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Wildling Queen

That look on Tyrion's face

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20 minutes ago, Marada78 said:

Guys I want all of you to just think that, even if there is some bad writing involved, the authors at this point won't waste scenes just to show a pointlessly concerned Tyrion. Something has to happen or maybe has already happened.

I am starting to think that Tyrion has already betrayed Dany, specifically when talking to Cersei before they both returned to the Dragon Pit. My theory is that he revealed to Cersei that Dany is barren and that he plans to change the political system to a republican one. So basically he promised to support Cersei's child future election as the successor of Dany in exchange for Cersei support to the truce. 

So than at the end he is concerned because if Dany gets pregnant by Jon the whole thing will get really really messed up.

That makes sense, especially if you consider his last episode succession talk with Daenerys. Still, I don't see him betraying Dany for Cersei. If D&D wanted him to betray Dany, more logical solution would be betraying her for Jaime.

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I dunno....I'm thinking he is indeed in love with her and his love will propel him to be foolish in order to gain her attention. (yea yea Jorah did something stupid as well)

If you go back to the previous episode, he was speaking to her about heroes.  She made the comment about Jon being "too small" and the awkwardness that arose from that comment was thick.  They had the discussion about heroes being stupid and brash, doing things that get themselves killed.  She tells Tyrion to "not be a hero" and stay alive.  A few comments have been made about Tyrion dying or staying alive this season.  I am wondering if they are setting it up for Tyrion to be a "foolish, brash hero" and sacrificing himself to save Dany.  He would do something like that if he were in love with her. 

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18 minutes ago, Christina Ceriddwynn said:

I dunno....I'm thinking he is indeed in love with her and his love will propel him to be foolish in order to gain her attention. (yea yea Jorah did something stupid as well)

If you go back to the previous episode, he was speaking to her about heroes.  She made the comment about Jon being "too small" and the awkwardness that arose from that comment was thick.  They had the discussion about heroes being stupid and brash, doing things that get themselves killed.  She tells Tyrion to "not be a hero" and stay alive.  A few comments have been made about Tyrion dying or staying alive this season.  I am wondering if they are setting it up for Tyrion to be a "foolish, brash hero" and sacrificing himself to save Dany.  He would do something like that if he were in love with her. 

Spoiler below regarding original GRRM plot.

The original plot was going to have both Tyrion and Jon fall in love with Arya..  I wonder if GRRM changed Arya to Dany and that Tyrion may well end up being Dany's love betrayal.

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I wondered this too. I can't really add much to what's been said but I think he knows Cersei well enough to know she'll stab Dany in the back. I don't know how the pregnancy would effect him. I think he does feel bad about all the kids but there's this gnawing feeling at me that he wouldn't betray Dany.  

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Tyrion isn't going to betray Dany, that's just another Red hearing and makes zero plot sense, especially after Jamie has left. 

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6 hours ago, Marada78 said:

This. It seems to me that D&D are setting up some facts for the season 8. One is already almost fixed and that is that Dany will get pregnant: too much talks about this already to be wasted with nothing. The second is that Tyrion will betray Dany and ultimately will be a betray for love. Here also we have too much foreshadowing to go to nothing. And before this last scene I was still convinced that at the end Tyrion would be raising little Eddard Targ with Sansa. But not anymore, maybe Sansa will reign alone after all. 

you think sansa will be on the throne?

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Peter is a great actor and I do not see jealousy, fear or hatred in his expression only concern.

Tyrion reflex concern. Since he wants to create a better world by leaving aside the system of kings and heirs. When he spoke to dany about the system of succession to the throne he was thinking of a better system like the Night Watch. Democracy.

But his plan to have a better future for westeros is in danger by dany's new romance.

Sorry for my english.

 

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22 hours ago, Wildling Queen said:

Tyrion seemed so disturbed at the end after seeing Jon go to Daenerys. Did he betray Daenerys with Cersei? Why did Cersei change her mind?

What was going on in Tyrion's head at the end?

Whatever his reasons it was super creepy for him to lurk outside the bedroom while they were having it off.

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2 hours ago, TyrionFan82 said:

I wondered this too. I can't really add much to what's been said but I think he knows Cersei well enough to know she'll stab Dany in the back.

I don't think the show needs to have anyone see through Cersei, because they have Jaime coming to warn everyone. And therefore, nobody will see through Cersei. Tyrion was as taken in as everyone else.

And honestly, it works better that way. Tyrion is the one who was in there making the last-ditch emotional appeal to Cersei on behalf of her unborn baby. He's the one who convinced Cersei, and then told everyone else to trust Cersei's change of heart. He's the last character they should have now tell everyone they can't trust her.

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I think it was a look of guilt because he has or will be betraying Dany and now Jon as well..

he likes them both. he spoke up for Jon, said he trusts Jon, etc..  but..

Cersei by revealing her pregnancy kinda threw him into a loyalty dilemma..

Dany will still be betrayed somehow, by someone..

she was warned about the Lions way back when..

whether it is a fatal betrayal is another thing..

hopefully not.

also don't think the aunt/nephew thing will matter too much to them..

and he'll actually defer to her ruling.. don't believe he wants to as bad. 

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22 hours ago, LyannaWolfe said:

Hi all! Brand new poster here! :) Just a few thoughts on this topic.

I've never gotten the 'Tyrion is in love with Dany' vibe. And I REALLY hope that isn't the direction they go. We already have Jorah lusting after her and constantly being friend-zoned; we don't need another character in the same space.

I think that now that Jon is swiftly becoming Dany's unofficial 'adviser,' Tyrion is feeling left out. He's supposed to be her hand, her primary voice of reason and the person she listens to/trusts the most, but this season has really been eroding that trust. His tactical and strategic failures, along with Dany's growing attraction and trust in Jon, has her sidelining Tyrion more and more. She's openly turned to Jon when asking how to handle the war; she disregarded Tyrion when he said to not go rescue Jon and team; she dismissed his caution before burning the Tarlys. Just to name a few things.

Add all of that up, then add to it the fact that Jon had, in fact, bent the knee to Dany, without telling anyone and then dropped that tidbit of info at a very critical point in negotiations with Cersei, without warning...I can totally see Tyrion feeling that he's quickly losing Dany's confidence/place by her side. He seemed really defensive/frustrated about not knowing beforehand that Jon had pledged his support to Dany when talking with Cersei. 

And now that Dany and Jon have not only hooked up, but they have some serious feelings between them, Tyrion's advice will be more easily dismissed.  All you have to do is look at what happened to Jorah's advice to Dany, which was summarily dismissed in favor of Jon's not to see where Tyrion's place/advice is headed.

It used to be Dany/Tyrion and team against the world. Now, it's swiftly becoming Dany/Jon against the world. So, where does that leave a character like Tyrion whose admitted enjoyment and purpose in life is to be that primary adviser to powerful people -- specifically Dany, who he sees as the one person that can right all the wrongs in the world? 

I don't think that means he has betrayed Dany and/or Jon...yet. But if things continue this way, he very may well could. 

Just my humble .02 cents.   

My humble 2 cents as well.  Tyrion admitted long ago that he loves being a politician and is good at it.  He has seen conflicting interests ever since Jon entered the picture.  He only wanted him as an ally. 

I really hope he is not in love with her.  I don't think I could bear seeing Tyrion getting his heart broken again.

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No way would Tyrion ever side with Cersei.  He hates her and knows she's evil, and he truly wants to help make the world a better place.

Someone mentioned that he might end up raising Jon and Dany's child.  I think it is more likely he would end up raising Cersei and Jaime's child.

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8 hours ago, House Rootbreaker said:

I think you're right, I think that's all there is to it. I don't believe there are any romantic feelings there or jealous feelings.  This could refer back to Jon refusing to lie to Cersei and Tyrion just recognizing this makes it even more messy. He was quite disappointed in Jon not lying and now he knows Daenaerys will be compromised when making the right political move versus one for love.

Of course the writers give him that look with no dialogue so you're left wondering but in the end he knows love will complicate things (*cough Shae *cough).

 

Yes, I agree. 

For Tyrion having now to maybe deal with both stubborn leaders.

Also I do still believe that Tyrion has a big respect for Jon and he does trust him and believes he could become a good King.

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There's a suggestion that when Tyrion found out Cersei is pregnant, he told her that Dany can't have kids. Which led to Cersei thinking that regardless of what happens, her child will sit the Iron Throne. Tyrion could now be worried that Dany might get pregnant after all. 

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4 hours ago, roadking said:

I think it was a look of guilt because he has or will be betraying Dany and now Jon as well..

he likes them both. he spoke up for Jon, said he trusts Jon, etc..  but..

Cersei by revealing her pregnancy kinda threw him into a loyalty dilemma..

Dany will still be betrayed somehow, by someone..

she was warned about the Lions way back when..

whether it is a fatal betrayal is another thing..

hopefully not.

also don't think the aunt/nephew thing will matter too much to them..

and he'll actually defer to her ruling.. don't believe he wants to as bad. 

I agree with you on the last point. Jon doesn't care to have the IT. He'd probably shrug and be all whatever.

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Tyrion seemed to me to be worried, not scheming. It's not at all certain that the North is going along with Jon's ideas at this stage. Also, for Daenerys, she just charged into the frontlines to help Jon and lost one dragon - something Tyrion explicitly warned her not to do. Imagine what she'll do when she's taking this relation to the next level.

There's no point to her invasion without her. Westeros won't accept a Dothraki as king, etc. The best place for her to be is on Dragonstone, not mucking around in the field with the footsoldiers.

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3 hours ago, Anarres said:

 The best place for her to be is on Dragonstone, not mucking around in the field with the footsoldiers.

While Tyrion is right about this, we all know that this is not who she is, and it's not who Jon is either.
They're both leaders who wants to lead from the front and who expects that all leaders should.
It's one of the reasons they respect and eventually fell for each other.

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