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Lady Fevre Dream

[Spoilers] Rant and Rave Without Repercussion

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9 hours ago, Ser Morbid said:

Today I was trying to point out some major logic breaking that took place in this and previous seasons to some random internet show-watchers, only to be ganged with sentences like : "It's fantasy , there is no place for logic there". I just wrote "Ok." and never looked back , what is wrong with people ? Thanks god for this forum otherwise I would feel like I am the only one in this harsh world where this equation applies -> badass / retarded  > smart / continuity / intrigue. At least this episode didn't have Redneck Euron in it. Thanks Rhollor for that.

I didnt' even realize that........but that must be why I wasn't cringing near as much as usual this past episode.  This Euron gives me the shudders, and it's not from fear. 

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9 minutes ago, Greywater-Watch said:

Good thing: As after season 4 the show became such a crap, in a few years somone might feel tempted to put the real story into film again.

I hope so.

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10 hours ago, Ser Morbid said:

Today I was trying to point out some major logic breaking that took place in this and previous seasons to some random internet show-watchers, only to be ganged with sentences like : "It's fantasy , there is no place for logic there". I just wrote "Ok." and never looked back , what is wrong with people ? Thanks god for this forum otherwise I would feel like I am the only one in this harsh world where this equation applies -> badass / retarded  > smart / continuity / intrigue. At least this episode didn't have Redneck Euron in it. Thanks Rhollor for that.

The problem with this is that the early seasons did deal with these things and that was one of the things that made the show great.  Its one thing for a show that never bothered to be consistent, all of this would be nitpicking then.  But when the characters become cartoon versions of themselves because the writing staff phones it in, it very much is worth pointing out and is a valid point.

The people sucking the show off now never cared for continuity and are glad it's gone, up until the moment some kind of continuity appears just because the story is backed into a corner.  Then its 'badass'.

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3 hours ago, Lockjaw of House Boltagon said:

This is one instance where I have to side with D&D. Penrose was a good character, sure, but I remember the non-readers didn't like the shadowbaby all that much. They felt it came out of nowhere and was sort of a Deus Ex Machina. So they would've had trouble accepting one shadowbaby, let alone two. 

Precisely because in the books it was set up properly and the event foreshadowed, first you have Renly's bizzare death, which is unexplained, then later  Davos withnesses the birth of the shadowbaby, and the readers goes "whoah, I bet that's what killed Renly too!".

In the show the shadowbaby just comes out of nowhere and completely unexplained, and you had no idea if Melisandre can do it once only or every night.

 

 

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6 hours ago, Ser Didymus said:

considering the mountains of garbage they are currently "accepting" from the show, i think they could've handled two shadows if it meant meeting a truly memorable character.

Maybe, but that was some streamlining I could get behind. 

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I think that the battle this week is an example of what might have been.  I felt the battle well done all things considered.  yes there were definitely some nitpicky things like the lack of scouts and bronn knocking Jaime into deep water, but I think all in all it was done well. A battle scene like this has to be both epic and personal.  Epic to experience the grandness of the scene, the magnitude of the actions, etc.  and personal to give the viewer individuals to connect with and vicariously experience the action and someone to root for or against.  

I think they could have had a shot or two of the horde of dothraki attacking a shield wall (a CGI shot for 2 or 3 seconds would have been quite effective).  This would have helped with the epic nature of the battle, but the shots they did have did give some hint at it.  In a battle scene it is important to establish the magnitude of what is at stake.  This was done quite well with the fire bombs being dropped-very powerful. 

You also had some characterization given to a couple of minor characters that even had a short arc-i.e. Dickon Tarley being dissed by Bronn but coming back to save him.  Jaime and Lord Tarley ordering the troops around.  It could have been a little better if some extras were shown shitting their pants in fear at the dragon, but it was well handled as it was.  Of course you are going to have heroics, but both Bronn and Jaime and Dany experienced real danger, all of which hits the personal level.  And importantly you could tell what was going on in the action, who was doing what and when and why.  

Compare that to the Battle of the Bastards last year.  You had the epic nature of the battle shown and a unique take on battle with a huge scrum.  But there was very little personal nature to it other than Jon, though yes it was Jon's story, but his was really the only perspective shown for much of the battle, beyond Tormund killing that random Karstark(?). Despite the battle itself being quite personal the lack of individualization of the players loses a good deal of the impact.  Jon's opponent Ramsey was detached from all the action.

I would compare this battle to the Ride of the Rohan from LotR, you had an epic charge, Eomer, Eowyn, Théoden, Merry, even tertiary characters are named like a couple of Théoden's captains.  On the other side you had the arrival of the King of the Nine Riders.  The battle quickly devolved into individual actions that the viewer could relate to.  The main difference being the quality of a movie vs the quality of a TV show.  

I think GoT would have been better served with this length of battle and more consistent character development around them.

 

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While I liked the cinematography of the battle a lot, the tactics just had me (as a military history fantatic) shaking my head and rolling my eyes.

The Dorthraki:

-Sure we'll charge right into massed up infantry lines with braced spears

-Yeah let's bring our Horse-archers to bear, but lets wait untill they are practically within melee range before shooting and lets have them unnesesarily show off their circus riding skills 

-Lets use oversized sickles against guys wearing mail armour, I'm sure it'll work, especially if we dual-wield them!!!11 (though granted, the Arakhs are somewhat GRRM's fault as well, still dumb as hell)

-and lets jump of our horses after charging through the lines for some reason! I'm sure our horses will not get lost in the confusion at all...

-lets wear no armour at all except a woolen jerkin and fuzzy riding pants, oh yeah and some studded leather biker gear.

The Lannisters:

-Sure, we'll form a practically single-file line to face charging horseman. It's not like a block would be way better right?

-You know that Ballista/Skorpion we brought with us? Let's leave it completely unmanned! And then lets not use our most powerful support-weapon as an anti-personnel weapon when the enemy is perfectly positioned on flat ground.

-And most importantly: How the f did these guys get caught unawares by a screaming horde of savages on horses, accompanied by a f-ing dragon!? It must've taken weeks to ferry them over from Dragonstone, at the very least! You can hear such an army coming for miles too, if you aren't to busy chuckling at immature dick-jokes ofc...

 

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I have to admit, it is very touching how Bran, Sansa and Arya are mourning the loss of poor Rickon.

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3 minutes ago, SerMixalot said:

I have to admit, it is very touching how Bran, Sansa and Arya are mourning the loss of poor Rickon.

Who?

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12 hours ago, legba11 said:

If the show runners read this and then this happens in Season 8, I am finding you and going Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back on you...

Lol. You really think they'd do that? I mean after Ed Sheeran being on the show I guess LeBron appearing isn't out of the question but I think they know enough not to bring basketball into it. I hope. 

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4 minutes ago, SerMixalot said:

Lord Tarley's son.

It was sarcasm m8. I know who Rickon is. Unlike many people I fear. 

 

At least he might live in the books...

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21 minutes ago, Snormund said:

It was sarcasm m8. I know who Rickon is. Unlike many people I fear. 

 

At least he might live in the books...

I know I was doubling down on your joke.

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23 minutes ago, Snormund said:

It was sarcasm m8. I know who Rickon is. Unlike many people I fear. 

 

At least he might live in the books...

Oh no, Sermixalot was straight up sarcasm. You just missed it.....

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On 8/6/2017 at 7:30 PM, falcotron said:

OK, the battle was a lot of fun, but lots of things wrong with it. First, the two big ones:

  • The whole point of this battle was to recover the food and gold taken from Highgarden. So Dany spends most of the battle burninating the supply train carrying that food (too late for the gold, but that's not her fault).
  • Who could possibly man this artillery piece? Maybe our artillery expert? Or at least a crossbowman? No, no, we need the best swordsman, because swords, scorpions, exact same skill set.

Also, it bothers me that the scorpion worked. Not as much as I expected it to bother me, but still, if heavy artillery can't pierce the scales of a full-grown dragon, how exactly can 1000-year-out-of-date light artillery do it? Qyburn didn't give us any implication that this was magical or anything, it's just a scorpion. You'd think someone would have noticed during, say, Aegon's Conquest, or the massive Rhoynar-Dothraki wars, that you could take dragons down this way.

And here's all the smaller things:

  • The gold being at the front of the train, and making it through the gates of KL before the battle, even though KL is nowhere in sight of the army… it's not really impossible or anything, but it's a hell of a coincidence.
  • Once again, Dany uses a single-unit army for no apparent reason. Why not bring her sellswords?
  • The Dothraki charge directly at a wall of set shields and spears. Two separate times. Even though Dany has already given them a break the first time, and the ends of the line have collapsed the second time. Maybe they were doing it purely to give the Lannisters a fighting chance?
  • I loved seeing archers, and finally horse archers, but they were used very stupidly. The Dothraki wait until their cavalry are already in the melee to fire into it. The Lannisters wait until the enemy cavalry is 2 feet away to fire, and then do nothing; they don't even bother trying to fire at the horse archers.
  • That's a convenient hill for Tyrion and the Dothraki commanders to stand on and get a perfect view of the entire field. Wouldn't it have been even more convenient to put archers on the slope of it?
  • Why are the Dothraki commanders, who lead from the front, standing on that hill with Tyrion instead?
  • Jaime twice stands around gaping with people fighting 10 feet away, and nobody bothers him.
  • Nobody but Jaime even looks at the downed dragon. Partly that's because Dany inexplicably landed in front of him after circling widely, but that's just as dumb.
  • Why does Jaime wait so long before charging at Dany?
  • Jaime's army, despite nobody rallying them, and their commander off to the side arguing about whether he should flee, decides to fight to the death instead of breaking and running for the hills.

LOL I was so in love with this episode I didn't notice most of these nitpicks, but yeah I can see it now. One thing though, I thought Dany left her sell swords to guard Mereen? I think she only brought the Unsullied and Dothraki with her to Westeros. My one issue: why did Jaime try to charge Dany while she stood next to a very angry dragon? At least the writers had Tyrion mutter "F...cking idiot."

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1 hour ago, Snormund said:

It was sarcasm m8. I know who Rickon is. Unlike many people I fear. 

 

At least he might live in the books...

No new book deaths if no more books come out!

:D

:(

Oh I've got Rickon as a lock to survive the books, which is part of why his death in the show surprised and irritated me so.

 

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