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Lord Varys

FIRE AND BLOOD Volume 1

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15 minutes ago, Takiedevushkikakzvezdy said:

So does this all mean that the family tree in TWOIAF is no longer valid?

I guess. Poor Aeryn.

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8 minutes ago, The Grey Wolf said:

I guess. Poor Aeryn.

As far as Jaehaerys's family goes, it's right about the adults (other than some adjustment to birth order), but yes, the ones who died young either have different names or perhaps have more history to them than we knew. That said, we're seeing if we can get TWoIaF's family tree updated to match. If you've an e-book copy, that would get updated as well.

Edited by Ran

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6 minutes ago, Ran said:

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I must confess that the new Daenerys intrigues me. Revising the birth order and changing a name or two I could have seen coming but completely retconning a character out of existence in favor of a completely new one caught me entirely off-guard.

Edited by The Grey Wolf

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5 minutes ago, Ran said:

As far as Jaehaerys's family goes, it's right about the adults (other than some adjustment to birth order), but yes, the ones who died young either have different names or perhaps have more history to them than we knew. That said, we're seeing if we can get TWoIaF's family tree updated to match. If you've an e-book copy, that would get updated as well.

It would be good to know when the prints with changes are actually out. I waited quite some before I bought hard copies for the previous updates.

Can you tell us anything about those hints regarding the fiction around the writing TWoIaF? What did change there in relation to Yandel? And for what reason?

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I don't really know when new prints hit shelves. It would be nice if you were told when an e-book updated, though. Does it do that? No idea. I could ask, I suppose, if I can be informed on when the 6th print goes out.

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Just now, Dead headofMaelysKinslayer said:

He has definitely best Targaryen name ever.

Aenar would be my choice personally but fair enough.

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I rather like Gaemon. But yeah, Aenar and Aeryn both have a nice sound to them. No doubt George will find occasion to reuse them. An Aenar Blackfyre perhaps?

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9 minutes ago, Dead headofMaelysKinslayer said:

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Aemond is Daemon with the first/last letter switched, which makes perfect sense when you consider the fact that the former is almost a mirror image of the latter in his youth.

Edited by The Grey Wolf

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@Ran

Has GRRM not written out a Blackfyre family tree?

Also, apart from the family trees in TWOIAF and the top-secret Dayne lineage has he written out any other lines of descent?

Edited by The Grey Wolf

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His original family tree for the Targaryens only listed Daemon, though perhaps he has privately made a fuller Blackfyre tree. Maybe F&B v2 will have one, it seems the place for it. 

I don't know if he's created family trees for any other houses besides the Targaryens, Starks, and Lannisters.

 

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Not having any ebook copies at the moment. Perhaps time to purchase some.

The issue with the prints is that you only get new prints when the old ones are sold out, and when you buy online you can't be sure to get the newest. At the store you can look, but that's not an option for me.

I'm still irritated that there was no Aenys among Jaehaerys' sons. He was his father, after all, and they did honor their mother with Alyssa.

But, yeah, Aeryn was a pretty cool name as well. If you ask me, he should have cut the Valerion fellow. What kind of name is that? Was he supposed to be a Vhagar-Balerion hybrid ;-)?

3 minutes ago, The Grey Wolf said:

A Daenerys Blackfyre would be hilarious.

I'm waiting for a Rhaenyra Blackfyre. Still, one of Daemon's daughter could be named after his 'true love'.

@Ran Do you know whether Jace, Luke, and Joffrey were originally the names of Lyonel Strong's sons by Rhaenyra, and where only adapted to fit in the new Velaryon/Strong setting? I found it always odd that George only gave these three boys nicknames whereas most of the other princes (in this history texts) don't get them.

 

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7 minutes ago, Lord Varys said:

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I agree. It would have been nice for Jaehaerys to honor his father the way he honored his mother.

Having said that why is there no princess or queen named after Alysanne?!

Daena would make a better Blackfyre name than Rhaenyra if you ask me.

As for Valerion, maybe he was named in honor of the Arryns? His name literally includes the word "vale" in it after all.

Never thought about the lack of royal nicknames before.

Apart from those three the only ones that spring to mind are Cat, Bran, and Gormy (which I find cuddly even though the character obviously isn't).

Edited by The Grey Wolf

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To be honest, I don't think George came up with the names until TWoIaF. The earliest family tree didn't even have her married to a Strong, and no children were listed by her first husband (a Lannister, if one is wondering) back then. But that tree was from around 2000, so. At some point he changed it to Strong, and I can't recall when that was, but pretty sure he still hadn't decided if there had been children or not.

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@Ran

So there isn't a top-secret Dayne family tree?

Also, if you ask me, Fire & Blood Volume 2 should, like Volume 1, be cut in half, with Volume 2 covering Aegon III (post-regency) to Daeron II and Volume 3 Aerys I to Aerys II.

Edit: Rhaenyra was originally married to a Lannister?! Damn!

Edited by The Grey Wolf

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I don't think there is a Dayne tree, as such. There is an entry suitable for an appendix for House Dayne, but it may just be for GRRM's reference or it may be something he'll publish in TWoW.

George'll write as much as he'd like to write, and no more. Maybe he'll do that, maybe not. :)

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3 minutes ago, Ran said:

I don't think there is a Dayne tree, as such. There is an entry suitable for an appendix for House Dayne, but it may just be for GRRM's reference or it may be something he'll publish in TWoW.

George'll write as much as he'd like to write, and no more. Maybe he'll do that, maybe not. :)

Thanks for clearing that up.

Re splitting F & B V2: I agree. I was just throwing out my personal opinion.

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22 minutes ago, The Grey Wolf said:

Having said that why is there no princess or queen named after Alysanne?!

That is odd, too. Would surprise me if Shaera became another Alysanne - assuming renaming of historical characters is going to become a thing (which I doubt).

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Daena would make a better Blackfyre name than Rhaenyra if you ask me.

Yeah, but Daemon may not have spent much time with his mother. And Rhaenyra was a queen.

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Apart from those three the only ones that spring to mind are Cat, Bran, and Gormy (which I find cuddly even though the character obviously isn't).

We have Dany and Egg, of course.

10 minutes ago, Ran said:

To be honest, I don't think George came up with the names until TWoIaF. The earliest family tree didn't even have her married to a Strong, and no children were listed by her first husband (a Lannister, if one is wondering) back then. But that tree was from around 2000, so. At some point he changed it to Strong, and I can't recall when that was, but pretty sure he still hadn't decided if there had been children or not.

In that roleplaying game source book which came out ten years ago or so Rhaenyra's three sons by Lyonel Strong were mentioned. It is on the Harrenhal history section. That's where we got that. But it doesn't mean that the sons were already named, of course. But it is said they all died fighting in the Dance, so he may have had some ideas about their deaths at that time.

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