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ummester

The Wall

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11 hours ago, falcotron said:

Or maybe it's only part of the solution: blowing the horn weakens the magic for a short time, but you still need to smash the physical Wall while it's unprotected.

This is what I've always assumed that it does. Remove the enchantments, and leave it as a plain wall of ice and stone.

But the horn is also supposed to 'wake the giants' and we don't really know what that means, either.

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18 hours ago, plastic throne said:

again Starks who f*cked it up and after 8000 years gave the Night King means to cross The Wall.

17 hours ago, Col Cinders said:

We also won't know what the NK's plan 'A' was.

The plan A of the NK wasn't clear, that's true, but neither the plan A of Daenerys' coalition: if the NK was going to attack even without dragon in a short period of time, capturing the wight to prove they exist would have been useless, since the wights were about to prove their existence by themselves with the attack. 

If instead the attack was a remote problem, again, there was no need to capture the wight, since they had the time to conquer KL before dealing with the wights.

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45 minutes ago, TwiceBorn said:

And so the whole plan of NK boiled down (pun intended) to go circles for like 8000 years untill some idiot flies a dragon before his face.

Major facepalm.

Who/where in the episode did it say or show that? No where, that is just you jumping to silly conclusions because you aren't giving every answer you want. 

 

This is how I expected the wall to fall. That or for the NK to walk up to it and for it to crumble because he has marked Bran and is frikin powerful. 

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What kinda bothered me was that after crumbling the wall there seemed to be a rather large mountain of... well... magical ice cubes ... between the army of the dead and the South. Less of an obstacle than a freakin' giant wall, granted. But still, not an easy hike, it looked to me.

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Yeah I'm pretty sure in the books the wall will fall in a very different way.

 

I understand that dragons are magical creatures that breathe fire that is generally good against ice, but from what we know dragons existed in the past in Westeros, before the Targaryans, so it's weird the Children/First Men made the wall dragon weak.

Of course a dragon controlled by the Night King may be unusual and able to do it, still I prefer the Horn.

 

We know nothing of the Horn of Joramun or who made it. It could have been made by the children and made with counterspells to destroy the wall, we don't know.

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36 minutes ago, LastManStanding said:

Who/where in the episode did it say or show that? No where, that is just you jumping to silly conclusions because you aren't giving every answer you want. 

 

This is how I expected the wall to fall. That or for the NK to walk up to it and for it to crumble because he has marked Bran and is frikin powerful. 

Cool (haha).

So what took him so long?

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9 minutes ago, TwiceBorn said:

Cool (haha).

So what took him so long?

It's no coincidence that they started becoming active when Daenerys and her dragons came about and magic returned to the world, so I think it is erroneous to say they have been sitting about for 8,000 years. They probably "awakened" around the same time. Like everyone else in the story, the NK has probably been planning and taking his time. Waiting for the right time and playing with the right people. Hence letting the Nights Watch see wights for example. Bran probably played a big part in letting him pass and the dragon was probably a nice bonus. This, of course, is speculation. It is al I can offer right now. Because they haven't told us yet. The NK is suppose to be mysterious. We aren't suppose to know his backstory and all his motives and actions and thoughts. It's like saying about Arya "pfft, what took her so long to kill the Freys?". Well, she was doing other things of course. 

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Show-verse, I don't think they'll give us satifactory explanations for the Great War, the NK and everything else. 

We'll have to wait for the books, and I don't believe they will be the same. I don't think the NK is alive or that he'll tear the Wall down with a dragon,

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21 hours ago, plastic throne said:

I couldn't believe what I was watching tbh. To top it off, its again Starks who f*cked it up and after 8000 years gave the Night King means to cross The Wall.

Thanks D&D :rolleyes:

Which Stark did it?

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3 hours ago, TwiceBorn said:

And so the whole plan of NK boiled down (pun intended) to go circles for like 8000 years untill some idiot flies a dragon before his face.

Major facepalm.

Lol, this is very much sticking in my craw.  They should have at least given us a hint as to what the NK's original plan was.  

Then again, maybe this is one of those situations that GRRM seems to enjoy where the catastrophe turns out to be the Hero's fault.  

Still bugs me. 

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To all of you who love the blowing (of Horns)

I will remember you and laugh out loud if the NK will blow the horn and turn the dragon to his will.

 

Then the dragon will melt the Wall

That way the Horn of Joranoun will bring down the wall. No strange magic weaves etc etc.  

The fact that you IMAGINE something that will PROBABLY be written in a FICTION book, doesn't mean is the best way to describe the story. It only means that is the way that YOU like the story to be said.

 

A magical powerful creature, further enchanted and turned by an other magical and powerful creature, in MY mind can melt a magical and powerful ICE wall

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Disappointing that the wall fell that way but not entirely unpredictable in the show universe.  I just hate the whole chain of events....

  1. Plan of capturing wight.
  2. Not running towards wall when wight army appears.
  3. Time warp of Gendry to wall, raven to Dany, flying dragon to find Jon.
  4. Dragon flying in sky killed instead of the one on the ground being used for escape.
  5. Massive chains appearing and scuba wights able to tie to dragon
  6. Wights able to pull dead dragon out of water while on an icy surface.
  7. Ice Dragon being able to destroy the wall.

No way the books go this way.  

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I have to admit one thing. I never considered the "NK set a trap to our heroes to get a dragon for himself" to be a thing, but it kind of makes sense considering what we've seen so far.

I honestly thought he was going to tear down the Wall with some version of the Horn of Joramun, but after having watched the episode...the theory gains strength

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1 hour ago, watcher of the night said:

Which Stark did it?

Pretty obvious answer. And It don't care how you feel about it, so please don't bother.

Edit: It might've come of as rude, but we both already had a conversation like this in another thread. No need to repeat it, agree to disagree and save ourselves some time.

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44 minutes ago, Prince Jon said:

Disappointing that the wall fell that way but not entirely unpredictable in the show universe.  I just hate the whole chain of events....

  1. Plan of capturing wight.
  2. Not running towards wall when wight army appears.
  3. Time warp of Gendry to wall, raven to Dany, flying dragon to find Jon.
  4. Dragon flying in sky killed instead of the one on the ground being used for escape.
  5. Massive chains appearing and scuba wights able to tie to dragon
  6. Wights able to pull dead dragon out of water while on an icy surface.
  7. Ice Dragon being able to destroy the wall.

No way the books go this way. 

also, spears are also for the dragon (okay got it), the NK has a pretty good arm, good thing either the only stones are in that island, or the hound is the only one with the skill to throw a rock.

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8 hours ago, TwiceBorn said:

And so the whole plan of NK boiled down (pun intended) to go circles for like 8000 years untill some idiot flies a dragon before his face.

Major facepalm.

The night king may of been able to bring the wall down at any time, and just thought the dragon was a better way. Afterall he can easily kill dragons so his magic is atleast as strong as dragons, so why would he need a dragon ? The entire scene was very disappointing, the wall should of been an epic past stand where the humans belived was their last chance. Instead a dragon just cut a hole in it. 

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4 hours ago, tormund's beard said:

also, spears are also for the dragon (okay got it), the NK has a pretty good arm, good thing either the only stones are in that island, or the hound is the only one with the skill to throw a rock.

I don't have. a problem with the night king surrounding them. Obviously he doesnt consider John enough of a threat to kill him and cares nothing about his wights, others. 

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8 hours ago, 3sm1r said:

The plan A of the NK wasn't clear, that's true, but neither the plan A of Daenerys' coalition: if the NK was going to attack even without dragon in a short period of time, capturing the wight to prove they exist would have been useless, since the wights were about to prove their existence by themselves with the attack. 

If instead the attack was a remote problem, again, there was no need to capture the wight, since they had the time to conquer KL before dealing with the wights.

Jon: There is an army coming that we have almost no chance whatsoever fighting even united.

Tryion:  I have a plan, go capture one of their wights, don't run away and dont even bothertaking horses or anything fast moving. The ten of you will have no problem fighting the most powerful army ever assemble on foot until you get a wight. This way we may be able to get an extremly small army from Cersi, instead of just taking the capital. 

Evreyone: Great plan, cant go wrong lets do it. 

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I thought it seemed pretty clear that Bran passing through the Wall negated the Children of the Forest's magical wards (set up by the negation of the CotF magic wards at 3ER cave (Hodor scene?)) and then the dragon was used to negate the actual physical barrier? So once the magic wards were negated, Night King used the dragon to bring down the physical barrier: both barriers removed, the armies could then pass south?

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On 8/28/2017 at 3:15 PM, Ambria said:

Book readers have a hard time believing a dragon can take down the wall but blowing a magical horn would be perfectly fine?

well the horns were old magic and made for specific things. That said I think that the way they did it in the show was ridiculous. But they wrote themselves into a corner.

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