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Bakker XLVIII - Selected to LEAD not to READ


lokisnow

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8 minutes ago, Let's Get Kraken said:

It's hard to say. There are some events and revelations which highlight the weaknesses of the Dûnyain, but Kellhus is backstage a lot more in the Aspect Emperor books, so we don't know yet whether these things will take him by surprise, or if it's all part of his master plan. I suppose we'll know when TUC comes out.

So he's not even a primary character? A whole trilogy building him up and he's dropped?

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9 minutes ago, YoungBoulheim said:

So he's not even a primary character? A whole trilogy building him up and he's dropped?

He's not really a POV character after the end of TTT. Kraken misspoke when he said that he's "backstage." Kellhus is still one of the most important characters/figures in the story and world but he takes a more supporting role. Other POV characters are the main focus, and whilst Kellhus is the lodestone of attention for many characters and factions, I'm not being hyperbolic when I say that in the three published Aspect-Emperor books Kellhus is only ever onpage interacting with other characters for about 10% of the time.

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50 minutes ago, Let's Get Kraken said:

So, we know that Wutteat was traveling with the Ark for a while before it landed on Earwa, and that the Inchoroi used him to create the Wracu. The Sranc were made from the Nonmen (in one of my favorite Tolkien parallels), and the Skin-Spies, one would assume, came from human material.

I figured the weapon races were made as an act of desperation, after the Ark shit the bed on them and 90% of the Inchoroi aboard died in the crash. But if Wutteat came from another planet, maybe they kept him around with the intention of creating the Wracu. I wonder if we'll see any other "prototypes" in Golgotterath.

There had been some speculating on the TSA board about potential new weapon races. We know for a fact that the Inchies had tekne-tanks and helicopters from the Glossary and Scott's comments. We may be surprised to know what armaments they dig up to face the Ordeal.

My personal theory is that the Consult have been preparing legions and legions of Ursranc that they've been outfitting with decent weapons and armor. When the Ordeal arrives at Golgotterath as a cannibalized, srancmeat-addicted ravenous mob—in one last dark inversion—it will the Consult's forces that will fight with discipline and order in regimented phalanxes while the human army becomes like the "Horde."

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1 hour ago, YoungBoulheim said:

I have one last question. In the next series, does Kellhus get challenged at all? Or does he just pick apart every adversary and conflict with ease now that he's risen so high?

Yes or no.

Not everyone are content with his rule and there are factions that move against him, some of them are arguably effective, but in terms of sorcerous power he seems to be unmatched.

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6 hours ago, YoungBoulheim said:

I have one last question. In the next series, does Kellhus get challenged at all? Or does he just pick apart every adversary and conflict with ease now that he's risen so high?

Yes or no.

It's a little unfortunate that you want a cut-and-dry answer to this kind of thing.  The answer really is maybe.  It would be huge spoilers to explain why "yes" or "no" aren't really appropriate.

On Kellhus' role in The Aspect Emperor, he is still a central character, in fact, the central character, but he is not a POV character.  The series is more about the world in relation to Kellhus, than Kellhus in relation to the world.

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2 hours ago, Let's Get Kraken said:

Isn't a Wracu kind of a Tekne helicopter? It was mentioned, IIRC, that Sil rode Wutteat at into battle.

There is a line somewhere about them having "flying craft" armed with their spears of light. Sounds like a helicopter or a harrier jump jet with some sort of weaponry. Craft seems very distinct enough from a cybernetic dragon.

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Thanks for the commiserations folks—it’s been nuts.  I do not recommend either divorce or the conditions which lead to it (in case you are prone to a certain kind of thrill-seeking).  I am much closer to the end of the whole process than the beginning and that is nice.

I would definitely want to hear Arnold read TAE but I do quite like Kevin Orton's pipes.

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Was just coming here to post this.  Definietely think it appeared at some point in the not too distant past (whatever that means from a long-lived nonman perspective). 

Pre-womb plague Nonmen had a lifespan of 400 years, according to Scott, so presumably the star had appeared within a few centuries of Arkfall.

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12 hours ago, LuckyCharms said:

 

He's not really a POV character after the end of TTT. Kraken misspoke when he said that he's "backstage." Kellhus is still one of the most important characters/figures in the story and world but he takes a more supporting role. Other POV characters are the main focus, and whilst Kellhus is the lodestone of attention for many characters and factions, I'm not being hyperbolic when I say that in the three published Aspect-Emperor books Kellhus is only ever onpage interacting with other characters for about 10% of the time.

Weird. Everything in the Three Seas revolved around him in the latter parts of PoN, so I would think that the story would still revolve around him in AE. He has so much power and control, so I don't get how his prominence and relevance would suddenly just go down.

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Just now, YoungBoulheim said:

Weird. Everything in the Three Seas revolved around him in the latter parts of PoN, so I would think that the story would still revolve around him in AE. He has so much power and control, so I don't get how his prominence and relevance would suddenly just go down.

The entire story does revolve around Kellhus - his plans, his goals, his family and the people that he has betrayed. But he, himself, is not a central point of view or protagonist. 

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2 hours ago, Let's Get Kraken said:

As others have said, he's still one of the most important characters in the series, if not the most important. There's really only one character I can think of in TAE that might ultimately turn out to be more significant than Kellhus. It kind of depends on how TUC plays out.

At this point your questions really can't be answered any more thoroughly without spoiling things, I would suggest reading on and seeing for yourself. TAE picks up a lot faster than the 200 page slog at the beginning of TPoN.

Hm, might? Are you saying someone else will become the equivalent of Kellhus from PoN (from a narrative standpoint)? I had assumed we as the reader were ultimately following Kellhus as the series progressed, even if it's from the point of view of different people (Achamian for example).

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22 minutes ago, YoungBoulheim said:

Hm, might? Are you saying someone else will become the equivalent of Kellhus from PoN (from a narrative standpoint)? I had assumed we as the reader were ultimately following Kellhus as the series progressed, even if it's from the point of view of different people (Achamian for example).

Kellhus appears in like 14 scenes ( and most of those are in the third book) at most in the three books.If you just want him, you are going to be disappointed big time.

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So would you guys say he is as relevant to the world itself as he was in PoN? Or not? In PoN he was an instigator, and there was always the question of what Kellhus would do or how he would react. Is that not how it is anymore?

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6 minutes ago, YoungBoulheim said:

So would you guys say he is as relevant to the world itself as he was in PoN? Or not? In PoN he was an instigator, and there was always the question of what Kellhus would do or how he would react. Is that not how it is anymore?

He's the God-Emperor of like 90% of humanity and the ruler of a massive polity—he's more relevant and powerful than he every was in PON.

But once again, he's not a POV character anymore, and doesn't directly interact with most of the main POV characters.

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24 minutes ago, LuckyCharms said:

He's the God-Emperor of like 90% of humanity and the ruler of a massive polity—he's more relevant and powerful than he every was in PON.

But once again, he's not a POV character anymore, and doesn't directly interact with most of the main POV characters.

Okay, this makes sense, then. But it makes me wonder if he'll ever become more front and center again.

EDIT: I couldn't resist, and I read the summary on Amazon's page for The Judging Eye. Weird how Kellhus still seems awfully prominent.

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11 minutes ago, YoungBoulheim said:

Okay, this makes sense, then. But it makes me wonder if he'll ever become more front and center again.

EDIT: I couldn't resist, and I read the summary on Amazon's page for The Judging Eye. Weird how Kellhus still seems awfully prominent.

Just read the next series already and all your questions will he answered. Then come join the discussion. 

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