The Witcher on Netflix.

[Theda Baratheon]

1 hour ago, Fez said:

I thought Cavill was pretty solid in the latest Mission Impossible movie. I haven't seen much else of his work, but if he's capable of hitting that level of enjoyable competence, it'll be plenty. So long as there's a solid supporting cast, presumably of veteran British stage actors like every other fantasy show and movie.

I wonder if a lot of the negative opinion of Cavill comes from his DC Universe movies, which, considering all their other problems, don't seem like a fair place to judge acting ability from.

NO immortals is a flaming pile of garbage which MAKES ME SO SAD because the director made THE FALL which is a BEAUTOFUL film but Immortals sucked anyway didn’t Cavill date a 19 year old when’s he was in his 30s I mean it’s not morally wrong but it’s a bit creepy but i didn’t even like him before all that...just something about him...I hate Christian bale too. 

[Mladen]

4 hours ago, red snow said:

If this disappoints though he really needs to get someone else to pick his roles.

I think it all depends on whether he enjoys the role. Cavill has charisma, he can do medieval without any problems. Even the depth of general fantasy role is not something I would find him struggling with. That said, I do hope he enjoys his role. Because if he doesn't, it will be all over the screen. Just like with Superman. I think that Cavill would have been amazing "classic Superman", or like something Marvel did with Captain America - making him serious, but also not without fun. I feel as if all the joy of playing Superman has been taken out of him. 

[Werthead]

Cavill was surprisingly decent in The Tudors (and a lot better than Jonathan Rhys-Meyers), much better than anything I've seen him in since, although I've heard good things about his turn in Mission: Impossible - Fallout.

[Ran]

Cavill was pretty good in The Man from U.N.C.L.E, though Armie Hammer did have the more interesting role.

[red snow]

1 hour ago, Werthead said:

Cavill was surprisingly decent in The Tudors (and a lot better than Jonathan Rhys-Meyers), much better than anything I've seen him in since, although I've heard good things about his turn in Mission: Impossible - Fallout.

It wasn't hard to be better than Rhys Meyers in the later seasons but I do recall Cavill doing tortured soul competently in the final seasons.

He's great in mission impossible as a self assured giant of a man which minus the killing streak would have served him well as superman. He was fine in man if steel it's just the other two appearances that were a mess. I'd still like to see him get a good superman solo film. Matthew Vaughan has often been rumoured and that could work (even if Kingsman golden circle was bad)

That said the previous superman actor Brandon routh was also screwed over by the film rather than him being at fault. Maybe it's cursed.

[polishgenius]

I don't think Cavill is as terrible an actor as is sometimes made out, but I don't really get why he's as pushed as he is by the studios either. He's not a great actor and no-one goes to see films because Cavill's in them.

This seems like an odd choice even if he was actually really good though. Just seems to have the wrong vibe for Geralt.

[Werthead]

1 hour ago, red snow said:

That said the previous superman actor Brandon routh was also screwed over by the film rather than him being at fault. Maybe it's cursed.

Yeah, everyone railed on Brandon Routh and said he was awful, then they saw him in Scott Pilgrim and realised he could act after all (and had a great self-deprecating streak).

[red snow]

18 minutes ago, polishgenius said:

I don't think Cavill is as terrible an actor as is sometimes made out, but I don't really get why he's as pushed as he is by the studios either. He's not a great actor and no-one goes to see films because Cavill's in them.

This seems like an odd choice even if he was actually really good though. Just seems to have the wrong vibe for Geralt.

I think the tendency with video game adaptations is that the game sells the show not the actor. It's possibly a mistake eg Warcraft but seems to be common. Tomb raider being an odd exception (and also one of the more financially successful). I also know this is an adaptation of the book but suspect the game is the reason the show is being made.

We'll have to see how the rest of casting goes to see what kind of actors they are going for. 

[The Anti-Targ]

I was on board with Cavill from minute 1. So I'm happy with the casting, which probably means it'll turn out badly.

[Werthead]

Leaked casting sides suggest that Netflix has mandated a black actress for Ciri. This is going down as well as you can expect in certain corners of the Internet.

[Filippa Eilhart]

that will go down well in Poland

[Werthead]

Apparently the technical UK government usage of BAME (the casting agency is British) includes non-British white people, so some have been arguing this more of a directive to find someone from Eastern Europe to portray the role (perhaps to offset the fact that a Brit has been cast as Geralt). I'm not sure that's the intent of the directive.

Someone pointed out that if Ciri is cast with a black actress, that means that Nilfgaard will also have to be cast with black actors, and that means that the power-hungry invading conquerors in the series will all be black, which may not be quite the right tone they're looking for either.

[red snow]

58 minutes ago, Werthead said:

Apparently the technical UK government usage of BAME (the casting agency is British) includes non-British white people, so some have been arguing this more of a directive to find someone from Eastern Europe to portray the role (perhaps to offset the fact that a Brit has been cast as Geralt). I'm not sure that's the intent of the directive.

Someone pointed out that if Ciri is cast with a black actress, that means that Nilfgaard will also have to be cast with black actors, and that means that the power-hungry invading conquerors in the series will all be black, which may not be quite the right tone they're looking for either.

I haven't read the books *although they are starting to crawl up the read list" but is there anything in there that mandates all the people of that race must be homogenously coloured? Unless said race is all about purity and the extermination of "others" i don't see why a nation has to be one colour. British and Americans aren't all white/black/etc but a mixture. There's plenty of medieval/ancient cultures that were diverse as well so the argument of "it's medieval fantasy" doesn't hold either. So unless there's a fundamental reason in the world-building I really don't think casting of one character necessarily dictates all the others.

[Theda Baratheon]

Isn’t ciri supposed to look like an elf as well? I dunno - I’m all for diverse casting but not sure it makes sense with Siri. Why not one (or more) of the important sorceresses as it doesn’t really matter what they look like. Ciri’s appearance is made reference to a lot in the game in relation to other people tho I don’t know if that’s the same in the book - if not then I don’t see a problem 

[mormont]

6 hours ago, Werthead said:

Someone pointed out that if Ciri is cast with a black actress, that means that Nilfgaard will also have to be cast with black actors

That person is wrong. Nilfgaard isn't a race. It's a country. Ciri can be any race or ethnicity found within that country, and other Nilfgaardians can still be of other races or ethnicities.

[3CityApache]

5 minutes ago, Triskjavikson said:

Quick question for the hive mind:  are these books good enough that I should read them and then be excited for this show?  thanks

Yes. Just do it in the correct order.

[Werthead]

35 minutes ago, mormont said:

That person is wrong. Nilfgaard isn't a race. It's a country. Ciri can be any race or ethnicity found within that country, and other Nilfgaardians can still be of other races or ethnicities.

Nilfgaard is an empire with numerous provinces with widely differing ethnic looks (Toussaint, one of the northern-most provinces, is basically France, for example). But Nilfgaard itself is also a kingdom and city within that empire which has a distinct ethnic look, and Emperor Emhyr is of that look. Actually saying that Nilfgaard itself should be ethnically north African is quite logical: it is almost 2,000 miles south of Redania. So if Redania/Temeria are Poland, then Nilfgaard would be somewhere around the latitude of southern Egypt, so casting that way for Nilfgaard makes sense. I just see that as being problematic from a different angle.

Still, it remains to be seen what they are actually doing. Assuming they're following the technical definition of what BAME means, the internet may be getting concerned over nothing.

[Clueless Northman]

9 hours ago, Werthead said:

Someone pointed out that if Ciri is cast with a black actress, that means that Nilfgaard will also have to be cast with black actors, and that means that the power-hungry invading conquerors in the series will all be black, which may not be quite the right tone they're looking for either.

Exactly what I was thinking. Either the North (Calanthe) is Black - Cavill's casting implies it's not - or Nilfgaard (Duny/Emhyr) is, in which case the show would have the unintended consequence of portraying a Black-led (or possibly Arab) invasion of beleaguered White North (unintended, because as far as I can see, the show isn't made by BNP, Pegida or Swedish Democrats).
Or they just forget the whole family aspect of Cira and Emhyr.
Or they assume the whole world is a mix of races everywhere, which would be a tad unrealistic (specially considering the books), but I don't think such considerations ever stopped some people. So, I assume that's the angle they're aiming for.

Then of course, as Theda said, there's the obvious fact that Ciri has a strong element of "blood of elves" in her. Maybe they will go with mostly white humans and black elves? (though elves aren't exactly the noble good guys of most fantasy, they're quite often gray bordering dark side)

That said, if they only did the short stories, that wouldn't be a problem at all, because Nilfgaard is quite a non-entity except for the very last one. But if Ciri is supposed to have a major role, then it indeed means they plan to do the whole arc. She's only adult (well, late teen really) in the very end of the short stories timeline.

Oh well, still waiting for the casting of other key characters, Yennifer, Triss, the Emperor, Ciri, Dandelion to begin with - both to see how they intend to portray the race/diversity angle and more importantly if the actors will be any good.

[Spring Bass]

Making the elves black would be pretty interesting and new. It would add some definite subtext to their plight in the story. 

I don't think making Ciri black or brown would be a huge problem. The Nilfgaardian empire is supposed to be huge and diverse anyways. 

 

[mormont]

On 9/8/2018 at 7:15 PM, Werthead said:

Nilfgaard is an empire with numerous provinces with widely differing ethnic looks (Toussaint, one of the northern-most provinces, is basically France, for example). But Nilfgaard itself is also a kingdom and city within that empire which has a distinct ethnic look, and Emperor Emhyr is of that look.

... I mean, yeah? It should surely be clear from my post that I'm referring to the latter. But if not, sure. 

On 9/8/2018 at 10:03 PM, Clueless Northman said:

Exactly what I was thinking. Either the North (Calanthe) is Black - Cavill's casting implies it's not - or Nilfgaard (Duny/Emhyr) is, in which case the show would have the unintended consequence of portraying a Black-led (or possibly Arab) invasion of beleaguered White North (unintended, because as far as I can see, the show isn't made by BNP, Pegida or Swedish Democrats).

This is a talking point I've seen elsewhere and it makes no more sense when I see it here. It's not inherently racist to depict an empire led by minority people or minority people conquering other countries, even white countries. It's about how that is depicted. Nilfgaard isn't some primitive barbarian horde. Emhyr isn't a savage, noble or otherwise. To the extent that Nilfgaard are the bad guys, we get that view from people who want to be independent - they're not presented as inherently evil. They're a wealthy, civilised, successful society.