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Okay, NOW Have We Seen The Most Wildly Unrealistic Thing Ever on GoT???

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1 hour ago, Megorova said:

Actually it isn't.

Based on amount of light I would say that this could be an approximate time frame of their expedition:

7 am - went thru gates at Eastwatch.

12 am - encounter with Undead polar bear (it's dark because of the blizzard).

1 pm - saw group of wights and White Walker. Then went ahead of them, went down into that ravine, prepared a trap and waited. 

2 pm - sent Gendry back.

4 pm - Gendry reached the gate, and they sent raven to Dragonstone.

next day 5 am - Dany departed from Dragonstone. At that time it's already bright morning at Dragonstone, because it's located in different time zone than Eastwatch, sun rises there few hours earlier. When Dany departs from Dragonstone, it's still dark at Eastwatch, and group at frozer lake is still sleeping at this time.

8:00-8:30 am - they woke up at frozen lake and burned Toras. Hound threw stone at one of the wights. The fight begins.

8:45 am - Dany arrived to frozen lake. Departed from there 5-10 minutes later.

9 am - uncle Benjen gave his horse to Jon.

3:30 pm - Jon came back to Eastwatch.

next day 9 am - Jon wakes up in his cabin.

A bit of math:

  Hide contents

From 7 am to 1 pm (for 6 hours) they went forward moving further away from Eastwatch. 1pm-2pm - they haven't walked further from The Wall, they were moving parallel to it, and most part of this time interval they waited in hiding. First hour of their expedition 7am-8am they were moving slowly, because it was still rather dark, early morning twilight, limited visibility, so they were carfully choosing their footing and walking at about half speed. Next times when they were shown it was already bright outside (8am-12am). For 4 hours they were moving at full speed (walking pace). Though during those 4 hours they were making small stops to drink, to talk, to retie their shoes, etc. 12am-1pm because of the blizzard, and limited visibility, and strong winds, they were moving at about quarter speed, afterwards they were substantially slowed downed because Toras was badly wounded.

In total they walked 1/2X (7-8am) + 4X (8-12am) + 1/4X (12am-1pm) + 1/4X (1pm-2pm) =  5X (X is distance). On his way back Gendry covered that distance in two hours, he was running 2,5 times faster than their full speed of walking. Raven flew for 12 hours (4pm-4am). For one hour after that Dany was braiding her hair and choosing what to wear. She departed from Dragonston at 5 am, and arrived to frozen lake at 8:45 am.

So distance equal to (2 hours of Gendry running + 12 hours of raven flying) = about 3:30 hours of dragonflight. And she spent another 15 minutes on scouting them beyond the Wall, or on her way there she stopped at Easwatch and talked to Gendry to find out from him their final known location.

9 am-3:30 pm - six and half hours, most part of that time Jon was unconsciousness, so his horse was walking slowly, and reached Eastwatch when evening twilight was starting to descend.

32 and half hours to go there and back. So there was no teleporting.

2hrs is considered a pretty decent half marathon time. Gendry is not a marathon runner, and is running over a difficult terrain in less than optimal clothing. Let's say he covered 2/3 of that distance, so about 14km or about 9 miles. If the NK is 9 miles for Eastwatch, bagging a wight should be the least of these people's problems and them all deciding to go to KL at this point in time is basically desertion of their duty.

Also, if it's *only* 1000 miles from Dragonstone to Eastwatch that means Dany's going about 285 mph, more than 3 times the speed most people will go on a highway while managing to stay on top of a dragon and somehow keeping her hairstyle intact. The raven would have achieved 83mph on average, again well over the speed limit on a motorway. 

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1 hour ago, Megorova said:

8:00-8:30 am - they woke up at frozen lake and burned Toras. Hound threw stone at one of the wights. The fight begins.

By the time Sandor throws the rock at the wight, Thoros' burning body has burned up already. Takes more than half an hour to burn a body.

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1 hour ago, Cas Stark said:

So the army of the dead is camped out 4 hours from Eastwatch?  And this is your idea of reasonable continuity?

They aren't camped out 4 hours from Eastwatch. But they can move much much faster than humans, and they don't get tired, they don't need to rest, or eat, or sleep, and they don't feel cold or pain. Also Bran did wrote in his letter that Undead army is approaching Eastwatch, so they weren't far from The Wall.

According to esnowshoes.com two miles an hour is an everage speed for snow walking.

So Jon and Co were walking at least 2 miles per hour, or between 2 and 5 miles per hour, because they are not beginners at snow walking, also they are not sissies like modern men are. So that first small group of wights was approximately 10 or 25 miles from The Wall.

Also while Jon and Co were going north, Undead army was also going towards them. Let's say they were going five times faster, and without stopping or slowing down. So in those 7 hours that Jon and Co covered distance of 5X with speed 1X per hour, Unded army covered distance of 35X with speed 5X per hour.

When Jon and Co went beyond The Wall, Undead army was 40X away from them, where X may be between 2 and 5 miles. So they were camped out between 80 or 200 miles north. Though speed of 2 miles per hour and starting distance of Undead March 80 miles away from The Wall seems more likely.

Edited by Megorova

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19 minutes ago, Megorova said:

They aren't camped out 4 hours from Eastwatch. But they can move much much faster than humans, and they don't get tired, they don't need to rest, or eat, or sleep, and they don't feel cold or pain. Also Bran did wrote in his letter that Undead army is approaching Eastwatch, so they weren't far from The Wall.

According to esnowshoes.com two miles an hour is an everage speed for snow walking.

So Jon and Co were walking at least 2 miles per hour, or between 2 and 5 miles per hour, because they are not beginners at snow walking, also they are not sissies like modern men are. So that first small group of wights was approximately 10 or 25 miles from The Wall.

Also while Jon and Co were going north, Undead army was also going towards them. Let's say they were going five times faster, and without stopping or slowing down. So in those 7 hours that Jon and Co covered distance of 5X with speed 1X per hour, Unded army covered distance of 35X with speed 5X per hour.

When Jon and Co went beyond The Wall, Undead army was 40X away from them, where X may be between 2 and 5 miles. So they were camped out between 80 or 200 miles north. Though speed of 2 miles per hour and starting distance of Undead March 80 miles away from The Wall seems more likely.

So based on your own math you pulled out of thin air (you know, using expressions like 5x does not make your numbers any less arbitrary), the WW are not 4hrs but 1-2.5hrs march from Eastwatch right now. This somehow doesn't leave anybody much concerned.

Gendry absolutely is a beginner at snow walking and you move at the speed of the slowest member of the group. Although despite his la k of experience he's also the fastest so idk.

Also, despite moving at this amazing 5x faster speed they somehow never caught up to Jon on the horse. Or Bran on a bloody sled for that matter. 

ETA: also, unless there's a bigger mountain blocking your view you can absolutely see a mountain 10-25 miles away.

Edited by Maid So Fair

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1 hour ago, 7th-key said:

Actually Dany arrived at Eastwatch at 8:05 am but had to fill out paperwork before taking off again due to Drogon hitting a raven while landing. 

Or she stopped there to have breakfast. And was stuck for 30 minutes waiting in line at Eastwatch Starbucks. Until dragons got tired of waiting, and chased everyone away with dragonfire. Thus Brothers went back to castle and drunk instant coffee.

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2 hours ago, Megorova said:

Actually it isn't.

Based on amount of light I would say that this could be an approximate time frame of their expedition:

7 am - went thru gates at Eastwatch.

12 am - encounter with Undead polar bear (it's dark because of the blizzard).

1 pm - saw group of wights and White Walker. Then went ahead of them, went down into that ravine, prepared a trap and waited. 

2 pm - sent Gendry back.

4 pm - Gendry reached the gate, and they sent raven to Dragonstone.

next day 5 am - Dany departed from Dragonstone. At that time it's already bright morning at Dragonstone, because it's located in different time zone than Eastwatch, sun rises there few hours earlier. When Dany departs from Dragonstone, it's still dark at Eastwatch, and group at frozer lake is still sleeping at this time.

8:00-8:30 am - they woke up at frozen lake and burned Toras. Hound threw stone at one of the wights. The fight begins.

8:45 am - Dany arrived to frozen lake. Departed from there 5-10 minutes later.

9 am - uncle Benjen gave his horse to Jon.

3:30 pm - Jon came back to Eastwatch.

next day 9 am - Jon wakes up in his cabin.

A bit of math:

  Reveal hidden contents

From 7 am to 1 pm (for 6 hours) they went forward moving further away from Eastwatch. 1pm-2pm - they haven't walked further from The Wall, they were moving parallel to it, and most part of this time interval they waited in hiding. First hour of their expedition 7am-8am they were moving slowly, because it was still rather dark, early morning twilight, limited visibility, so they were carfully choosing their footing and walking at about half speed. Next times when they were shown it was already bright outside (8am-12am). For 4 hours they were moving at full speed (walking pace). Though during those 4 hours they were making small stops to drink, to talk, to retie their shoes, etc. 12am-1pm because of the blizzard, and limited visibility, and strong winds, they were moving at about quarter speed, afterwards they were substantially slowed downed because Toras was badly wounded.

In total they walked 1/2X (7-8am) + 4X (8-12am) + 1/4X (12am-1pm) + 1/4X (1pm-2pm) =  5X (X is distance). On his way back Gendry covered that distance in two hours, he was running 2,5 times faster than their full speed of walking. Raven flew for 12 hours (4pm-4am). For one hour after that Dany was braiding her hair and choosing what to wear. She departed from Dragonston at 5 am, and arrived to frozen lake at 8:45 am.

So distance equal to (2 hours of Gendry running + 12 hours of raven flying) = about 3:30 hours of dragonflight. And she spent another 15 minutes on scouting them beyond the Wall, or on her way there she stopped at Easwatch and talked to Gendry to find out from him their final known location.

9 am-3:30 pm - six and half hours, most part of that time Jon was unconsciousness, so his horse was walking slowly, and reached Eastwatch when evening twilight was starting to descend.

32 and half hours to go there and back. So there was no teleporting.

Just one problem with your timeline.

It wildly fails to account for the distances involved.

For example,you have Gendry running somewhere around 150 to 300 miles through rough terrain and forest in TWO HOURS.  On foot.  So, what, he's running at around 75 to 150 miles per hour?

Your timeline does not specify what time the raven arrives at Dragonstone, but based on what you have for Dany's departure time, your timeline has the raven flying at about 100 to 200 mph through the night, no less. Uh, no.

Then, your timeline has Dany flying with the dragons at somewhere between 300 and 600 miles per hour back to where Jon is.  Now, mind you, that flight by Dany is in sub-zero temperatures, and speeds of literally hundreds of miles per hour, with a resulting wind chill factor that would likely be AT LEAST 100 degrees below zero (fahrenheit), maybe a lot colder, and as others have pointed out, even if it weren't for the tremendous cold, it's unlikely Dany would even be able to breathe.  And that's assuming the dragon is even capable of flying somewhere between 300 and 600 miles per hour, which would be astounding.

Sorry, it just doesn't add up.

Not even close.

Estimates about the distance between Eastwatch and Dragonstone range somewhere between 1,000 miles and 2,000 miles.  How far north of the Wall did Gendry start his run?  it's hard to know precisely, but if you look at a map it seems clear Gendry's run covered somewhere between 150 and 300 miles.  On foot.  in two hours.  Without a hat.

Edited by Cron

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1 hour ago, sweetsunray said:

where did they get the wood even?

From their cargo :rolleyes: Also they have magic instant fire.

Let's not argue about this. You have your opinion, I have mine. You think that it's impossible to make a round trip beyond The Wall and back, in given time frame, so you're just denying all explanations of how that may be indeed possible.

 

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1 hour ago, sweetsunray said:

Have you ever done any hiking in mountains and through forests? I'd say from your estimated timeline here that you haven't. There's nothing realistic or doable about your timeline. Going into the ravine, around the patrol wights, and building that fire (where did they get the wood even?) takes more than an hour.

And you also do not take into account that the very first scene in the episode and both shots of Gendry arriving at the wall and Jon on horseback depicts a forest. The very first scene after the intro is the camera rolling across the Dragonstone map table, all the way to Eastwatch. And that map depicts triangular pine symbols, aka map symbol for "here there be forest", and goes more north to the area of Hardhome where they be hills and mountains. The southern edge of the forest is seen from where Dany's overlooking the area beyond the wall, as Benjen's horse with Jon on it returns. And they give us an aerial shot from there where no mountain is visible for Dany looking that way, while she's standing on a wall as high as a mountain. Ever stood on a peak of a mountain, or at a belltower of a cathedral and looked at the horizon? All you see within the horizon is at least worth 2 days ofhiking, depending on the area you'll be hiking (mountainous area is very very slow, forest is a PIA too). You see dark shadow of forest in the shot with Gendry again as he nears the wall and looks up, the scene before he drops down. That means that by the time we see them hiking in a forestless hill area, that we already skipped the biggest part of the journey really.

The show itself gives an extra map indication of where we see them hiking - beyond the Haunted Forest. They're basically as far north from Eastwatch as the Fist of the First Men is north of CB when we start to have the bro-bonding dialogue, before the polar bear. That would be at least 2 days after going through the gate, otherwise you'd see the mountain area from the wall at the horizon.

 

Absolutely correct, in fact many of those estimates are conservative (which is fine and fair)

And look at a map of that area of land.  It goes NORTHWEST, not straight north.  If they went straight north from Eastwatch, they would end up in Hardhome, then the sea.

This means that the distances involved are well in excess of 150 miles from Eastwatch to where Viserion died.  If you picture a right triangle with one leg being the Wall (from Eastwatch to Castle Black, which is about 150 miles) then the hypotenuse (from Eastwatch to where Viserion died) is even MORE ("a squared plus b squared equals c squared," the Pythagorean theorem)

This means Gendry ran somewhere between 150 and 300 miles, according to known maps and known distances

(Indeed, it's POSSIBLE Gendry's run was even further, AND that the round trip between Eastwatch and Dragonstone was roughly 4,000 miles).

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1 hour ago, sweetsunray said:

By the time Sandor throws the rock at the wight, Thoros' burning body has burned up already. Takes more than half an hour to burn a body.

How many bodies have you burned? :D

Magic fire burns faster.

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35 minutes ago, Megorova said:

From their cargo :rolleyes: Also they have magic instant fire.

Let's not argue about this. You have your opinion, I have mine. You think that it's impossible to make a round trip beyond The Wall and back, in given time frame, so you're just denying all explanations of how that may be indeed possible.

 

My friend, I think you are blatantly ignoring readily available information on the distances involved.

Trust me, they are FAR.

Please see my posts above.  Gendry's run could have been as much as 300 miles or more, and you have him doing that in 2 hours, in sub-zero temperatures, across rough terrain.

The distance between Eastwatch and Dragonstone is SURELY at least 1,000 miles, ONE WAY, and could be around 2,000 miles, ONE WAY.

Now, take those numbers and plug them into the timeline you set forth above.

No way.

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If it's only 4 dragon hours away, Dany could have taken one afternoon off and verified the existence and threat of  this Army of the Dead easy peasy, from the start.

Edited by 7th-key

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2 minutes ago, 7th-key said:

If it's only 4 dragon hours away, Dany could have taken one afternoon off and verified the existence and threat of  this Army of the Dead easy peasy, from the start.

Agreed.

Yet another aspect of the Wight Hunt that makes the whole thing absurd (unfortunately) from start to finish, from the moment Tyrion first suggested it to the moment Dany and Jon were on the boat together.

SO many issues.  WHY weren't the Wight Hunters on horses???  On and on and on.  It's just baffling.

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35 minutes ago, Cron said:

For example,you have Gendry running somewhere around 150 to 300 miles through rough terrain and forest in TWO HOURS.  On foot.  So, what, he's running at around 75 to 150 miles per hour?

No. 2 hours, distance 5X, speed 2,5X per hour. X could be between 2 and 5 miles. So he run distance between 10 and 25 miles, with speed 5 miles per hour or 12,5 miles per hour.

Quote

Your timeline does not specify what time the raven arrives at Dragonstone,

4 am

Quote

but based on what you have for Dany's departure time, your timeline has the raven flying at about 100 to 200 mph through the night, no less. Uh, no.

Why not? :huh: You're forgetting that those ravens are not average birds. In old days they all could talk, and even do some tricks. They are magical creatures.

Also in that scene when Bran found location of Undead army, his ravens found NK pretty fast. From what castle did they departed? - was it Winterfell or Eastwatch? Either way they were very fast.

Quote

Then, your timeline has Dany flying with the dragons at somewhere between 300 and 600 miles per hour back to where Jon is.  Now, mind you, that flight by Dany is in sub-zero temperatures, and speeds of literally hundreds of miles per hour, with a resulting wind chill factor that would likely be AT LEAST 100 degrees below zero (fahrenheit), maybe a lot colder, and as others have pointed out, even if it weren't for the tremendous cold, it's unlikely Dany would even be able to breathe.  And that's assuming the dragon is even capable of flying somewhere between 300 and 600 miles per hour, which would be astounding.

What would be really astounding is dragons existence.

Dragons are magical creatures. What they can or can't do can't be mesured according to standarts of normal world. Also they are warm, so at least Dany is protected from freezing while she's riding them. They're like a giant furnace, full of warm and power.

Quote

Estimates about the distance between Eastwatch and Dragonstone range somewhere between 1,000 miles and 2,000 miles.  

And I wrote that raven covered that distance in 12 hours, so its speed would be 83 miles per hour, or 166 miles per hour <- absolutely realistical speed for magical birds from parallel world ^_^

For example in our world fastest bird is Peregrine falcon, able to exceed 200 mph in its hunting dives.

I understand that speed of hunting dives isn't the same thing as speed of average flight. Though if normal bird in real world can dive at speed over 200 mph, then magical bird in parallel world can fly as fast.

Golden eagle's maximum horizontal speed (that's an average flight) - 80 mph.

Gyrfalcon's maximum horizontal speed - 90 mph <- see, even real world bird can fly from Eastwatch to Dragonstone in less than 12 hours (if the distance is 1000 miles).

White-throated needletail - 105 mph <- see, we're so getting there on time ^_^

Dragon is bigger and faster than bird. If real world bird can fly at speed 105 mph, then I think that dragon can fly at least 3 times faster. Thus 1025 miles between Dragonstone and frozen lake covered in 3 and half hours seems realistical.

1025 miles in 3:30 hours is 293 mph. Funny that this exact speed was set as a record for Eurocopter X3 hybrid in 2013. Look at that chopper and imagine that it's Drogon.

Also estimate 2000 miles between Dragonstone and Eastwatch seems too farfetched. Westeros isn't THAT big.

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1 hour ago, Cron said:

Gendry's run could have been as much as 300 miles or more

And you think that THAT'S realistic? 300!!! miles of snowrunning?!

U-N-B-E-L-I-E-V-A-B-L-E.

Even more unbelievable than round trip there and back in just a 32 hours.

Nevertheless that roundabout trip did happened. Rewatch episode 6, and see it for yourself.

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4 minutes ago, Megorova said:

No. 2 hours, distance 5X, speed 2,5X per hour. X could be between 2 and 5 miles. So he run distance between 10 and 25 miles, with speed 5 miles per hour or 12,5 miles per hour.

No, that does not add up.   See my posts above.   Based on KNOWN maps and distances, Gendry MUST have run somewhere between 150 and 300 miles.  I have no idea where you are getting the distances you are using in your calculations.  None.

Look at maps, and use KNOWN distances for scale.  Your distances are WAY off.

4 minutes ago, Megorova said:

4 am

Why not? :huh: You're forgetting that those ravens are not average birds. In old days they all could talk, and even do some tricks. They are magical creatures.

We have NO reason to believe those ravens are magical, in books OR show.

None.

Should I also just use my imagination to assume Gendry has some magic that allows him to run at 75 to 150 miles per hour in sub-zero temperatures over rough terrain for 2 straight hours?

4 minutes ago, Megorova said:

Also in that scene when Bran found location of Undead army, his ravens found NK pretty fast. From what castle did they departed? - was it Winterfell or Eastwatch? Either way they were very fast.

Winterfell is hundreds of miles south of the Wall.  In fact, in the books it is said to be about 600 miles south of the Wall.

In any event, we cannot judge these matters based on that scene with Bran.  We KNOW for a fact that the lake where Viserion died is WAY north of the Wall.  It is indisputable.  As sweetsunray was basically saying, above, when the episode STARTED the Wight Hunters were already north of the forest region, into the mountainous area.

Again, look at some maps.  Use KNOWN distances for scale.    I assure you, the distances are FAR greater than what you are basically saying.

4 minutes ago, Megorova said:

What would be really astounding is dragons existence.

Dragons are magical creatures. What they can or can't do can't be mesured according to standarts of normal world. Also they are warm, so at least Dany is protected from freezing while she's riding them. They're like a giant furnace, full of warm and power.

If those dragons were hot or warm enough to keep Dany safe from temperatures (wind chill) that could be hundreds of degrees below zero, I believe she would be burnt to a crisp under normal conditions. 

4 minutes ago, Megorova said:

And I wrote that raven covered that distance in 12 hours, so its speed would be 83 miles per hour, or 166 miles per hour <- absolutely realistical speed for magical birds from parallel world ^_^

Again, there is NO indication that those ravens are magical OR capable of such speeds, in books OR show.

None.

Nada.

Zip.

Nil.

4 minutes ago, Megorova said:

For example in our world fastest bird is Peregrine falcon, able to exceed 200 mph in its hunting dives.

I understand that speed of hunting dives isn't the same thing as speed of average flight. Though if normal bird in real world can dive at speed over 200 mph, then magical bird in parallel world can fly as fast.

Again, there is NO reason to believe those ravens are magical, in books or show. None.

4 minutes ago, Megorova said:

Golden eagle's maximum horizontal speed (that's an average flight) - 80 mph.

Gyrfalcon's maximum horizontal speed - 90 mph <- see, even real world bird can fly from Eastwatch to Dragonstone in less than 12 hours (if the distance is 1000 miles).

White-throated needletail - 105 mph <- see, we're so getting there on time ^_^

My friend, I have researched these issues, too.  Recently.   The kind of stuff you are talking about is TOP SPEEDS, for SHORT DISTANCES.  It' would be like saying a cheetah can hit a top speed of 70 miles per hour, therefor it could run across the United States in about 43 hours.  Uh, NO, a cheetah could not do that.  I have looked into this stuff, and there is just no way on Earth, or Planetos, short of a magical explanation, and there is NO evidence for that, in books or show.

4 minutes ago, Megorova said:

Dragon is bigger and faster than bird. If real world bird can fly at speed 105 mph, then I think that dragon can fly at least 3 times faster. Thus 1025 miles between Dragonstone and frozen lake covered in 3 and half hours seems realistical.

Actually, one interesting thing I recently discovered is that "how fast an animal flies" has very little or nothing to do with how big or small it is.

The dragons ARE magical though, no doubt about that, so to the extent you have any leg to stand on in this discussion, it would relate to them (even though such assumptions open up other cans of worms and inconsistencies in many other areas of the story, as has been pointed out by me and others in this very thread)

4 minutes ago, Megorova said:

1025 miles in 3:30 hours is 293 mph. Funny that this exact speed was set as a record for Eurocopter X3 hybrid in 2013. Look at that chopper and imagine that it's Drogon.

Also estimate 2000 miles between Dragonstone and Eastwatch seems too farfetched. Westeros isn't THAT big.

The exact distance can't be known with available information.  At one point, the show tells us it is 1,000 miles from Winterfell to King's Landing.  The books, however, say 500 LEAGUES, which is 1,500 miles.  Some people opine that the show mileage was a rough, off the cuff comment.  The Wall is THREE HUNDRED miles long.  Look at some maps, my friend.   Estimates of the distance between Eastwatch and Dragonstone VERY reasonably fall somewhere between 1,000 and 2,000 miles (by the way, the 2,000 mile estimate is not even from me.  I have read articles by other people estimating that)

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2 hours ago, Megorova said:

You think that it's impossible to make a round trip beyond The Wall and back, in given time frame, so you're just denying all explanations of how that may be indeed possible.

But given the evidence on screen it is not possible. If they had left out the camera panning across the dragonstone table with the pine trees at Eastwatche, and shown us an unforrested area at Eastwatch with a mountain landscape on the horizon, we could allow them some fudging. But they did not. They showed us a forest time and time again, and the mountainous area behind it, near Hardhome.

Your timeline is already quite unrealistic (I've been an adventure tourleader in Central and South America for a decade, hiked in the Andes to over 4500 m, the Amazon, hiked down into canyons and ravines plenty, built numerous campfires with a striking bar, etc), and on top of that you ignore screen evidence.

It's ok to love the episode and not be bothered by the implausible times and distances, but the timeline is not realistic. That's not a matter of opinion.

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1 hour ago, Cron said:

WHY weren't the Wight Hunters on horses???

10 people - 10 horses = lot's of feed (i.e. food for horses).

They didn't knew how far they will have to go, or for how long they will have to stay there. Without knowing that, they can't take horses with them. Even when they went there on foot, they had to take a sledge of cargo with them - food, dry firewood, and other supplies. With all of them horseriding they would need to take at least three more sledges like that filled with feed. Also lands beyond The Wall are uneven, if they will have to hike/mountain climb, they will have to leave horses behind. So there's no point in taking them at all.

But the most obvious reason is this: imagine that they are stealthily approaching group of wights, and suddenly one of the horses is starting to neigh. And if one horse is neighing, then others will also neigh in reply. On their gravestones would be writen - Betrayed by their horses.

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3 hours ago, Megorova said:

They aren't camped out 4 hours from Eastwatch. But they can move much much faster than humans, and they don't get tired, they don't need to rest, or eat, or sleep, and they don't feel cold or pain. Also Bran did wrote in his letter that Undead army is approaching Eastwatch, so they weren't far from The Wall.

According to esnowshoes.com two miles an hour is an everage speed for snow walking.

So Jon and Co were walking at least 2 miles per hour, or between 2 and 5 miles per hour, because they are not beginners at snow walking, also they are not sissies like modern men are. So that first small group of wights was approximately 10 or 25 miles from The Wall.

Also while Jon and Co were going north, Undead army was also going towards them. Let's say they were going five times faster, and without stopping or slowing down. So in those 7 hours that Jon and Co covered distance of 5X with speed 1X per hour, Unded army covered distance of 35X with speed 5X per hour.

When Jon and Co went beyond The Wall, Undead army was 40X away from them, where X may be between 2 and 5 miles. So they were camped out between 80 or 200 miles north. Though speed of 2 miles per hour and starting distance of Undead March 80 miles away from The Wall seems more likely.

Eh, so you say that the army of the dead moves faster than humans, you understand that means that if they were only supposed to be 25-200 miles from the Wall that they will reach the Wall before any of the events that happen in the episode tonight happen.  They would have reached the wall before Dany and Jon and co. got back South, even if they were flying on a dragon. So, it isn't possible, it isn't possible based on the maps and the forest and the mountains and  the lake and where that stuff appears both in the visuals for the show and in the HBO maps that augment the show.

Edited by Cas Stark

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2 hours ago, Megorova said:

How many bodies have you burned? :D

Magic fire burns faster.

Bones take hours to burn. I don't need to have done that myself to know that. I've studied physics and the information is out there. The fire of Beric's sword isn't dragonfire that turns people into ashes instantly (which requires temperatures as high as a pyroclastic volcano outburst). We were shown it wasn't. The fire used to set Thoros ablaze would have temperatures like a campfire. Even if a whole house burns down, they can still find human remains easily, well after the fire is done.

Edited by sweetsunray

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46 minutes ago, Megorova said:

And you think that THAT'S realistic? 300!!! miles of snowrunning?!

U-N-B-E-L-I-E-V-A-B-L-E.

Even more unbelievable than round trip there and back in just a 32 hours.

Nevertheless that roundabout trip did happened. Rewatch episode 6, and see it for yourself.

Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...NO, i don't think that is realistic that Gendry's run was 300 miles or more.

That's my point.

It is absurd. Flat out absurd.

What I am saying is that what we were SHOWN and asked to BELIEVE could amount to a claim that Gendry's run was 300 miles or more. (And, I believe was SURELY at least 150 miles)

Of COURSE that is not realistic.  That is MY point.

Edited by Cron

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