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np1234

Gendry and the forging of a new lightbringer

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3 minutes ago, Horse of Kent said:

So one of the main characters is going to be sacrificed to serve the plot of a minor one? Right.

In essence yes. You could have argued the same of Roose Bolton before the red wedding.

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I think gendry will reforge ice after OK and WW have been used to kill Jaime and Cersei. Both being the lions. So if Ned represents water then the journey of ICE represents azor ahais forging lightbringer story. 

He cant do it on his own though, he would never have seen tobho mott reforge VS. And you like you said he has never made a sword before. I think it'll take Sam to learn the secrets at the citadel and melisandre to perform some spells too. 

Surely jon would get a reforged ice, and maybe he would sacrifice dany with it. Since she is the conqueror her blood sacrifice would be the strongest. 

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11 minutes ago, np1234 said:

In essence yes. You could have argued the same of Roose Bolton before the red wedding.

Robb wasn't one of the protagonists, heck he wasn't even a PoV, Arya on the other hand is one of the Big five.

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33 minutes ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

Robb wasn't one of the protagonists, heck he wasn't even a PoV, Arya on the other hand is one of the Big five.

I realise its out there but i thought I saw similarities between the Azor Ahai/ lightbringer story and gendy's current situation 

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2 minutes ago, np1234 said:

I realise its out there but i thought I saw similarities between the Azor Ahai/ lightbringer story and gendy's current situation 

Still don't see it. There is no proof that Gendry loves Arya in order for her to be his Nissa Nissa. Gendry is a nobody in the middle of nowhere. It doesn't make sense for him to kill one of the Big five just because he used to be a smith, also from all we know he knows nothing about magic.

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1 hour ago, np1234 said:

In essence yes. You could have argued the same of Roose Bolton before the red wedding.

I'm skeptical. Even that Lightbringer will return as an actual sword, let alone this situation. And as JQC said, Arya, with the other 5, are more important to the story than Robb.

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Azor Ahai was the hero and the blacksmith. But Azor Ahai Reborn may not be both. Gendry can forge the sword, but it can be someone else's true love who buys it.

That's assuming we need a new sword, or the old one reforged/reactivated. Lightbringer may still exist and just need to be found and wielded.

 

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3 hours ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

Yes. If it has to be a Linghbringer I believe that it is Night's Watch.

I think that original Ice was original Lightbringer, new Ice is just a sword.

That doesn't mean that one of the protagonists will die in order for a nobody to be the final hero.

I believe that is clear that Jon is AAR.

AAR or TPTWP has to be born from Rhaella's and Aerys' line, Gendry isn't.

Jon is not Azor Ahai reborn.  Daenerys is.  She has fulfilled all of the requirements.  Wishing it's Jon won't make it so.  Someone as incompetent as to get himself killed by his own men for treason at the Wall cannot be Azor Ahai. 

 

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1 minute ago, Allardyce said:

Jon is not Azor Ahai reborn.  Daenerys is.  She has fulfilled all of the requirements.  Wishing it's Jon won't make it so.  Someone as incompetent as to get himself killed by his own men for treason at the Wall cannot be Azor Ahai. 

GRRM is that you? How nice to see you here!

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4 hours ago, np1234 said:

From what iv read I feel like Gendry could possibly have a role to play in the forging of a new light-bringer or similar type sword. We are told that azor ahai tried to forger lightbringer three times. The first time he failed, the second time he tempered it with the heart of a lion but he still failed and the third time he tempered it with the heart of his wife. 

So how does Gendry fit in to all this? When we first meet Gendry he is working under one of the few blacksmiths who knows how to re-work valyrian steel but Gendry himself has not forged his own sword as of yet. Just before he is set to forge his own sword events kick off in kings landing and he is sold off to the nights watch and leaves with Ayra and Yoren. 

Near the end of ADWD Brienne runs into Gendry again. We are told that Gendry barely eats and spends most of his time in the blacksmith. Seeing as he doesnt eat and doesnt rest Iv begun to think that he is somehow feeding off the flames in the forge much like Melisendre does. (Although he may not be doing it intentionally). 

This is were things get a bit speculative. I believe Gendry will repeat the actions of azor ahai. Im assuming Gendry has already tried to forge a new sword and failed. What else would he be doing in the blacksmith all day and night. The second time azor ahai tried to forge lightbringer he used the heart of a lion. As we know Jaime is in close proximity to Gendry I believe Jaime will represent the lion. If Brienne gives her life to lady stone heart Jaime go free but I doubt the brotherhood without banners will let him get far. Fleeing them Jaime will stumble into the village and a fight will break out. Gendry will enter the fight with the sword he was trying to forge and stab Jaime with it, but the sword will break after. As for the third attempt to forge a sword. Well azor ahai killed his wife in that attempt. I believe Arya will take the place as Gendry's wife/love. How that might go down and why? I really have no clue but that fact she is a Stark an has kingsblood/ blood of the first men could give the sword power, maybe.

I know this sounds kinda crazy but there seems to be a small bit of evidence linking Gendry to the forging of a sword and I always saw the forging of a sword or claiming of a sword as a symbol of a king or a great man. Anyway I just thought  Id put forward this idea.

 

It would make a fitting end for Arya to die like that.  At least her life would be useful for something and have some value.  She needs to pay for the life of the old man in Braavos and for the black brother that she murdered. 

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This seems more like something people want to happen rather than actually possible. I doubt gendry makes it out I TWOW Alive. Longclaw seems like the most likely important sword besides all the missing Targaryen swords like Blackfyre or Dark Sister which could very well be in the North with Bloodraven or at Winterfell

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9 minutes ago, Allardyce said:

It would make a fitting end for Arya to die like that.  At least her life would be useful for something and have some value.  She needs to pay for the life of the old man in Braavos and for the black brother that she murdered. 

Moral evaluations aside (which are totally subjective and totally your right to have whatever you do) no, it would not make a fitting end to waste away a prominent character,  to the development of which the author has given a lot of thought and page space, only to boost a minor background character at the last time.

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18 minutes ago, Allardyce said:

It would make a fitting end for Arya to die like that.  At least her life would be useful for something and have some value.  She needs to pay for the life of the old man in Braavos and for the black brother that she murdered. 

Sure waste one of the big 5 for a nobody. Does Dany have to die for no reason in order to pay for the lives of the people she has killed?

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Sorry; too much tinfoil for me. That Gendry is preoccupied this one time that Brienne stops by doesn't mean he has given up eating; no chance that he's being nourished by looking at flames like Melisandre thinks she is. That he's busy out at the forge is more likely to mean the Brotherhood w/o Banners needs a lot of weapons and armor work done, he's their only smith, and possibly that they're continuing to expand their membership, not that Gentry's off forging himself a magical sword. And I'm constantly repelled by the obsession people have with slaughtering an innocent unsuspecting woman as a quenching vat.

Plus, Arya is Gendry's "great love"?? Come on. He regards her as both a little kid and a great lady. They get along, but he's not on her level in any sense of the word. You may have to come up with another way of killing her off.

I hope this is not judged "unsupportive" and thus unacceptable. Think of it as another opinion. And seriously - we need that next book!! (hear that, George??)

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3 minutes ago, ShadowCat Rivers said:

Moral evaluations aside (which are totally subjective and totally your right to have whatever you do) no, it would not make a fitting end to waste away a prominent character,  to the development of which the author has given a lot of thought and page space, only to boost a minor background character at the last time.

Uhuh, and you think just because George devoted those pages to Arya that she's not going to die.  She has to die sometime and her useless life would have meaning this way.  Ned Stark was prominent in the first book while Samwell was not.  I think we know who has more importance in the end game.  Just because Gendry has been low key so far doesn't mean he will stay that way.

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13 minutes ago, House Beaudreau said:

Longclaw seems like the most likely important sword besides all the missing Targaryen swords like Blackfyre or Dark Sister which could very well be in the North with Bloodraven or at Winterfell

I've long thought that Dark Sister might be a good match with Arya. It was, after all, originally a woman's sword. Not that I expect it to happen; it would be too neat and sensible.

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Just now, Allardyce said:

Uhuh, and you think just because George devoted those pages to Arya that she's not going to die.  She has to die sometime and her useless life would have meaning this way.  Ned Stark was prominent in the first book while Samwell was not.  I think we know who has more importance in the end game.  Just because Gendry has been low key so far doesn't mean he will stay that way.

Of course she may die at the end -and not before-, just like any other of the other big characters may die as well, as part of the story's climax. But make no mistake, if/when they die it will be all about them, what they did and the choices they made - not in the favour of the last minute rise of a -narratively speaking- nobody. But I see your own feelings about the character is what primarily informs your opinion, so there's no point in discussing it any further.

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7 minutes ago, Allardyce said:

Uhuh, and you think just because George devoted those pages to Arya that she's not going to die.  She has to die sometime and her useless life would have meaning this way.  Ned Stark was prominent in the first book while Samwell was not.  I think we know who has more importance in the end game.  Just because Gendry has been low key so far doesn't mean he will stay that way.

He isn't a low key. He is a nobody, nobody cares about him, there is no character development and nothing to point at him being the ultimate hero.

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6 minutes ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

He isn't a low key. He is a nobody, nobody cares about him, there is no character development and nothing to point at him being the ultimate hero.

Exactly. Characters like Davos or Sam or Brienne could be described as "low key". Gendry is simply a recurring minor character, needed to serve the stories of the main characters he happens to interact with.

(I don't *dislike* Gendry per se, I just find annoying the tendency to overblow his significance.)

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