[Spoilers] Rant and Rave without Repercussion

[Philokles]

29 minutes ago, Ser Snowflake said:

If I was Jon, I would fortify Moat Caitlin to shore up the southern defense, and concentrate all of my attention on confronting the Night's King.

Why bother with Moat Cailin when an army could just go round it.

 

16 minutes ago, teej6 said:

They'll stretch out LF's arc till the end of the season to keep the suspense and drama going. If D&D really wanted to show Sansa as a player all they needed to show was her whispering about LF in Yohn Royce's ear. The man would be more than happy to get rid of LF. Instead they have Sansa tell Brienne that LF saved them and they need the Vale army. 

Or anyone with a sword as he has screwed over pretty much every faction now.

[teej6]

1 hour ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I see your point about Cersei, but I don't think they would have included a conversation about how she is still a threat if it wasn't going to be important later on. 

This is D&D we are talking about. They can't remember what they wrote/showed in the previous episodes or prior season, ergo the ever changing personalities of several characters. They conveniently forget (and expect the viewers to do the same) what came before if they want to rewrite the plot or a character arc. There's no logic or consistency in their writing so I wouldn't put much weight to that line or any line on the show for that matter. 

[Stark_in_Winterfell]

55 minutes ago, Hoo said:

Sansa's carving out her own path.  She was sent off to wed, wedded 3 times and all fell through. Didn't work out. She won't let that happen again.  Killing of Ramsey was her coming of age.

Sansa knows her power stems from the claim to Winterfell and the North.  And it does belong to her and not to Jon Snow, until Bran comes back.  Then, the resolution will occur.

Sansa must marry to get a title.  Neither Bran nor Jon will usurp the Arryns in Vale.  But Vale is a possibility, so are Riverlands.

She's weighing her options with LF because he is seeking the same.

Oh there is a tantalizing angle I had not thought of. Very good points. In the books Sansa is being set up to wed Robyns heir to the vale. That makes heaps of sense for her to use of to gain the vale.

[Queen of Procrastination]

31 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

They can reward loyalty by giving the Dreadfort away.....and I'm sure there are other now defunct Northern Houses whose lands can be given to "loyal" houses...although my recollection is pretty sketchy, I don't recall many of the Houses in the show being loyal outside of the Mormonts, pretty much every Nothern lord was a traitor and refused to help them.  

Cersei is going to have her hands full with the dragon queen down South, she  has many many more closer enemies than Jon Snow all the way up North where she's never taking her army.

IIRC the Hornwoods and the Mazins (invented house named after D&D 's friend Craig Mazen) helped the Starks. Even if we assume that they and the Mormont's didn't loose a single man in the BotB, I doubt that any of them has enough soldiers to hold the Karstark, Umber or Bolton lands. So if they want to give the lands to someone loyal they are left with Vale Lords and the Free Folk. 

[teej6]

And my goodness! Emilia Clarke is an awful actress. They shouldn't do close ups of her face. She looks constipated in that close-up shot of her on the boat as they come ashore. 

[Queen of Procrastination]

Just now, teej6 said:

And my goodness! Emilia Clarke is an awful actress. They shouldn't do close ups of her face. She looks constipated in that close-up shot of her on the boat as they come ashore. 

I have occaisionally defended her in the past, but she was terrible in this Episode. Setting foot on Dragonstone should mean so much for Daenerys, but she just shows no emotion. I couldn't tell what Deadpean was feeling in this moment. She made the same face she made in many other Episodes. 

[Cas Stark]

I thought her expressions were pretty bad also....she can be okay, I will never understand how or why her best season by far was Season 1, and as she has had more experience, she has gotten worse, same with Sophie,  I'm now feeling that Sophie and Emilia are neck and neck for bad acting, and I used to think that Sophie was almost always good.  That puts Kit as only the third worst actor on the show, LOL, and at least he has generally improved, even if just a little.

[The Bear Who Knocks]

8 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

I thought her expressions were pretty bad also....she can be okay, I will never understand how or why her best season by far was Season 1, and as she has had more experience, she has gotten worse, same with Sophie,  I'm now feeling that Sophie and Emilia are neck and neck for bad acting, and I used to think that Sophie was almost always good.  That puts Kit as only the third worst actor on the show, LOL, and at least he has generally improved, even if just a little.

i think its because they had better acotrs around them 

[Holly Macaroni]

I have some rants and grievances, but I already went through the effort of putting them into an animated format, so I figured I might as well just put'em here, instead of laying them out in text.

[storm.131]

@Holly Macaroni Littlefinger and I like this ;-)

[The Scabbard Of the Morning]

17 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

I thought her expressions were pretty bad also....she can be okay, I will never understand how or why her best season by far was Season 1, and as she has had more experience, she has gotten worse, same with Sophie,  I'm now feeling that Sophie and Emilia are neck and neck for bad acting, and I used to think that Sophie was almost always good.  That puts Kit as only the third worst actor on the show, LOL, and at least he has generally improved, even if just a little.

I completely understand why this happens.

When the writing was better. and the character you're playing had consistent and defineable characterization. It's easier to just make believe you're that character, and method act. She could just act by pretending in her mind that she is "Sansa Stark".

But now, when the characterization is such a mess, it's impossible to do this. You can't pretend to be "Sansa Stark" when Sansa Stark has no definieable characteristics and personality,  You are a different person each scene because this scene requires you to be this kind of person and the next scene requires you to be a completely different person.   Now, this is where experience comes in.  For an experienced actor like Charles Dance, he has played many different types of characters and personalities in his past, he can draw from his past experience to play these difference personalities, and literally be a different type of character as the scene requires.

For young, relatively inexperienced actors like Turner, they can't do that, they haven't played all those different characters and can't draw from them to match the character they need to be for this scene.  When the writing is bad, their inexperience gets exposed.

[Liver and Onions]

So it begins!  

As usual, I find it much more fun to ignore the actual episode and come here for the wrap-up. After the site's recovered from the avalanche of posts, that is. 

[Ser Snowflake]

1 hour ago, Horse of Kent said:

Why bother with Moat Cailin when an army could just go round it.

 

Or anyone with a sword as he has screwed over pretty much every faction now.

The only way to circumvent Moat Caitlin is with a navy. Cersei is currently without a fleet. Even if she allies herself with Euron, she has a closer enemy to worry about.....her brother and the dragon queen.

There is a reason why the North is the last kingdom of the First Men. The Andals had ships then, but they never once conquered the North. If Jon didn't have the WW to worry about, he would be in the most secure position of all the claimants. Jon should build a fleet to protects his flanks and fortify the Moat.

[Lord Godric]

1 hour ago, Cas Stark said:

I thought her expressions were pretty bad also....she can be okay, I will never understand how or why her best season by far was Season 1, and as she has had more experience, she has gotten worse, same with Sophie,  I'm now feeling that Sophie and Emilia are neck and neck for bad acting, and I used to think that Sophie was almost always good.  That puts Kit as only the third worst actor on the show, LOL, and at least he has generally improved, even if just a little.

Funny, I hated Sophie in the first couple of seasons because she always had the same stupid emotionless look on her face. It was when she was finally out of King's Landing that I realize they probably wanted her to have that same look on her face because she was essentially faking and dead inside for most of that time. Since then I have had no problems with her acting.

[Le Cygne]

I think that was sarcasm about Moat Cailin, as the show seems to be ignoring that part of the story.

[The Knight in Motley]

Everyone loved a scoop of Lady Mormont last season, so why not scoop it into every north scene now.

I have to disagree about LF.  I'm betting he pushes Sansa sooner rather than later to move on Jon, and it falls apart and she gets her 'badass empowerment' moment of killing him.  I'm thinking episode 2 or 3, which lets them move on to the larger Northern story of impending doom.

I do also expect them to make it out like it was a mistake to do this with all the Vale Lords pissed at Sandra for 'killing their liege lord' and leaving Winterfell undefended for some reason.  But only as a cliffhanger for one episode, everything will be fine in a week.

[Lady Lovisa]

On 7/18/2017 at 8:49 AM, lakin1013 said:

One curious point is that I cannot remember any scene, at all, where Sansa reflects on her on flaws.  She does remark on always wanting to leave Winterfell, and she does tell Brienne that she should have gone with her the first time.  But I cannot remember any self-reflection, or awareness of her actions. She IS always telling Jon how to behave, or how Ned or Robb failed but I certainly do not see much from Sansa regarding where she may have  failed. 

I honestly believe that she had realised and acknowledged her stupidity (in the subtlest way possible). In season 4, episode 5 she said to Lysa while being interrogated "I’m a stupid little girl with stupid dreams who never learns and I’m a terrible liar so I should always tell the truth". Her statements are more often a salad of truths and lies, and I am inclined to believe she was genuinely criticising herself when she made that statement. Sansa, almost like Cersei, is a good actress.

 

And speaking of actress, I cannot believe that nobody else has theorised that Sansa's "rivalry" with Jon was just a facade/pretense by her. She's tricking everyone (especially Littlefinger) into thinking that she is against Jon and his decisions, wants to have more say in decision-making, tries hard to prove her political prowess (which she has to a certain extent), is Ned's legitimate child and hence, deserve the title more than he does. Of course, she could have spoken to Jon in private or with the council but she's simply putting up a show for LF and challenging Jon in public would make it seem more believable. Look at that smirk/smug on LF's face. He bought it. Sansa advances one step ahead of him. 

I am doubtful that Sansa is that stupid to betray her own brother and trust strangers, especially a man who sold her to the Boltons, though apparently, that's what almost ALL the audience seem to think. I mean, poor girl has been betrayed by multiple strangers, left and right. Even her own aunt accused her of fornicating with LF. 

Sansa's experiences taught her that to survive while being a highborn, she needs to eliminate her threats/enemies by being a great planner, manipulator and actor. Which is why the show keeps making her reiterate that she knows Ramsay/Cersei/LF and 'has learnt a great deal from Cersei'. The glorification of "bad ass brutes" is overrated and underwhelming tbh so Sansa's character is like a breath of fresh air.

[The Scabbard Of the Morning]

23 minutes ago, Lady Lovisa said:

I honestly believe that she had realised and acknowledged her stupidity (in the subtlest way possible). In season 4, episode 5 she said to Lysa while being interrogated "I’m a stupid little girl with stupid dreams who never learns and I’m a terrible liar so I should always tell the truth". Her statements are more often a salad of truths and lies, and I am inclined to believe she was genuinely criticising herself when she made that statement. Sansa, almost like Cersei, is a good actress.

 

And speaking of actress, I cannot believe that nobody else has theorised that Sansa's "rivalry" with Jon was just a facade/pretense by her. She's tricking everyone (especially Littlefinger) into thinking that she is against Jon and his decisions, wants to have more say in decision-making, tries hard to prove her political prowess (which she has to a certain extent), is Ned's legitimate child and hence, deserve the title more than he does. Of course, she could have spoken to Jon in private or with the council but she's simply putting up a show for LF and challenging Jon in public would make it seem more believable. Look at that smirk/smug on LF's face. He bought it. Sansa advances one step ahead of him. 

I am doubtful that Sansa is that stupid to betray her own brother and trust strangers, especially a man who sold her to the Boltons, though apparently, that's what almost ALL the audience seem to think. I mean, poor girl has been betrayed by multiple strangers, left and right. Even her own aunt accused her of fornicating with LF. 

Sansa's experiences taught her that to survive while being a highborn, she needs to eliminate her threats/enemies by being a great planner, manipulator and actor. Which is why the show keeps making her reiterate that she knows Ramsay/Cersei/LF and 'has learnt a great deal from Cersei'. The glorification of "bad ass brutes" is overrated and underwhelming tbh so Sansa's character is like a breath of fresh air.

If there is one thing everyone should have learned from last season, it's that ever time the audience comes up with a theory that suggests there is something coherent underneath the incoherent mess we see on the screen, it always ends up being wishful thinking, the incoherence is never the result of some deeper hidden plot, but just plain poor writing.

 

 

[OldGimletEye]

On 7/18/2017 at 7:21 PM, Cas Stark said:

 She is definitely split personality Sansa, she can contradict herself in a single scene, LOL. 

Sandra, what is your favorite color?

Blue. No Yellow.

[Stark_in_Winterfell]

On 7/16/2017 at 10:16 PM, teej6 said:

This is a rant thread and most post on this thread to rant about the show. 

Ok well why isn't Cercies hair longer yet? I really hate her short hair. Hasn't she had enough time for it to be a little bit longer since she made her walk of shame? It has been more than one season! Shouldn't it be below her ears? Or is she keeping it short to remind everyone what was done to her? It is ugly and Cercie's good looks were a big part of her character's mojo. She doesn't look good with short hair.

so there is my rant. Feel better?