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Season 8: News, Spoilers And Leaks


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I always assumed she would live until she and Jon Snow hooked up, which I presume also happens in the books, that would make the end awfully fairly tale, the secret prince and the dethroned princess fall in love, unite, save the world and restart the Targ dynasty...did not seem like an ending the author would be doing.  So, I began to think Dany or Jon would die, and some of Emilia's statements have lent some weight to that idea, but who knows anymore. 

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1 hour ago, Cas Stark said:

I always assumed she would live until she and Jon Snow hooked up, which I presume also happens in the books, that would make the end awfully fairly tale, the secret prince and the dethroned princess fall in love, unite, save the world and restart the Targ dynasty...did not seem like an ending the author would be doing.  So, I began to think Dany or Jon would die, and some of Emilia's statements have lent some weight to that idea, but who knows anymore. 

I assume Jon’s parentage will change their relationship. Assuming they both live, I don’t see them ending up together.

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4 minutes ago, Dragon in the North said:

I assume Jon’s parentage will change their relationship. Assuming they both live, I don’t see them ending up together.

That's possible, but then one of them would go away somewhere, either khaleesi goes back to essos or rides away on drogon leaving jon in charge, or jon slinks back to the far north and leaves her in charge....that's better than them ruling together, but not by much.

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1 hour ago, Cas Stark said:

I always assumed she would live until she and Jon Snow hooked up, which I presume also happens in the books, that would make the end awfully fairly tale, the secret prince and the dethroned princess fall in love, unite, save the world and restart the Targ dynasty...did not seem like an ending the author would be doing.  So, I began to think Dany or Jon would die, and some of Emilia's statements have lent some weight to that idea, but who knows anymore. 

If Emilia's final scenes were filmed in Dubrovnik as Architectural Digest has claimed, Dany lives. Also, GRRM's outline said that Dany would live, and I doubt GRRM changed his mind about that in the intervening 25 years. I'm less sure about Jon and Dany ending up on the IT, though, mostly because of those Seville scenes filmed during the day with Arya, Sansa, Tyrion, Davos, Brienne and Bran's actors but not Jon or Dany's.

Kit was seen in London today. Done filming for the week, maybe...?

NCW said today that he's not done yet and is headed back to Belfast next week. Is it just leftover stuff (ADR, e.g.) or does he have something more substantial left to film?

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21 minutes ago, Newstar said:

If Emilia's final scenes were filmed in Dubrovnik as Architectural Digest has claimed, Dany lives. Also, GRRM's outline said that Dany would live, and I doubt GRRM changed his mind about that in the intervening 25 years. I'm less sure about Jon and Dany ending up on the IT, though, mostly because of those Seville scenes filmed during the day with Arya, Sansa, Tyrion, Davos, Brienne and Bran's actors but not Jon or Dany's.

Kit was seen in London today. Done filming for the week, maybe...?

NCW said today that he's not done yet and is headed back to Belfast next week. Is it just leftover stuff (ADR, e.g.) or does he have something more substantial left to film?

At this point, I feel that the author is wholly unreliable.

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On 6/20/2018 at 12:09 PM, Newstar said:

If Emilia's final scenes were filmed in Dubrovnik as Architectural Digest has claimed, Dany lives. Also, GRRM's outline said that Dany would live, and I doubt GRRM changed his mind about that in the intervening 25 years. I

 

I had NEVER heard that GRRM initially planned for Dany to live and my world is rocked :-)  Jon has already died once, so I thought Dany would die (it would be only fair).  We had foreshadowing in that Dany spent time longing for her son, Drogo, and the House with the Red Door. It just seemed right to me.  

We do know that Jon hated/hates being a bastard.  If rumors are true and Dany is pregnant, then either (a) Jon will marry her, then walk away and I do NOT see that happening
(b) marry her and die (50/50)
(c) or the baby could die.  But what about TPtwP?
(d) or Dany could die.  This one makes sense to me, if there is a baby. 

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27 minutes ago, lakin1013 said:

I had NEVER heard that GRRM initially planned for Dany to live and my world is rocked :-)  Jon has already died once, so I thought Dany would die (it would be only fair).  We had foreshadowing in that Dany spent time longing for her son, Drogo, and the House with the Red Door. It just seemed right to me.  

We do know that Jon hated/hates being a bastard.  If rumors are true and Dany is pregnant, then either (a) Jon will marry her, then walk away and I do NOT see that happening
(b) marry her and die (50/50)
(c) or the baby could die.  But what about TPtwP?
(d) or Dany could die.  This one makes sense to me, if there is a baby. 

I think GRRM said that five characters would make it through all three books. I interpret that as they appear in all three books, but as to whether they survive until the end of all three (6?) books is questionable to me. 

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6 hours ago, Bear Claw said:

I think GRRM said that five characters would make it through all three books. I interpret that as they appear in all three books, but as to whether they survive until the end of all three (6?) books is questionable to me. 

Yeah that's the way I initially interpreted it but I think the paragraph that precedes that statement is what changed my mind; I now believe the Big 5(6) will survive.  

 

Quote

The thirteen chapters on hand should give you a notion as to my narrative strategy. All three books will feature a complex mosaic of intercutting points-of-view among various of my large and diverse cast of players. The cast will not always remain the same. Old characters will die, and new ones will be introduced. Some of the fatalities will include sympathetic viewpoint characters. I want the reader to feel that no one is ever completely safe, not even the characters who seem to be the heroes. The suspense always ratchets up a notch when you know that any character can die at any time. 

-- 

Five central characters will make it through all three volumes, however, growing from children to adults and changing the world and themselves in the process. In a sense, my trilogy is almost a generational saga, telling the life stories of these five characters, three men and two women. The five key players are Tyrion Lannister, Daenerys Targaryen, and three of the children of Winterfell, Arya, Bran, and the bastard Jon Snow. All of them are introduced at some length in the chapters you have to hand.

That "however" in the second paragraph is telling IMO, as it links the statements of both paragraphs.  

Of course now he claims he was merely making stuff, and I partly believe him when it concerns certain plot points, but the essence of the the story appears to have remained the same.  

And whilst plot wise we know very little about S8, just going off filming news we do know; I wouldn't expect too many characters to die.  It really looks like much the entire main cast makes it to episode 6 and I just can't see them killing numerous characters in the finale.  At this point Cersei is the only one I'm expecting to die, and perhaps Jaime.

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All of the five characters (Tyrion, Daenerys, Jon, Arya, Bran) kind of died.

Jon was assassinated and brought back from the dead.

Darnerys survived the funeral pyre.

Bran was pushed out the window by Jaime and got crippled.

Arya became "no one".

Tyrion almost drowned.

Conclusion: Sansa dies.

 

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10 hours ago, alienarea said:

All of the five characters (Tyrion, Daenerys, Jon, Arya, Bran) kind of died.

Jon was assassinated and brought back from the dead.

Darnerys survived the funeral pyre.

Bran was pushed out the window by Jaime and got crippled.

Arya became "no one".

Tyrion almost drowned.

Conclusion: Sansa dies.

 

Sansa has become Alayne. I seem to recall GRRM even saying this in response to some question about Sansa. 

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GRRM has already said that he made things up as he wrote the outline to pitch a book and promptly forgot about it until it resurfaced over 20 years later.

Like consider that how GRRM has said that he's always known about the endgame of his main characters but his outline pretty much says Jon and Arya end up together. Who was Daenerys going to end up with?

And if you switch out Arya for Daenerys then you're changing both Arya and Daenerys' endgame.

 

 

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Full disclosure. I haven't read through the current discussions in this thread, so I'm sure there have been rants about this already. Don't mean to divert any current discussions, so if this has been brought up before in the thread, then just ignore me.

Okay, I just watched the alleged "spoilers" for season 8 on youtube. Frankly, I don't know if they were real leaks or if someone pieced together their own outline but frankly I'm not sure it would matter given how predictable, tropey, and fan-servicey season 7 was. My complaint isn't so much with the crappy dialog and rushed, nonsensical progression of the show as that's kind of expected. They're trying to wrap up the series without canon source material and without GRRM involvement. My problem is what they're using as source material. It's pretty apparent after season 6 & 7 that D&D are scouring forums for popular fan theories regarding the central mysteries. If the season 8 leaks are to be believed, then they're using even some more speculative theory like the bit about Bran being the Night's king and the high harp in Winterfell's crypts. 

If you're a book reader, then HBO's pseudo-confirmations of these theories are just made worse by the rushed presentation. We're waiting for BBQ but we're getting BBQ-flavored potato chips instead. If D&D had to write their own material, then I wished they'd only researched fan theories in an effort to avoid them, and instead rely on their own material to take the story in an entirely different direction.

Anyway, like I said, I'm sure this has all been ranted about before. I'm really just seeking validation. Please someone agree with me.

 

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I keep telling people that Sansa will be the Queen in the end. She will marry her cousin Aegon Targaryen, there is lots of foreshadowing in the books about their romance and the show did put a lot of effort and care on JOn and Sansa scenes, they were even shot with some nuances and romatic overtones.

 

Daenerys will be the final antagonist burning KL to the ground, that was her endgame in the first outline and it is still teh same now.

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1 hour ago, prettylongclaw said:

I keep telling people that Sansa will be the Queen in the end. She will marry her cousin Aegon Targaryen, there is lots of foreshadowing in the books about their romance and the show did put a lot of effort and care on JOn and Sansa scenes, they were even shot with some nuances and romatic overtones.

 

Daenerys will be the final antagonist burning KL to the ground, that was her endgame in the first outline and it is still teh same now.

I think you are right. The only thing that puts a doubt in my mind is some of the questionable choices the production team makes now and then. It seems that sometimes they appear to be setting up a plot, but then they abandon it. 

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12 hours ago, Coyote_Durango said:

My problem is what they're using as source material. It's pretty apparent after season 6 & 7 that D&D are scouring forums for popular fan theories regarding the central mysteries.

I get this feeling a lot when watching the show.

It's been so long since any new book and a lot of us like me read all 5 books in one straight shot, it's easy to overlook how unpredictable the books have been. Who guessed Ned getting beheaded, the Red Wedding, the Purple Wedding, Bran ending up in a cave North of the Wall, Tyrion in Meereen as a slave, Jon getting stabbed, Cersei-Qyburn and her arc becoming much more magical, the rise of the High Sparrow, the Hound with Arya... I could go on and on.

That the show is following the most predictable and unimaginative of the fan theories in stark contrast to how the books have coursed, I'm wondering if this is true.

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Just now, Bear Claw said:

I think you are right. The only thing that puts a doubt in my mind is some of the questionable choices the production team makes now and then. It seems that sometimes they appear to be setting up a plot, but then they abandon it. 

 

I will only post my theories in the next weeks because I am finishing re watching the whole show from season 1. I am making notes in every episode and paying attention to when they change from one scene to another, but I am alreay have SO MUCH foreshadowing from the show that Dany will destroy  KL and be the queen of ashes that its blowing my mind. They literally have been telling us from season 1.

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2 hours ago, Coyote_Durango said:

Full disclosure. I haven't read through the current discussions in this thread, so I'm sure there have been rants about this already. Don't mean to divert any current discussions, so if this has been brought up before in the thread, then just ignore me.

Okay, I just watched the alleged "spoilers" for season 8 on youtube. Frankly, I don't know if they were real leaks or if someone pieced together their own outline but frankly I'm not sure it would matter given how predictable, tropey, and fan-servicey season 7 was. My complaint isn't so much with the crappy dialog and rushed, nonsensical progression of the show as that's kind of expected. They're trying to wrap up the series without canon source material and without GRRM involvement. My problem is what they're using as source material. It's pretty apparent after season 6 & 7 that D&D are scouring forums for popular fan theories regarding the central mysteries. If the season 8 leaks are to be believed, then they're using even some more speculative theory like the bit about Bran being the Night's king and the high harp in Winterfell's crypts. 

If you're a book reader, then HBO's pseudo-confirmations of these theories are just made worse by the rushed presentation. We're waiting for BBQ but we're getting BBQ-flavored potato chips instead. If D&D had to write their own material, then I wished they'd only researched fan theories in an effort to avoid them, and instead rely on their own material to take the story in an entirely different direction.

Anyway, like I said, I'm sure this has all been ranted about before. I'm really just seeking validation. Please someone agree with me.

 

“Leaks” were touched upon briefly, but none of them are credible, and there’s nothing to indicate that they are true. I’m not sure if they were the same “leaks” you’re referring to. 

As for D&D searching for fan theories, I don’t think that’s true. I’m not sure which plot points from the show you think are just fan theories, but there are many mysteries and revelations I believe will appear in the books, though plot points will probably differ. These include:

-Jon’s resurrection 

-Valyrian steel being used to kill White Walkers

-Shireen’s burning 

-Hodor’s origin

-The Hound being alive

-The White Walker’s origin

-R+L=J

-Jon being crowned king

-Tyrion becoming Dany’s Hand

-Viserion becoming an Ice Dragon

 

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