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chasing the dragons

Iron Bank of Braavos (IBB)

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So the IBB was backing the crown (Lannisters) and when Baelish was master of coin it was mentioned that they were in debt to the IBB for I believe 4 million dragons which is one of the reasons for the IBB backing Stannis. The Lannisters couldn't have paid this debt because Tywin says to Cersi in one episode that Casterly Rock's gold mines are dry. 

Now the Iron bank, isn't getting paid and we don't know if they know Stannis is dead. 

Isn't it about time they reappear? (I don't think we'll hear from them again)

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Yup.

The crown has no money. The Lannisters have no allies and are bankrupt. The crown handed out most of their administrative and judicial powers to the faith. Cersei did an unspeakably horrible crime, and everyone is aware of it.

 

But who cares, right? It's not like we watch Game of Thrones for the political schemes and socio-economical games, and moral ambiguity! Everyone knows what makes GoT unique, is its straightforward lenient war of Good vs Evil.

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7 hours ago, Holly Macaroni said:

Yup.

The crown has no money. The Lannisters have no allies and are bankrupt. The crown handed out most of their administrative and judicial powers to the faith. Cersei did an unspeakably horrible crime, and everyone is aware of it.

 

But who cares, right? It's not like we watch Game of Thrones for the political schemes and socio-economical games, and moral ambiguity! Everyone knows what makes GoT unique, is its straightforward lenient war of Good vs Evil.

yeah but the plot lines, many of which are based in a political or economic motive, work better when the story is coherent and without obvious holes. Having the bank, then not having the bank return impedes the flow of the story (Imho)  Although the plot now contains many holes and I'd like to see a "Good v Evil"  thread: Who is good and who is evil? The CoF once thought WW were good, the first of the FM thought he was good. 

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I don't know who had/has the fixation on finish GoT in only 8 seasons, and not 10. Thinking otherwise though, when showrunners decide that a sex/erotic scene is going to be comprised by a cockless man, I cannot blame them for wanting to finish in 8 seasons. 

Very good observation by the OP about the Iron Bank. I want to believe they have not been forgotten (like the steamship SS Paddling Gendry) and that the bank will have its due or a new arrangement. 

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I don't think the Iron Bank will be mentioned again in the show.. 

Does anyone remember Kinvara, the Red High Priestess of Volantis we saw in season 6?

She said:

Quote
"Daenerys Stormborn is the one who was promised. From the fire she was reborn to remake the world... She has freed the slaves from their chains and crucified the Masters for their sins... Her dragons are fire made flesh, a gift from the Lord of Light.... Daenerys has been sent to lead the people against the darkness in this war and in the great war still to come."

She talk about the Great War, but I fear we won't likely see her again just like the IBB..

(Am I off-topic:/)

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7 hours ago, The Dew said:

I don't know who had/has the fixation on finish GoT in only 8 seasons, and not 10.

8 is too long - the reason the show is falling apart is it's being drawn out with filler on the way to it's conclusion.

How can an Iron Bank possibly exact it's due from the rabble of humans that survive the Long Night, dragons and Others/White Walkers?

The point of the show is that all the human distractions - all the bickering, war, economics, faith and factions - are pointless in the face of bigger things. The story should be ramping up entirely - the former world of Westeros should be passing away into total darkness and panic already, instead we have to wait until season 8.

Edited by ummester

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We will hopefully see the Iron Bank pick one side to back, either Daenerys or Cersei. They are good cases to argue for both Queens so im unsure of who it would be.

Why would they back Daenerys?

  • Cersei cant pay the debt back
  • 3 dragons and a massive army
  • would get the money back and could negotiate to pay back the Lannister debt
  • Wars are expensive, food for army, etc
  • On paper the better investment

Why would they back Cersei?

  • Daenerys aggressive negotiating nature
  • Braavos was founded by former Valyrian slaves - slaves that escaped powerful families who used dragons to enslave them. 
  • Swopped a dragon for a slave army then killed the masters with the army
  •  Daenerys untrustworthy and unpredictable.

Based on this the likely canditate on paper and to get the money back would be Daenerys. The arguement based on backing Cersei is their own morals mainly.

Edited by Samwell_Tarly

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17 minutes ago, Samwell_Tarly said:

We will hopefully see the Iron Bank pick one side to back, either Daenerys or Cersei. They are good cases to argue for both Queens so im unsure of who it would be.

Why would they back Daenerys?

  • Cersei cant pay the debt back
  • 3 dragons and a massive army
  • would get the money back and could negotiate to pay back the Lannister debt
  • Wars are expensive, food for army, etc
  • On paper the better investment

Why would they back Cersei?

  • Daenerys aggressive negotiating nature
  • Braavos was founded by former Valyrian slaves - slaves that escaped powerful families who used dragons to enslave them. 
  • Swopped a dragon for a slave army then killed the masters with the army
  • untrustworthy and unpredictable.

Based on this the likely canditate on paper and to get the money back would be Daenerys. The arguement based on backing Cersei is their own morals mainly.

I think both could be considered untrustworthy and unpredictable.

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13 hours ago, chasing the dragons said:

yeah but the plot lines, many of which are based in a political or economic motive, work better when the story is coherent and without obvious holes. Having the bank, then not having the bank return impedes the flow of the story (Imho)  Although the plot now contains many holes and I'd like to see a "Good v Evil"  thread: Who is good and who is evil? The CoF once thought WW were good, the first of the FM thought he was good. 

I was being sarcastic

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On Invalid Date at 5:29 PM, Holly Macaroni said:

Yup.

The crown has no money. The Lannisters have no allies and are bankrupt. The crown handed out most of their administrative and judicial powers to the faith. Cersei did an unspeakably horrible crime, and everyone is aware of it.

 

But who cares, right? It's not like we watch Game of Thrones for the political schemes and socio-economical games, and moral ambiguity! Everyone knows what makes GoT unique, is its straightforward lenient war of Good vs Evil.

Your post is dripping in sarcasm, but it became clear from ADWD that it is a battle between good vs evil (or rather man vs the Others).

All the human vs human stuff is a plot device aimed to bring about one thing.  An extremely weakened Westeros in the face of the Others onslaught.  Making the situation seem hopeless until the hero(s) stop the Others and save the kingdom.  Probably dying in the process, hence the bittersweet ending.

So in reality, yeah.  It is a straightforward story that somehow people have warped into their minds as being some kind of shades of grey bollocks that doesn't follow the usual fantasy tropes (only it actually does).

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33 minutes ago, Ser Gareth said:

Your post is dripping in sarcasm, but it became clear from ADWD that it is a battle between good vs evil (or rather man vs the Others).

All the human vs human stuff is a plot device aimed to bring about one thing.  An extremely weakened Westeros in the face of the Others onslaught.  Making the situation seem hopeless until the hero(s) stop the Others and save the kingdom.  Probably dying in the process, hence the bittersweet ending.

So in reality, yeah.  It is a straightforward story that somehow people have warped into their minds as being some kind of shades of grey bollocks that doesn't follow the usual fantasy tropes (only it actually does).

And where exactly do you think the books were heading that was so different? That humans were going to out politicise the Others?

The resolution has to involve the Throne, the weather, dragons and the Others - every human plot device was always expendable because there are so damn many of them. It was never a story with a protagonist (though a good handful were on heroes journey's).

The only real grey that remains to be resolved is are the Others as evil as the humans in the story can be. From everything we've seen so far, it appears not - but who knows, we still don't know what they want, or what their purpose is.

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Ok. The show proved my i spoke recklessly too soon about the show not addressing this.

I'll save you all the trouble of going through the routine procedure, and hire myself a nun with a bell to walk behind me shouting "shame" throughout the next week.

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On 2017-07-30 at 8:31 AM, Styl7 said:

I don't think the Iron Bank will be mentioned again in the show.. 

Does anyone remember Kinvara, the Red High Priestess of Volantis we saw in season 6?

She said:

She talk about the Great War, but I fear we won't likely see her again just like the IBB..

(Am I off-topic:/)

Quite the contrary. Representatives of the Iron Bank are back in the show again. I assume you've watched preview of episode 4 already.

And Red Priestess will be back again, I'm quite sure of that. All these red priestess have quite an impact on the events, I'd expect to see even more of them.

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The IBB scene sontained my main gripe with this episode. Their slave trade took a down turn? The whole point of Braavos was to escape slavery. A minor gripe really but still.

Unless the IBB were just saying this to make Cersei feel more comfortable with them and their representitive who visits Dany (assuming one will) talks of how they support her effort to rid the world of slavery, playing both sides...

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Between Cersei and Dany, I can see Book Iron bank funding Cersei if only because they hate the Dragons enough to overlook the earlier non repayments.

However doesn't Illyrio have a hand in slave trade despite it being illegal in Pentos. I can see Iron bank doing the same thing (though I do not believe any major Braavosi institution will be actively rooting for slave trade)

 

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53 minutes ago, RedShirt47 said:

The IBB scene sontained my main gripe with this episode. Their slave trade took a down turn? The whole point of Braavos was to escape slavery. A minor gripe really but still.

Unless the IBB were just saying this to make Cersei feel more comfortable with them and their representitive who visits Dany (assuming one will) talks of how they support her effort to rid the world of slavery, playing both sides...

I said it in the other thread, just because Bravos is a free city, doesn't mean the IB doesn't invest in slavers bay. In fact, if it invests in Westeros, it makes sense to invest in slavers bay which is closer.

You think Wall St bankers, the IMF or the World Bank actually give a fuck about national sovereignty or the beliefs of the countries they deal with? I'm pretty sure all they care about is return on investment.

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On Invalid Date at 11:43 PM, ummester said:

And where exactly do you think the books were heading that was so different? That humans were going to out politicise the Others?

The resolution has to involve the Throne, the weather, dragons and the Others - every human plot device was always expendable because there are so damn many of them. It was never a story with a protagonist (though a good handful were on heroes journey's).

The only real grey that remains to be resolved is are the Others as evil as the humans in the story can be. From everything we've seen so far, it appears not - but who knows, we still don't know what they want, or what their purpose is.

I don't think the books are different.  It's a fun story and the character development makes it more interesting than most.  But ultimately the story, book or TV, is a long way from being revolutionary.  Although the show has certainly revolutionised TV as a storytelling medium.

The story is about the kids.  Basically the only people that matter are Jon, Dany, Bran, Arya, Tyrion and Sansa.  It's effectively their tale.

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