Martini Sigil Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 9 hours ago, boojam said: The is a petition Tho methinks Amazon could just a well pick it up or others, I would love to see HBO. There is also this.... http://deadline.com/2018/05/the-expanse-canceled-syfy-after-three-seasons-to-be-shopped-1202388026/ ... so they're allegedly shopping it... But I'm not holding my breath... this was/is my favorite sci fi show ever... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 Quote I guess the real question is... why is there no first-run international happening? There's no reason SyFy should have locked up first-run international when they got first-run domestic. Are there cable networks that carry The Expanse's 3rd season in Europe? Nope. It's a Netflix exclusive. That's why it doesn't make sense. There is literally no way of watching The Expanse legally outside of the United States. You either wait 8-9 months for Netflix or you torrent it. Quote Will selling to Netflix / Amazon be a problem considering it’s available on both? Not sure how the rights work there, but if whomever picked it up had any length of time at all before the other stopped being allowed to show it, that’s gotta be a pretty big disincentive. They could in theory do a deal with Amazon to keep showing it in the US and Netflix abroad, but that seems unlikely to fly. Netflix will want US first-run rights and Amazon will want international rights, so it may also depend on what the existing contract is with both services. They may have to buy out the other company. OTOH, although The Expanse was expensive by SyFy standards ($5 million per episode, twice what BSG cost with inflation) it's actually reasonably cheap by Amazon/Netflix standards, which skew more towards $7 million + per episode. The critical buzz is noteworthy and there's a lot of value to that, plus Amazon can see the cross-marketing benefits of selling the books as well. But it's a bit of a turkey shoot. Given the relatively obscurity of the show - witness the relatively low-key renewal campaign compared to the massive explosion that Brooklyn Nine-Nine, Lucifer and even Wayward Sisters (a show that technically never existed in the first place) have been getting on social media - whomever picks it up would have to be convinced they can make it a much bigger success than it has been so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ran Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 I don't know why Netflix has chosen so long to air it, then. I can understand 2-4 months if they wanted to dub episodes for those countries that are used to dubbing, and to release the episodes globally once that's done. But I can't quite figure out why that would take so many months. Unless it was a cost-cutting measure on their part -- "Fine, we'll buy up the rest of global rights, but we don't want to pay too much, so lets say we air it 9 months after the U.S. instead of day-of." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt b Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 1 hour ago, Ran said: I don't know why Netflix has chosen so long to air it, then. I can understand 2-4 months if they wanted to dub episodes for those countries that are used to dubbing, and to release the episodes globally once that's done. But I can't quite figure out why that would take so many months. Unless it was a cost-cutting measure on their part -- "Fine, we'll buy up the rest of global rights, but we don't want to pay too much, so lets say we air it 9 months after the U.S. instead of day-of." Again, my understanding could be off, but it's not Netflix's choice. Syfy literally paid more to have an exclusive broadcast period. Netflix can't air it in the UK or elsewhere in the world until that exclusivity period has ended. Stupid, yes, but without that premium the show would not have been made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ran Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 That can't be true, though. Canada and NZ have rights to air it there simultaneously with SyFy's window. Actually, I wonder if the explanation is that Netflix bought the second run digital window, with Alcorn/Legendary believing they could sell the show to individual markets got first run and this get more money? But then no one stepped up. The nine months thing then feels like an exclusivity window: 3 months initial sure plus six months before second run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt b Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 6 minutes ago, Ran said: That can't be true, though. Canada and NZ have rights to air it there simultaneously with SyFy's window. Space in Canada is definitely a special case. I believe Syfy and Space have a content sharing agreement, which probably precludes anything else. I can't speak to NZ at all, but maybe that is similarly "grandfathered-in" so to speak? I don't know, and these agreements are very complex. But someone asked Ty about it on twitter awhile back and he said that was the case, so I'm going to trust him. It's certainly possible I misunderstood what was being said, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceChampion Posted May 12, 2018 Author Share Posted May 12, 2018 If it's cheap by Amazon / Netflix standards, one of them should pick it up and increase it's budget! (/fanboy) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caligula_K3 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 Ugh, this is such shitty news. This has morphed into the best space sci-fi show on TV since early days Battlestar Galactica and Firefly, and it just seems to get better and better. I can't pretend I understand Syfy's deal with this show, but it does seem like it's been barely advertised anywhere and that it's next to impossible to find a legal way of viewing it online without a cable package. I hope another network/streaming service sees the potential here and picks it up ASAP, but I'm guessing that won't happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ran Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 1 hour ago, matt b said: Space in Canada is definitely a special case. I believe Syfy and Space have a content sharing agreement, which probably precludes anything else. I can't speak to NZ at all, but maybe that is similarly "grandfathered-in" so to speak? I don't know, and these agreements are very complex. But someone asked Ty about it on twitter awhile back and he said that was the case, so I'm going to trust him. It's certainly possible I misunderstood what was being said, though. Think I found Franck's remark. But as I think about it, maybe what's actually happening is more of a knock-on effect of SyFy acquiring domestic rights. Once they landed that, Alcon (or rather, Legendary, the people who got the rights from Alcon who then shopped them around) refused to let go of exclusive global to streamers, instead shooting for exclusive first run in each market (very possibly because they'd earn a bigger percentage of the returns if they could score direct broadcast deals rather than streaming-only). This would also fit with the report up thread (maybe from matt b, can't recall who) who indicated Franck suggested to people that the delay had to do with the studio trying to maximize its profits. Delaying a deal for over a year sounds like efforts they made to maximize failed and Netflix was ultimately their best bet, but it was a bet that crippled the show's global legal audience. What I forgot is that Netflix didn't sign the deal for global rights until over a year after the first season premiered. Literally aired it the month after. But this means, I think, that Alcon basically frittered away a year trying to land individual deals that only Canada and NZ (and apparently Sky in NZ stopped after the 2nd season) went for, and finally turned to Netflix. Who, I suspect, said, "Well, now what are we going to do with this show a year after the fact? This is basically second run, which means very cheap. Yeah, it means not being able to air them outside the exclusion window, but whatever, we already started late anyways..." That's my guess, in any case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spockydog Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 What a clusterfuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 1 hour ago, Spockydog said: What a clusterfuck. Exactly. What a fucking mess ive been thinking about this all day. I’m well put out by it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 Damn - I mentioned this in another thread a couple of weeks ago about how genre TV shows tend to last 2-3 seasons because once the sets etc have been made and designed it's relatively cheaper to do another season or two and the show has a chance to catch on and potentially recoup the initial investment. If it doesn't it dies. Expanse was a show I mentioned as been high on the chopping block in this regard. Didn't want it to happen though. I can't understand all the ins and outs of how shows get made but if Ty Francks reasoning is correct (which I assume it is given how close he is to the show) then I almost feel it would have been better if the show hadn't been made and we'd been left waiting a few years for it to be funded in a less fragile and self-destructive way. There's nothing about how this show has been distrubuted that has helped it and the fact Netflix has it internationally on reruns while Amazon has it in north america has made it nigh on impossible that either of them are going to bail the show out (unless they buy the existing rights off the other too). It's almost a perfect example of an outdated model for making a show. To ignore international audiences in today's world just seems recklessly short-sighted. And I've always intentionally avoided watching it illegally because I wanted to give the show a chance by watching domestically - figuring Netflix gets genuine numbers on viewers. Guess I'll have to do the "request" for season 4 but again it'll be too damn late as I guess I can't request season 4 when they haven't even aired season 3 yet! What a mess. 5 hours ago, Werthead said: But it's a bit of a turkey shoot. Given the relatively obscurity of the show - witness the relatively low-key renewal campaign compared to the massive explosion that Brooklyn Nine-Nine, Lucifer and even Wayward Sisters (a show that technically never existed in the first place) have been getting on social media - whomever picks it up would have to be convinced they can make it a much bigger success than it has been so far. Both Lucifer an B99 had the benefit of being on regular US TV and AFAIK in the UK at least were accessible relatively easily and quickly via channel 4/amazon/netflix. B99 was relatively easy for NBC to rescue as it was apparently their show first (and they apparently regretted letting it go initially/would accept those ratings while ABC wouldn't) which must make things more straight-forward. Doesn't seem to be the case with the Expanse though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 Is there NO HOPE then? I haven’t been this genuinely in real life sad about a tv show being cancelled in a long time. I’m usually a bit sad but I get over it as it is what it is. I’m well upset with this and I haven’t even seen season 3 yet! I REALLY don’t like to illegally watch things...I pay for Amazon and Netflix and I regularly buy and rent films via YouTube but I don’t think I can wait until autumn to watch season 3 of The Expanse. I want to watch it now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvinus85 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 38 minutes ago, Theda Baratheon said: Is there NO HOPE then? I haven’t been this genuinely in real life sad about a tv show being cancelled in a long time. I’m usually a bit sad but I get over it as it is what it is. I’m well upset with this and I haven’t even seen season 3 yet! I REALLY don’t like to illegally watch things...I pay for Amazon and Netflix and I regularly buy and rent films via YouTube but I don’t think I can wait until autumn to watch season 3 of The Expanse. I want to watch it now I feel your pain. At least the story is still out there in the books, which will be finished some day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spockydog Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 What makes it even more sickening is the fact they've not yet gotten to the really interesting stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 It should have been made as a Netflix or amazon original in the first place Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caligula_K3 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 As someone who thinks the books have completely failed to live up to their promise and that the show has completely improved on them in just about every way, the consolation prize of the books concluding it all isn't really helping me out. Maybe one day we can get a novelization of the show's version of the Expanse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hello World Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 11 minutes ago, Caligula_K3 said: Maybe one day we can get a novelization of the show's version of the Expanse? Did something like that ever happen before? (Not saying it would be a good idea.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceChampion Posted May 13, 2018 Author Share Posted May 13, 2018 1 hour ago, Triskele said: Am I following this correctly that while it's being dropped by SyFy it's quite likely to be continued elsewhere? I don't if it's "quite likely" but it seems silly to leave money on the table when it's already sold throughout the world on Netflix, and national channels in Canada and NZ. As far as I understand it's just the U.S. market that needs distribution. Or isn't it on Amazon too? If the latter is true, I don't see why it even needs a broadcast network. Alcon should just announced they're producing season 4 and further regardless, rather than let the stink of this make the audience assume it's dead and not bother watching season 3. This coming before season 3 has finished airing is ill-timing. Has there ever been a show that's sold everywhere except the U.S. market? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 5 hours ago, Triskele said: Am I following this correctly that while it's being dropped by SyFy it's quite likely to be continued elsewhere? Is it quite likely because if that’s the case then awesome but that’s not the sound of it from how people are talking I wish I’d started watching it earlier but the Netflix wait would have made me so annoyed just like the wait for season 3 is going to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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