[Spoilers] Rant and Rave Without Repercussion

[Paid Debt Lannister]

I know this is supposed to have no repercution, but I'll talk one tiny bit about the show only audience that I know (friends basically). Oh and it is kind of a rant as well.

There are people rooting for the Lannisters, yes. Quite a lot of my friends fully hope that she gets captured / killed by Cersei. Some people were even calling BS that Jaime could not get to Dany, calling it plot armour or whatever.

I'm not defending the show in any way with this. If anything it just makes it clear how huge the gap between book and show really is. Book readers usually analyse the story and try to connect all the dots, while tv show fans sometimes just want a 1h weekly entertainment. I'm not judging, just stating it as it's my impression. Many people didn't even know Olenna had killed Joffrey. Nobody questions how House Lannister still has an army (they shouldn't have). And so on

[Cas Stark]

I'm not at all surprised that a large part of the audience is rooting for the Lannisters.....they have the best armor, Queen Carol/Cersei is hugely more sympathetic than in the books and since landing on Westeros Dany has basically sat on Dragonstone and deadpanned her titles to everyone....so not too impressive.  Lena even talked about meeting people who are "Team Cersei".

ETA especially since they made her previous antagonists straight up evil, Stannis was evil and instead of a populist leader supported by the commoners, they turned the Faith Militant into oppressive authoritarian religious extremists so show watchers are assuming KL was happy to get rid of the religious leaders.  LOL.

 

[SerJeremiahLouistark]

13 minutes ago, Song of Zombies v. Dragons said:

The GPS tracker that every army has on every other army has completely defeated the point of any scenes relating to war strategy or the movement of supplies, troops, etc. Imagine playing a game of Risk where at any moment you could teleport your entire army wherever you wanted to and just randomly attack anyone. That is what the show has become. Every episode so far this season someone has moved their entire army a ridiculous distance that makes no sense whatsoever and for some reason nobody ever sees these armies coming or does anything to stop them. Do scouts no longer exist in this world? This is seriously ridiculous.

 

Completely agree with everyone that the Cersei plotline is probably the worst thing going on in the show right now because it makes literally ZERO sense. In a perfect world following the walk of shame Cersei's story would've started wrapping itself up in a logical way and Jaime would eventually kill her (what is what I presume will happen in the books). Jaime's character arc has been butchered beyond belief and is probably irreparable at this point but a few seasons ago we were on the right track. Not sure what happened. 

 

The writing in the show is just garbage. Plain and simple. When the Jon/Dany romance started being hinted at last night everyone in my watch group just groaned. 

My biggest beef with this show right now is Jaime.  Him just Willy Nilly going along with everything Cersei is doing contradicts everything in his book character arc.  I know it's the show version but it's still making no sense to me.  

So it must have taken the Dothraki months to get from Dragonstone to the Lannister army.  They looked pretty good for an army that just traveled that distance.  

[Lord Godric]

32 minutes ago, SerJeremiahLouistark said:

Their minds must not work because I really can't see a scenario where I thought this was a battle amongst good guys on both sides.  Show Jaime has lost all credibility and respect in my mind.  Him just blindly following Cersei after she did exactly what he killed Aerys for is baffling to me.  And I'll cheer when he finally dies.  Book Jaime is way more likeable.  

Agreed. The Lannisters are not the good guys anymore. Jaime is not a loveable character, the show made that very clear the second they brought him back to King's Landing and have made him Cersei's lapdog for the past two seasons. Hell, I was even rooting for Bronn to die a character who does not pretend he is loyal to anyone but gold, and never has. But siding with the Lannisters, going along with them for so long, doing Jaime's bidding in stealing grain from the peasants, and trying to take down Drogon was quite enough to place him in my "please make him crispy" category. 

That being said, I don't necessarily know that I am rooting for Dany either. A character who wants to be queen but needs Jon Snow to tell her not to burn a city to the ground isn't exactly someone who warrants being loved and considered a good guy. 

[SerJeremiahLouistark]

17 minutes ago, Paid Debt Lannister said:

I know this is supposed to have no repercution, but I'll talk one tiny bit about the show only audience that I know (friends basically). Oh and it is kind of a rant as well.

There are people rooting for the Lannisters, yes. Quite a lot of my friends fully hope that she gets captured / killed by Cersei. Some people were even calling BS that Jaime could not get to Dany, calling it plot armour or whatever.

I'm not defending the show in any way with this. If anything it just makes it clear how huge the gap between book and show really is. Book readers usually analyse the story and try to connect all the dots, while tv show fans sometimes just want a 1h weekly entertainment. I'm not judging, just stating it as it's my impression. Many people didn't even know Olenna had killed Joffrey. Nobody questions how House Lannister still has an army (they shouldn't have). And so on

So are you saying that show only people are more sympathetic to Cersei?  I honestly can't see how anyone would be rooting for her.  Blowing up the sept didn't just kill her enemies, she killed thousands of innocents as well as her own family.  And did the same thing Jaime killed Aerys for.  

[Lord Godric]

17 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

I'm not at all surprised that a large part of the audience is rooting for the Lannisters.....they have the best armor, Queen Carol/Cersei is hugely more sympathetic than in the books and since landing on Westeros Dany has basically sat on Dragonstone and deadpanned her titles to everyone....so not too impressive.  Lena even talked about meeting people who are "Team Cersei".

 

 

The show has also just so artificially strengthened Cersei's position that I know of a lot of people who think Cersei deserves to rule because she has outsmarted everyone else. All of the wins they've given Cersei this season have been ridiculously artificial and clearly meant to make Dany's conquest of Westeros harder, but it has made it look like Cersei is this amazing mastermind who knows exactly what she is doing and deserves to win because she is outsmarting everyone along the way. When in reality, she's winning because the show wants her to be in a stronger position to make Dany look weaker. 

[SerJeremiahLouistark]

3 minutes ago, Lord Godric said:

Agreed. The Lannisters are not the good guys anymore. Jaime is not a loveable character, the show made that very clear the second they brought him back to King's Landing and have made him Cersei's lapdog for the past two seasons. Hell, I was even rooting for Bronn to die a character who does not pretend he is loyal to anyone but gold, and never has. But siding with the Lannisters, going along with them for so long, doing Jaime's bidding in stealing grain from the peasants, and trying to take down Drogon was quite enough to place him in my "please make him crispy" category. 

That being said, I don't necessarily know that I am rooting for Dany either. A character who wants to be queen but needs Jon Snow to tell her not to burn a city to the ground isn't exactly someone who warrants being loved and considered a good guy. 

That's a good point about Dany.  

[Lord Godric]

1 minute ago, SerJeremiahLouistark said:

So are you saying that show only people are more sympathetic to Cersei?  I honestly can't see how anyone would be rooting for her.  Blowing up the sept didn't just kill her enemies, she killed thousands of innocents as well as her own family.  And did the same thing Jaime killed Aerys for.  

The problem is that even Jaime is not bothered by this, so why should show-only fans be? If Jaime had shown more reservations about this. If he drew parallels to the Mad King and said he killed him for less, then I think the audience would too. But they've completely destroyed Jaime's moral compass. 

[UnViserion]

1 hour ago, SeanF said:

As Old Gimlet Eye said, one has to assume that Dothraki hordes and dragons are so common in Westeros that it didn't occur to the scouts that they might attack.

 

love it  

[Rockroi]

25 minutes ago, Paid Debt Lannister said:

Book readers usually analyse the story and try to connect all the dots, while tv show fans sometimes just want a 1h weekly entertainment. I'm not judging, just stating it as it's my impression. Many people didn't even know Olenna had killed Joffrey. Nobody questions how House Lannister still has an army (they shouldn't have). And so on

You are not being judgmental; you are merely explaining factual observations in a cogent and simple manner. 

You will likely be banned from the boards within the hour.  

[SerJeremiahLouistark]

6 minutes ago, Lord Godric said:

The problem is that even Jaime is not bothered by this, so why should show-only fans be? If Jaime had shown more reservations about this. If he drew parallels to the Mad King and said he killed him for less, then I think the audience would too. But they've completely destroyed Jaime's moral compass. 

And then he charges at Dany in an act of complete bravado and insanity, I assume because he saw a chance to end the war and save thousands.  Yet, his sister murdered thousands and he is ok with it.  Just strange what they have done with him.  

[Nerevanin]

1 hour ago, Ser Quork said:

Yes, I do mean back in S.2 when LF met Roose to plot the Red Wedding.  Arya wouldn't have understood it at the time (why a Lannister courtier was meeting one of Robb's bannermen) but it would be great to see her working that out.  As a related point, does declaring for House Stark absolve him of his complicity in arranging the murder against guest right of so many, including Arya's mother and brother? I don't think so.  Especially if it also becomes known about his personal betrayal of Ned.

Littlefinger doesn't meet Roose prior to season 5 though, does he? ... I admit that I don't remember everything but I quickly checked gameofthrones.wikia.com and it confirms my memories. I'm genuinly confused now.

[SerJeremiahLouistark]

Arya will kill Baelish.  

[ramla]

1 hour ago, Rockroi said:

Because there is no way to stop this train now.  It was FUCKING AWESOME seeing a dragon burn people alive.  But make no mistake- the show is no longer tethered to conventional devices like layered story-telling, character development or time and space; the show simply needs to stuff everything out there and does not acre if it makes any sense or comes out even in the right order. 

 

Yes! the show is on rails now. Its living now, only for the big moments, and the writing is tailored to get from point A to B as quickly as possible. The lack of Character Development is huge tho. They seem to decide on an outcome and then force it to happen, no matter where in westeros one is and when.

They really need to develop something between, Dany and Jon. Not just say oh she'd cute and her saying he's cute, lets date!.Of course the story will be well layered in the books, but its going to really make the show unbearable if the Dany /Jon relationship is hurried. And it seems it will be.

This train is definitely rolling or barrelling down the the final episode of next season. Altogether there's 10 episodes left to rap up all lose ends. Dany/Jon Relationship, Defeat of Cersei, Defeat of the white walkers, Parentage of Jon. All in ten episodes and no real development towards these plot points.

Show reminds me of reading a soon to be cancelled Manga, where they try to wrap up a long story in a few chapters... unsuccessfully i may add.

[ramla]

I wanna know if I heard correct, Did they say, that the Lanisters left Casterly rock and took all the food??

[Cas Stark]

14 minutes ago, Lord Godric said:

The show has also just so artificially strengthened Cersei's position that I know of a lot of people who think Cersei deserves to rule because she has outsmarted everyone else. All of the wins they've given Cersei this season have been ridiculously artificial and clearly meant to make Dany's conquest of Westeros harder, but it has made it look like Cersei is this amazing mastermind who knows exactly what she is doing and deserves to win because she is outsmarting everyone along the way. When in reality, she's winning because the show wants her to be in a stronger position to make Dany look weaker. 

They also mitigated her worst decisions.  When she stiffs the IB it's because she is literally broke, and as I said before, the Faith in the show are bad guys, only in maybe the very first scene is there a sense that the High Sparrow is speaking for the multitudes, but they spent a lot more time telling the audience OMG!  Religious Extremists! OMG!  Homophobic!! Sexist!!!   So, show watchers can be forgiven for not caring that they're all dead.....  

I understand that w/out Aegon they have just given Cersei all of his power and allies, etc.  But, their problem is the writing has become so simplistic that the only way they can apparently come up with to slow Dany down is force her to make a series of obviously stupid as fuck decisions, and for everything to go Cersei's way.

Irritating.

[Paid Debt Lannister]

25 minutes ago, SerJeremiahLouistark said:

So are you saying that show only people are more sympathetic to Cersei?  I honestly can't see how anyone would be rooting for her.  Blowing up the sept didn't just kill her enemies, she killed thousands of innocents as well as her own family.  And did the same thing Jaime killed Aerys for.  

I'm saying what I see from my friends' opinions, and also, from comments I read on show only sections of forums and youtube videos. I'd go as far as to say that the show only fanbase is currently divided between Teams Daenerys and Cersei (when any sane person would expect Team Daenerys to have the bigger support from the fandom, right? WRONG)

[Lockjaw of House Boltagon]

6 minutes ago, ramla said:

I wanna know if I heard correct, Did they say, that the Lanisters left Casterly rock and took all the food??

Yep. 

Characters are basically treating castles and strongholds like Monopoly pieces. Like, Stannis leaves Dragonstone to gather dust and now the Lannisters "sacrifice" Casterly Rock for "strategy" like they're playing Yugioh and setting up trap cards. 

[SerJeremiahLouistark]

4 minutes ago, Paid Debt Lannister said:

I'm saying what I see from my friends' opinions, and also, from comments I read on show only sections of forums and youtube videos. I'd go as far as to say that the show only fanbase is currently divided between Teams Daenerys and Cersei (when any sane person would expect Team Daenerys to have the bigger support from the fandom, right? WRONG)

I think people are getting tired of the way they have portrayed Dany.  So I can see why there would be an anti Dany camp.  I just can't figure out why there is a pro Cersei camp.  Bitch is a fucking mass murderer and it's not like she is even a likeable one like Euron is.  At least he is funny as hell.  Cersei isnt even funny.  

[Ser Quork]

1 hour ago, Nerevanin said:

Littlefinger doesn't meet Roose prior to season 5 though, does he? ... I admit that I don't remember everything but I quickly checked gameofthrones.wikia.com and it confirms my memories. I'm genuinly confused now.

Gah, I forgot they swapped Tywin and Roose in the show.  D'oh.