The North Forgot Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 I just stumbled upon this on a reread of AGOT, Daenerys IX The red door was so far ahead of her, and she could feel the icy breath behind, sweeping up on her. If it caught her she would die a death that was more than death, howling forever alone in the darkness. She began to run. "… don't want to wake the dragon …" I'm a believer that the red door actually is in Dorne, could this be another foreshadowing of the War for Dawn? Something like one of the dragons has been killed/wighted and Dany has to retreat to the south, hence the red door ahead of her, which means she's flying south, and the icy breath is a wighted dragon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 At the welcoming feast for King Robert at Winterfell, we get the first detailed descriptions of the Lannister brothers. Jaime wears black on red, and Tyrion"s eyes are black and green. Jaime will play the role of kingmaker for Aegon, who is not really the son of Rhaegar, but a descendant of Daemon Blackfyre (black on red), and Tyrion, who will be riding the white dragon, or influencing its rider, will betray Daenerys riding her black dragon in the Second Dance of the Dragons (the blacks and the greens), in favor of Aegon, who will be riding the green dragon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiveFirstDieLater Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 8 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: At the welcoming feast for King Robert at Winterfell, we get the first detailed descriptions of the Lannister brothers. Jaime wears black on red, and Tyrion"s eyes are black and green. Jaime will play the role of kingmaker for Aegon, who is not really the son of Rhaegar, but a descendant of Daemon Blackfyre (black on red), and Tyrion, who will be riding the white dragon, or influencing its rider, will betray Daenerys riding her black dragon in the Second Dance of the Dragons (the blacks and the greens), in favor of Aegon, who will be riding the green dragon. It's a great description... but red is also the Lannister's color... especially with gold hair and green eyes... the bigger point I thought was that he isn't wearing white. Quote He was more interested in the pair that came behind him: the queen's brothers, the Lannisters of Casterly Rock. The Lion and the Imp; there was no mistaking which was which. Ser Jaime Lannister was twin to Queen Cersei; tall and golden, with flashing green eyes and a smile that cut like a knife. He wore crimson silk, high black boots, a black satin cloak. On the breast of his tunic, the lion of his House was embroidered in gold thread, roaring its defiance. They called him the Lion of Lannister to his face and whispered "Kingslayer" behind his back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 3 minutes ago, LiveFirstDieLater said: It's a great description... but red is also the Lannister's color... especially with gold hair and green eyes... the bigger point I thought was that he isn't wearing white. We see that Jaime chooses not to wear white a few times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 Quote Dogs moved between the tables trailing after the serving girls. One of them, a black mongrel bitch with long, yellow eyes, caught a scent of the chicken. She stopped and edged under the bench to get a share. Jon watch the confrontation. The bitch growled low in her throat and moved closer. Ghost looked up silent and fixed the dog with those hot red eyes. The bitch snapped an angry challenge. She was three times the size of the direwolf pup. Ghost did not move. He stayed over his prize and opened his mouth bearing his fangs. The bitch tensed, barked again then thought better of this fight. She turned and slunked away with one last defiant snap to save her pride. Ghost went back to his meal. Jon grinned and reached under the table to ruffle the shaggy white fur. The direwolf looked up at him, nipped gently at his hand, then went back to eating. Jon I, Game 5 Gold on black are Greyjoy colors. Note how the Greyjoy-colored bitch covets what the direwolf possesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiveFirstDieLater Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 5 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: Jon I, Game 5 Gold on black are Greyjoy colors. Note how the Greyjoy-colored bitch covets what the direwolf possesses. Quote "Not Jaime, nor any other man," said Maggy. "Worms will have your maidenhead. Your death is here tonight, little one. Can you smell her breath? She is very close." "The only breath we smell is yours," said Cersei. There was a jar of some thick potion by her elbow, sitting on a table. She snatched it up and threw it into the old woman's eyes. In life the crone had screamed at them in some queer foreign tongue, and cursed them as they fled her tent. But in the dream her face dissolved, melting away into ribbons of grey mist until all that remained were two squinting yellow eyes, the eyes of death. The valonqar shall wrap his hands about your throat, the queen heard, but the voice did not belong to the old woman. The hands emerged from the mists of her dream and coiled around her neck; thick hands, and strong. Above them floated his face, leering down at her with his mismatched eyes. No, the queen tried to cry out, but the dwarf's fingers dug deep into her neck, choking off her protests. She kicked and screamed to no avail. Before long she was making the same sound her son had made, the terrible thin sucking sound that marked Joff's last breath on earth. Sorry, yellow eyes appear a lot, even Summer and Nymeria have yellow eyes... but the Lannister's are a mongrel family. Or maybe the chicken is the Lannister's chicken? "How could this happen?" Ser Harys Swyft moaned. "How? Even after the Whispering Wood, you had Riverrun ringed in iron, surrounded by a great host … what madness made Ser Jaime decide to split his men into three separate camps? Surely he knew how vulnerable that would leave them?" The Sigil of House Swyft is a rooster on a yellow field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 For a while now I have been suspecting, just suspecting mind you, that the final battle in the War for the Dawn will be fought at Winterfell, and that the forces of men and even a dragon or two (do you really think all three will survive to the final battle--fighting for the same side?) will not be enough to stop the Others and their wights without the lost magic of the Children of the Forest. A volcanic eruption might do the trick, and the wee ones know how to effect such cataclysms. With that said, I reread this passage and had to wonder... Quote Catelyn's bath was always hot and steaming, and her walls warm to the touch. The warmth reminded her of Riverrun, of days in the sun with Lysa and Edmure, but Ned could never abide the heat. The Starks were made for the cold, he would tell her, and she would laugh and tell him in that case they had certainly built their castle in the wrong place. Catelyn II, Game 6 ...whether Winterfell will go boom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 35 minutes ago, LiveFirstDieLater said: Sorry, yellow eyes appear a lot, even Summer and Nymeria have yellow eyes... but the Lannister's are a mongrel family. Or maybe the chicken is the Lannister's chicken? "How could this happen?" Ser Harys Swyft moaned. "How? Even after the Whispering Wood, you had Riverrun ringed in iron, surrounded by a great host … what madness made Ser Jaime decide to split his men into three separate camps? Surely he knew how vulnerable that would leave them?" The Sigil of House Swyft is a rooster on a yellow field. No, no, no... the chicken is Samwell, and Ghost is going to eat him... Quote His eyes stung. Jon rubbed at them savagely, cursing the smoke. He swallowed another gulp of wine and watched his direwolf devour the chicken. Jon I, Game 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiveFirstDieLater Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 26 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: For a while now I have been suspecting, just suspecting mind you, that the final battle in the War for the Dawn will be fought at Winterfell, and that the forces of men and even a dragon or two (do you really think all three will survive to the final battle--fighting for the same side?) will not be enough to stop the Others and their wights without the lost magic of the Children of the Forest. A volcanic eruption might do the trick, and the wee ones know how to effect such cataclysms. With that said, I reread this passage and had to wonder... Catelyn II, Game 6 ...whether Winterfell will go boom? So I'm not opposed to some sort of final showdown at Winterfell (especially if the caverns really connect underground to the crypts and north beyond the wall)... but I don't think you "defeat" the others in battle any more than I think others=bad dragons=good. I think both dragons and others pose significant threats to mankind but the answer is peace not war. I think the last hero forged a pact to end the long night not won a victory. That said I do think the hot water in the walls of winterfell is significant, especially given that there is the one icy cold bottomless black pool beneath the heartree which doesn't ripple in the wind. My guess is that that is where winter fell... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 1 minute ago, LiveFirstDieLater said: So I'm not opposed to some sort of final showdown at Winterfell (especially if the caverns really connect underground to the crypts and north beyond the wall)... but I don't think you "defeat" the others in battle any more than I think others=bad dragons=good. I think both dragons and And? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiveFirstDieLater Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 7 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: No, no, no... the chicken is Samwell, and Ghost is going to eat him... Jon I, Game 5 Haha , can't lie, I was a little happy about dropping a "knight of the yellow chicken" reference! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiveFirstDieLater Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 6 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: And? Haha sorry website does crazy things on my phone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 24 minutes ago, LiveFirstDieLater said: Haha sorry website does crazy things on my phone People good. Others bad. Dragons are a flaming sword held over the world, fire made flesh, and flesh is power. But to the point, Bran is going to tap the old magic and blow Winterfell to wipe out the cold ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiveFirstDieLater Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 12 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: People good. Are we reading the same series? Quote Others bad. And this is how bigotry wins out... tsk tsk haha Quote Dragons are a flaming sword held over the world, fire made flesh, and flesh is power. A cup of ice and a cup of fire makes the shadows go round... too much of either one isn't good for the living Quote But to the point, Bran is going to tap the old magic and blow Winterfell to wipe out the cold ones. Interesting! I still think Bloodraven isn't the three eyed crow, so Bran will likely have to make an escape from his lair before he gets eaten... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 1 minute ago, LiveFirstDieLater said: Are we reading the same series? We might not be happy with who we are, but we are who we are. 2 minutes ago, LiveFirstDieLater said: Are we reading the same series? And this is how bigotry wins out... tsk tsk haha Bigotry would apply to bad treatment of of the followers of Red Raloo or the subjects are King Harzoo since those are other people. Others are not people, and they are coming to end life as we know it. 5 minutes ago, LiveFirstDieLater said: A cup of ice and a cup of fire makes the shadows go round... too much of either one isn't good for the living No doubt. Isn't restoring the balance between two competing forces at the heart of most sci-fi stories? 6 minutes ago, LiveFirstDieLater said: Interesting! I still think Bloodraven isn't the three eyed crow, so Bran will likely have to make an escape from his lair before he gets eaten... Or before he gets too used to eating paste... all kinds of paste, Jojen paste, Meera paste, Hodor paste... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiveFirstDieLater Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 17 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: We might not be happy with who we are, but we are who we are. Hard to argue with... 17 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: Bigotry would apply to bad treatment of of the followers of Red Raloo or the subjects are King Harzoo since those are other people. Others are not people, and they are coming to end life as we know it. Look just because they are different... 17 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: No doubt. Isn't restoring the balance between two competing forces at the heart of most sci-fi stories? Some, especially when things like the seasons are out of whack... 17 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: Or before he gets too used to eating paste... all kinds of paste, Jojen paste, Meera paste, Hodor paste... Ughhh so much paste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 Quote It hurt that the one thing Arya could do better than her sister was ride a horse. Well, that and manage a household. Sansa had never had much of a head for figures. If she did marry Prince Joff, Arya hoped for his sake that he had a good steward. Arya I, Game 7 Sansa not having a head for figures has to be a set up for something that has yet to be fulfilled. She is managing the Lord Protector of the Vale's household now, so perhaps we should expect to see an error of figures? ETA I'm just spit balling here, and I see that two paragraphs later, Nymeria's eyes are described as two golden coins. The first important coin in Arya's arc was the iron Braavosi coin that paid for her apprenticeship at the House of Black and White, but that was not a golden coin. The next coin might have been golden. Was it? I am thinking of the coin Arya poisoned to assassinate the insurance man in Braavos. Perhaps we should expect to see one more important golden coin in Arya's arc? And perhaps this coin might play into Sansa not having a much of a head for figures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 Ah, as Old Nan would likely say, some Moments of Foreshadowing are like old friends... Quote "Look at the arms on his surcoat," Jon suggested. Arya looked. An ornate shield had been embroidered on the prince's padded surcoat. No doubt the needlework was exquisite. The arms were divided down the middle; on one side was the crowned stag of the royal House, on the other the lion of Lannister. "The Lannisters are proud," Jon observed. "You'd think the royal sigil would be sufficient, but no. He makes his mother's House equal in honor to the king's." "The woman is important too!" Arya protested. Jon chuckled. "Perhaps you should do the same thing, little sister. Wed Tully to Stark in your arms." "A wolf with a fish in its mouth?" It made her laugh. "That would look silly. Besides, if a girl can't fight, why should she have a coat of arms?" Jon shrugged. "Girls get the arms but not the swords. Bastards get the swords but not the arms. I did not make the rules, little sister." Arya I, Game 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 Quote "You had best run back to your room, little sister. Septa Mordane will surely be lurking. The longer you hide, the sterner the penance. You'll be sewing all through winter. When the spring thaw comes, they will find your body with a needle still locked tight between your frozen fingers." Arya I, Game 7 Poor Jeyne Poole... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiveFirstDieLater Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 16 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: Ah, as Old Nan would likely say, some Moments of Foreshadowing are like old friends... Arya I, Game 7 Oh that one is soooooo good, especially given my recent fascination with the "arms to keep warm" and "coat of arms" pun! Thank ya! I'm for sure working this into my R+L=J&D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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