is there a hint there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamjm Posted March 3, 2017 Share Posted March 3, 2017 I'm also a bit confused about the Cary situation and which one came first. 1 hour ago, DaveSumm said: I was starting to think that his power was imprinting realities onto other people, so he has these delusions and is unconciously projecting them into others so they misremember things. So maybe there was no Lenny, but he not only experiences her but also forces others to as well...? I dunno. I suppose it's possible, but we haven't seen much other evidence of David persuading people in the real world to believe in things that were not there. One exception is that I think Syd did seem flashes of the Angriest Boy a couple of times in the episode, but she has spent a long time in David's memory and has briefly experienced David's power. What was with the hand on his shoulder at the end, it looked like Yellow Eyes hand but Lenny's face? Is there a hint there? I think whoever Lenny may or may not have been in Clockworks, the person David sees now is not his friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The BlackBear Posted March 3, 2017 Share Posted March 3, 2017 7 hours ago, dbunting said: Ok, it's just that Lenny and Benny look so similar that it made the confusion even deeper! No they don't look similar at all, Benny is a big fat dude, Lenny is Aubrey Plaza. Interestingly Lenny was originally written to be a man I believe. 7 hours ago, Rhom said: I don't suppose there's anywhere that has the written script available? Probably too soon to be on a WikiQuotes type thing? Quote Typed by me so may have got little bits wrong. 'So you live inside his body?' 'We share it.' 'Is that weird?' 'I'll tell you a story, Ray and Irma white cloud (I think this is what she said could be wrong,) are having their first kid and it's a girl, native girl, and they decide to name her Kerry. Nine months later a skinny white boy comes out, Ray decides Irma had an affair, he leaves her so now Irma's a single mother, raising this bastard runt. Then eight years later the little boy, Cary, wakes up in his room, and there is an eight year old native girl, playing with his train set. So for the next year he thinks maybe he made her up, like his imaginary friend who comes and goes, but then he figures out that she lives inside of him. That they're two people in one body.' Presumably Ray and Irma were both native American. The line is weird as you can't know what gender your kid is going to be at the point of conception (so presumably it's something to do with their powers knowing it's Kerry.) But there was only ever one child born, Cary. BrainLenny is definitely up to villainy, if not directly Yellow Eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamjm Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 1 hour ago, The BlackBear said: Presumably Ray and Irma were both native American. The line is weird as you can't know what gender your kid is going to be at the point of conception (so presumably it's something to do with their powers knowing it's Kerry.) But there was only ever one child born, Cary. I think it was the '9 months later' line that was really confusing. I suppose Kerry doesn't seem like the best person to give a straightforward explanation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iskaral Pust Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 I like how they extended the mystery, but please don't get so trippy that it jumps the shark. The flash forwards were well done. All of the central mutants have psychic-ish powers rather than the usual physical powers, which I guess is necessary to keep the story on a common plane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 Another great episode - I love how elements that were confusing do get explained while adding additional WTF moments eg I thought it was off that Lenny was his druggy friend prior to clockworks but we now know they are different people/entities and that David (or some other part of him) can retcon his memory. Also, either the writers are trolling us or the shadow king is clinched with the revelation that his beagle "king" never existed. That with the resemblance of fat yellow eyes to the human counterpart of shadow king is too much in my mind to be a coincidence. I think the shadow king has also existed as a mental parasite/prisoner in the comics. It could be the TV show has the shadow king as an aspect of David's mind but I also like the idea of the parasite being its own thing now. Jemaine Clement was excellent - at first I thought it was just someone who looked like him because he wasn't in his usual deadpan mode. No idea why he's frozen but I guess he also is a psychic. Maybe he was infected by a parasite? Anyway, the show continues to improve although I'm starting to realise that David might be suffering from "buffy" syndrome in the sense he's rarely the most interesting/entertaining/likeable member of the cast. Still no idea when this show is set - last week I'd settled on early 70s based on summerland being founded in the 40s but yet again we saw the estate agent using a modern tablet. I have a feeling this will actually be explained at some point and that it isn't just a stylistic choice. oh and it dawned on me while watching this episode that Noah Hawley seems to have inherited Bryan Fuller's crown of visually amazing tv with trippy (but not yet indulgent) stories. They should have given this guy a crack at star trek as he's using mutant powers to explore identity (be it gender, memory or whether you are you) in ways that Fuller was claiming he was going to try and reflect in ST:discovery (before he left). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamjm Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 7 hours ago, Iskaral Pust said: I like how they extended the mystery, but please don't get so trippy that it jumps the shark. I think there's a limit to how long they can drag out the mysteries about David's past that they've already set up. The season is 8 episodes long, which seems about the right length to resolve some of the questions they've already raised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 4 minutes ago, williamjm said: I think there's a limit to how long they can drag out the mysteries about David's past that they've already set up. The season is 8 episodes long, which seems about the right length to resolve some of the questions they've already raised. Ah. I had wondered how long the run was. TV shows get shorter and shorter every year. Edit: I also still can't wrap my mind around Cary fully. So if she only ages when she's outside, why are they both 8 years old when he first notices her???? I agree that they have made all of these characters really interesting. I'm still trying to figure out The Eye's power. Can he project a different image? Is that how they thought they were talking to the Doctor? Does the doctor even live in the lighthouse, or was that implanted memory in David's ex put there by The Eye? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 2 hours ago, williamjm said: I think there's a limit to how long they can drag out the mysteries about David's past that they've already set up. The season is 8 episodes long, which seems about the right length to resolve some of the questions they've already raised. I think we'll know what the cause of David's psychosis is by the end of the season and which memories he's been editing. There's plenty of other directions for them to take the show - especially with the possibilty that parts of his imagination may be able to escape into the real world eg the (terrifying) angriest boy in the world. Who knows - there may even be parts of him already out there that hold aspects of his full persona that he needs to find. 2 hours ago, Rhom said: Ah. I had wondered how long the run was. TV shows get shorter and shorter every year. Edit: I also still can't wrap my mind around Cary fully. So if she only ages when she's outside, why are they both 8 years old when he first notices her???? I just accepted that Cary is an imaginary friend made manifest - especially when we discovered he is also mentally/physically linked to her when she's fighting or being injured. Therefore the rules surrounding her are as much based on what he perceives they should be. So first time she appeared as an imaginary friend she was the same age. Then as he grew older he thought she'd only age when she's "out". I'm not looking too much for rules once I've assumed she's a mental construct gave form. What other powers do those two have besides sharing a body? Also what happened to the person who could fire folk hundreds of feet in the air with a gesture? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 1 minute ago, red snow said: What other powers do those two have besides sharing a body? Also what happened to the person who could fire folk hundreds of feet in the air with a gesture? That was one of my questions about them as well. Sharing a body has to be one of the lamest super powers ever if she isn't at least super strong or fast or something... which she doesn't appear to be. She just seems like she wants to get into lots of fights. So like Wolverine without the healing, super senses, metal skeleton, or awesome claws. I've also wondered about that as well. He seemed like he would be part of their Away Team. So why wouldn't he go out on the fact finding mission? This place really needs a Blackbird jet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 2 hours ago, williamjm said: I think there's a limit to how long they can drag out the mysteries about David's past that they've already set up. The season is 8 episodes long, which seems about the right length to resolve some of the questions they've already raised. I just read this quote in the wiki page "Discussing future seasons, Hawley said he was open to continuing the story past the first season, but didn't want the audience to get to the end of the first run and have "no resolution of any kind at the end of it." Star Dan Stevens said, "I know for a fact that there are more issues that David has to deal with than the one that we really address in the first season." " So I think we'll get resolution. Maybe the first issue is dealing with getting David's brain in order. Other issues could be the consequences of that or trying to deal with a human nuke. I'm wondering if David has deliberately fractured his mind so that he isn't able to access all of his power - I don't think we've had a single example of him using his powers intentionally yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 3 minutes ago, Rhom said: That was one of my questions about them as well. Sharing a body has to be one of the lamest super powers ever if she isn't at least super strong or fast or something... which she doesn't appear to be. She just seems like she wants to get into lots of fights. So like Wolverine without the healing, super senses, metal skeleton, or awesome claws. I've also wondered about that as well. He seemed like he would be part of their Away Team. So why wouldn't he go out on the fact finding mission? This place really needs a Blackbird jet. she can jump out of windows too! I wonder if she gets beat up and pops back into her host body if she can pop back out ok, minutes later? I suspect that might be the answer to this week's cliffhanger. I guess the guy is maybe a genuis? He seems to play around with tech but I guess that could just mean he's a medic. Yeah, with his "telekinetic" powers he seems like an obvious person to send on missions moreso than Kerrie. I was even starting to wonder whether he was killed/captured in the escape. Maybe I need to watch to watch that scene again to see whether or not he was just a construct of David's. The powers would fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 rewatched the escape scene from the pilot and the superpwerful guy gets shot so they maybe just handwave him as recuperating. He appears to be real - as much as any of them can be considered real. The scene did remind me of the part where david is confronted by one of the soldiers. The camera pans away and we hear a scream and a crunch. When the camera returns the soldier is dead with what looks like bones puncturing flesh in places - David killed him somehow. Then there's the yellow eyed demon sitting in a cave before they escape on a boat... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 38 minutes ago, red snow said: I don't think we've had a single example of him using his powers intentionally yet. I think the teleportation at the end counts, even if he doesn't know quite how he did it, he went from where he was to where he wanted to be using his powers. I also assumed the scene in the interrogation was partly intentional, the pen to the face was reflex more than anything but he seemed pleased when he threw everyone in the room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamjm Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 3 hours ago, Rhom said: Ah. I had wondered how long the run was. TV shows get shorter and shorter every year. It's perhaps not too bad a thing in this case, I think they could have had a few more episodes (I was probably expecting at least 10 before I looked it up), but I don't think this would be suited to the 22 episode network show format. Does the doctor even live in the lighthouse, or was that implanted memory in David's ex put there by The Eye? In retrospect, the psychiatrist retiring to live in a picturesque lighthouse seemed a bit too neat. Ptonomy did claim that he'd be able to identify implanted memories, but maybe that's in a controlled situation where has time to study them. So I think we'll get resolution. Maybe the first issue is dealing with getting David's brain in order. Other issues could be the consequences of that or trying to deal with a human nuke. I'm wondering if David has deliberately fractured his mind so that he isn't able to access all of his power - I don't think we've had a single example of him using his powers intentionally yet. I think there's definitely plenty of scope for future plotlines even once we've found out what Yellow Eyes is and what the stars said to David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 3 hours ago, Morpheus said: I think the teleportation at the end counts, even if he doesn't know quite how he did it, he went from where he was to where he wanted to be using his powers. I also assumed the scene in the interrogation was partly intentional, the pen to the face was reflex more than anything but he seemed pleased when he threw everyone in the room. That's a good point with the teleportation at the end of the episode in the sense he was actively willing it to happen. A bit like how he was trying to escape from the astral plane a case of him trying to use his powers. I think in the other cases it's more a case of his subconscious delivering the super power for the situation eg he was angry so everyone got threw around. Like I said, that soldier in the pilot was suddenly dead whether he actively used his power or not in that scenario is debateable. 3 hours ago, williamjm said: It's perhaps not too bad a thing in this case, I think they could have had a few more episodes (I was probably expecting at least 10 before I looked it up), but I don't think this would be suited to the 22 episode network show format. FX apparenty trusted Noah to make it as long as he saw fit and so avoid filler. Even though it doesn't feel like a lot has happened in the show I wouldn't say they've wasted any screentime so far. I imagine FX was also eager for him to move onto Fargo Season 3 which appears to be airing right after Legion wraps up so I guess production on Fargo required Legion being finished. I've no idea how the show is faring in terms of ratings and critical reception but I'm sure they'd rather have him making more Fargo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martini Sigil Posted March 6, 2017 Share Posted March 6, 2017 I try to ask myself if I would like this show without the amazing special effects... or if it wasn't a marvel show... its confusing as hell, and I know its supposed to be at this point, but this show is kind of like getting stoned and staring into a disco ball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted March 6, 2017 Share Posted March 6, 2017 1 hour ago, Martini Sigil said: I try to ask myself if I would like this show without the amazing special effects... or if it wasn't a marvel show... its confusing as hell, and I know its supposed to be at this point, but this show is kind of like getting stoned and staring into a disco ball Definitely during the entire frozen heart in the astral plane sequence... those jazz riffs could be bouncing right off that disco ball! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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