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Canon Claude

Does fAegon annoy anyone else?

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3 minutes ago, Lady Blizzardborn said:

Agreed. The kid is toast.
 

I checked out their YT channel. I'll look at some of the videos, but I'm not holding out much hope given that they devote two entire videos to why Catelyn sucks, and that it takes them four videos to put together a decent case for N+A=J.

Their channel is by far the best they are incredible

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8 minutes ago, Coolbeard the Exile said:

They are right believe me :D

Then why does it take them four videos to make a case for N+A=J? 

One of GRRM's editors said he uses a three-fold reveal strategy for his big mysteries. One subtle clue, one less subtle clue, then the reveal. They should be able to make a case in one video if they've identified the first two. 

And why spend two videos on Catelyn being the worst character in the series when she's clearly not?

I'm interested in what they might have to say about Bloodraven, but their mispronunciation of Sheira is driving me nuts. :D

ETA: they've got Aenys I's picture up for Aerys I. I hope someone points that out so they can fix it.

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2 hours ago, Canon Claude said:

We get the whole "not dead jk" thing, but also the fact that we will have to sit through a new Dance of Dragons where one side has no dragons yet will be given some kind of plot armour to be seen as a viable threat. And sorry, but that's not as interesting as the White Walker conflict, which has always been meant as the ultimate showdown. The southern politics will just drag on to make fAegon's stay worthwhile and leave much less time for the Battle for the dawn.

Admittedly, this comes from what GRRM originally planned when it was mean to be a shorter series, but it worries me that seven might not be enough to finish the series. And yes I love these books but I'd hope that closure is somewhere on the horizon.

Have no fear, the George can keep developing the War for the Dawn, even as he tells the story of the Second Dance of the Dragons. He really was telling all three stories through Storm, and the remaining two through Feast/Dance. He shouldn't need more than a few chapters to finish the climactic final scenes of the War for the Dawn after wrapping up the Second Dance of the Dragons well into Spring. 

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The way D&D handled Dorne tells me they are not at all capable of reading between the lines. Anyone who could read between the lines wouldn't consider Doran Martell inconsequential enough to die immediately.

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2 hours ago, Isobel Harper said:

That would be kinda "blah" to me.  Now, if Aegon IS a Blackfyre, it would be more poignant to have Dany and Aegon work together to defeat a common foe, like the Others.

I do think they will work together to make a common heir. 

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7 minutes ago, Lady Blizzardborn said:

Then why does it take them four videos to make a case for N+A=J? 

One of GRRM's editors said he uses a three-fold reveal strategy for his big mysteries. One subtle clue, one less subtle clue, then the reveal. They should be able to make a case in one video if they've identified the first two. 

And why spend two videos on Catelyn being the worst character in the series when she's clearly not?

I'm interested in what they might have to say about Bloodraven, but their mispronunciation of Sheira is driving me nuts. :D

ETA: they've got Aenys I's picture up for Aerys I. I hope someone points that out so they can fix it.

Because there is alot alot alot to go through.

...

Watch the videos on Catelyn she really is not a good woman and George RR Martin agrees with Elio Garcia that she is a very missunderstod character.

Why do you care about pronunciantions and pictures?

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2 hours ago, Coolbeard the Exile said:

Aegon is exactly like Rhaegar but he prefers fighting instead of music and chill stuff like Rhaegar. 

I think you just equated the noble young lad to Daemon. 

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3 minutes ago, Praetor Xyn said:

The way D&D handled Dorne tells me they are not at all capable of reading between the lines. Anyone who could read between the lines wouldn't consider Doran Martell inconsequential enough to die immediately.

There's a difference between not being capable of reading the lines, and not being capable of speeding things up without messing them up.
They cut most of Dorne in an effort to move things along. Dorne cannot be done well and quickly at the same time.

1 minute ago, Coolbeard the Exile said:

Because there is alot alot alot to go through.

...

Watch the videos on Catelyn she really is not a good woman and George RR Martin agrees with Elio Garcia that she is a very missunderstod character.

Why do you care about pronunciantions and pictures?

GRRM agrees that she is an unfairly maligned character. She gets accused of being constantly abusive to Jon over a one-time incident that occurred when she was terrified, lacking sleep, and arguably not in her right mind. 

I'm a perfectionist by nature. I don't have a huge problem with the picture. Anybody could make that mistake, and I hope someone points it out to them so they can get it fixed and make the video look better.

Mispronunciations always bother me. Always have. Especially when the mispronunciation involves adding vowels that aren't there. Just a quirk of my nature. I don't discount what people say over it, but it irritates me.

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Sorry to interrupt this most excellent 5 page "who's the daddy" discussion, but to answer the OP, yeah, Aegon annoys me. He's a pawn for Illyrio, Varys, JonCon, and Tyrion. He hasn't made any major decisions, and when he finally does it'll probably cost him his fake head. Oh and R+L=J. It is known.

As a father of a current 3 year old, it would be impossible to make that switch. Unless she's been locked away in the Red Keep since birth, anyone with royal connections would know if Rhaenys was real or not.

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1 minute ago, KingMance said:

Sorry to interrupt this most excellent 5 page "who's the daddy" discussion, but to answer the OP, yeah, Aegon annoys me. He's a pawn for Illyrio, Varys, JonCon, and Tyrion. He hasn't made any major decisions, and when he finally does it'll probably cost him his fake head. Oh and R+L=J. It is known.

As a father of a current 3 year old, it would be impossible to make that switch. Unless she's been locked away in the Red Keep since birth, anyone with royal connections would know if Rhaenys was real or not.

I've had four 3 year olds.

I will give Aegon the benefit of the doubt on how he ends up dead. It may not end up being his own fault. And there's a 50% chance he's not fake. 

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I can't address any of their specific arguments before seeing the video, but I try not to put much stock into solutions that raise more questions than they answer, or raise ones without answers at all. 

Most of all, If Jon isn't a Targ, why do we care about him? Why waste a series-long POV on him if he doesn't tie into other series-long themes and mysteries? 

Any mystery's answer needs to fit logistically, symbolically, and narratively. 

I know ADJ is the fastest way to get Dawn into Jon's hands, but LmL's work establishes a credible alternate route for making Jon (and therefore Dany) a "Dayne", which also satisfies other questions raised in the world's extensive history.

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1 minute ago, Lady Blizzardborn said:

There's a difference between not being capable of reading the lines, and not being capable of speeding things up without messing them up.
They cut most of Dorne in an effort to move things along. Dorne cannot be done well and quickly at the same time.

GRRM agrees that she is an unfairly maligned character. She gets accused of being constantly abusive to Jon over a one-time incident that occurred when she was terrified, lacking sleep, and arguably not in her right mind. 

I'm a perfectionist by nature. I don't have a huge problem with the picture. Anybody could make that mistake, and I hope someone points it out to them so they can get it fixed and make the video look better.

Mispronunciations always bother me. Always have. Especially when the mispronunciation involves adding vowels that aren't there. Just a quirk of my nature. I don't discount what people say over it, but it irritates me.

You got it wrong on Catelyn. GRRM and Elio implied that she is liked but she really is a bitch.

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3 minutes ago, KingMance said:

Sorry to interrupt this most excellent 5 page "who's the daddy" discussion, but to answer the OP, yeah, Aegon annoys me. He's a pawn for Illyrio, Varys, JonCon, and Tyrion. He hasn't made any major decisions, and when he finally does it'll probably cost him his fake head. Oh and R+L=J. It is known.

As a father of a current 3 year old, it would be impossible to make that switch. Unless she's been locked away in the Red Keep since birth, anyone with royal connections would know if Rhaenys was real or not.

R+L=J is not proven dude!

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Just now, Coolbeard the Exile said:

You got it wrong on Catelyn. GRRM and Elio implied that she is liked but she really is a bitch.

Quotes, or it didn't happen.

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1 hour ago, cgrav said:

It terms of the storytelling, it would be so obnoxious for little Rhaenys to reappear. She's mentioned like a couple times ever, while Aegon has a clear significance within the story.

Aegon and his supposed manner of death are mentioned frequently, and usually with the same words no matter who is thinking or saying them. The fact that he's thought of by many present day characters is a strong clue to the reader that is just not there for Rhaenys.

I agree. Rhaenys is dead, and everybody knows it. The way Aegon was killed set up his return, or the return of an imposter from the very beginning. The conflict between Daenerys and Aegon or his imposter was always going to be at the heart of the Second Dance of the Dragons. 

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1 minute ago, Coolbeard the Exile said:

Dont remember where it was but it is in this video 

 

 

As soon as I can find a full free hour, I'll watch that.

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Catelyn is means of demonstrating the contradictions of patriarchy. She's a complex character who is pulled in every direction and reacts exactly how you'd expect someone to react in those circumstances. She's not a strongly strategic thinker but neither are Ned or Sansa or even Jon for most of the series. People who call her a bitch (or call Sansa stupid) are complete missing the social critique offered by those characters.

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