Jump to content

Longclaw [spoilers, probably]


Katleesi

Recommended Posts

 If Ser Jorah shows up on Dragonstone while Jon is hanging about with Longclaw, does Jon give the sword to Jorah? Jon needs Valerian steel to fight walkers, but he's too MF honorable, and knows it's a Mormont sword.

On the other hand, he didn't offer it up to Lady Mormont, who probably deserves it more.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No, he won't and Jorah won't bring it up either. That Jeor Mormont gifted Jon an ancient family heirloom makes zero sense in both the show and the books. But that's what happened because it was important for Jon to get a special sword as part of his hero's journey.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Pecan said:

No, he won't and Jorah won't bring it up either. That Jeor Mormont gifted Jon an ancient family heirloom makes zero sense in both the show and the books. But that's what happened because it was important for Jon to get a special sword as part of his hero's journey.

Uh.. it makes perfect sense. Jeor Mormont was a very honorable man who took the black in Jorah's place since Jorah fled Westeros.  

Jon saved him from wights so as a sign of appreciation he gave the sword to Jon. Makes sense to me. 

What I don't get is why Jeor brought the sword with him to the wall in the first place. If Ned had taken the black back in book 1, would he have brought Ice?  Seems like he probably would have left it at Winterfell.  

Maybe for Jeor, since he was paying for his son's sins, he brought Longclaw as additional cost?  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Lurid Jester said:

Uh.. it makes perfect sense. Jeor Mormont was a very honorable man who took the black in Jorah's place since Jorah fled Westeros.  

Jon saved him from wights so as a sign of appreciation he gave the sword to Jon. Makes sense to me. 

What I don't get is why Jeor brought the sword with him to the wall in the first place. If Ned had taken the black back in book 1, would he have brought Ice?  Seems like he probably would have left it at Winterfell.  

Maybe for Jeor, since he was paying for his son's sins, he brought Longclaw as additional cost?  

That part you spoke of makes sense.

The part that doesn't really make sense is why Jeor, upon leaving to go to the wall to take the black, would take his family's heirloom sword with him. It was in his family's possession for generations, and he was leaving for the wall, forsaking his name/titles/possessions. Why did he take the sword, which by all accounts is more valuable than the entire worth of many houses? He should have left it in the Mormont family on Bear island, not taken it with him to the north. It's the Mormont family sword.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 8/10/2017 at 6:49 PM, Katleesi said:

 

 If Ser Jorah shows up on Dragonstone while Jon is hanging about with Longclaw, does Jon give the sword to Jorah? Jon needs Valerian steel to fight walkers, but he's too MF honorable, and knows it's a Mormont sword.

 

 

No. Jorah disgraced the family name and has no claim to it. As you stated the only person who has any type of claim would be Lady Mormon, but she would not ask as her father gave it to Jon.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

50 minutes ago, mykeuva said:

That part you spoke of makes sense.

The part that doesn't really make sense is why Jeor, upon leaving to go to the wall to take the black, would take his family's heirloom sword with him. It was in his family's possession for generations, and he was leaving for the wall, forsaking his name/titles/possessions. Why did he take the sword, which by all accounts is more valuable than the entire worth of many houses? He should have left it in the Mormont family on Bear island, not taken it with him to the north. It's the Mormont family sword.

He could take the Black, take the sword with him, when his watch is ended the Night's Watch sends the sword back to the Mormonts, not rocket science 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, TheonGreyjoy said:

By all rights, Longclaw belongs to Jon. It was given to him by its previous owner and it is Jons to keep or to give away as he pleases

It was Lord Mormont's decision to give it to Jon.. The Weserosi tradition would give it to Jorah, but Jeor chose Jon..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 8/10/2017 at 6:49 PM, Katleesi said:

 If Ser Jorah shows up on Dragonstone while Jon is hanging about with Longclaw, does Jon give the sword to Jorah? Jon needs Valerian steel to fight walkers, but he's too MF honorable, and knows it's a Mormont sword.

On the other hand, he didn't offer it up to Lady Mormont, who probably deserves it more.  

Oh dear, you are forgetting that Jon is the prince (or princess) who was promised. He will be getting a better sword soon enough.

Also Jon has just captured Jamie who was carrying widow's wail which is the reforged remains of Ice. It is thus properly the property of house Stark. 

So Jon is going to have enough Valerian swords to start on a throne of them at this rate.

The books make plain that there is a whole tradition round the swords and the great houses make great efforts to return them to their owners even after defeating them in battle. So it would probably be understood that Longclaw would return to its family on Jon's death. So giving it to him would not lose it from the family permanently.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

51 minutes ago, hallam said:

Oh dear, you are forgetting that Jon is the prince (or princess) who was promised. He will be getting a better sword soon enough.

Also Jon has just captured Jamie who was carrying widow's wail which is the reforged remains of Ice. It is thus properly the property of house Stark. 

So Jon is going to have enough Valerian swords to start on a throne of them at this rate.

The books make plain that there is a whole tradition round the swords and the great houses make great efforts to return them to their owners even after defeating them in battle. So it would probably be understood that Longclaw would return to its family on Jon's death. So giving it to him would not lose it from the family permanently.

My dear friend who told you that Jon is the prince that was promised?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

57 minutes ago, hallam said:

The books make plain that there is a whole tradition round the swords and the great houses make great efforts to return them to their owners even after defeating them in battle. So it would probably be understood that Longclaw would return to its family on Jon's death. So giving it to him would not lose it from the family permanently.

I always assumed Jon would have the blade returned on his death, same gos for Mormont, who incidentally did leave longclaw for his son, and only got it back after his exile, still a little odd it did not stay on bear island

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, TheMachine said:

No. Jorah disgraced the family name and has no claim to it. As you stated the only person who has any type of claim would be Lady Mormon, but she would not ask as her father gave it to Jon.

 

Wasn't Jeor Lyanna Mormont's great-uncle? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, the Greenleif Stark said:

He could take the Black, take the sword with him, when his watch is ended the Night's Watch sends the sword back to the Mormonts, not rocket science 

Agree. NW surely is more honourable than Tywin Lannister was. That bastard didn't give back the Ice!!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jorah leaving it behind indicates that he no longer has a claim to it and he understands why. It's Jon's sword now.

I think it would be funny if Jorah looked at the sword and is like, "Hey! That looks a lot like my family's Valerian sword... oh! It has a little wolf on the pommel and not a bear. My mistake"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...