Jump to content
AEJON TARGARYEN

Season 8: News, Spoilers And Leaks

Recommended Posts

4 hours ago, Nowy Tends said:

Millions of things can be said about this show, but certainly not that it's "well constructed", at least since season 5.

I disagree. It’s my favorite television show, and the vast majority of the viewing audience love what D&D have done with it. It’s ok if you don’t agree, but you’re in the minority. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, T and A said:

Says who? You? The critics say otherwise. Don't confuse being a fan with being able to analyse cinematography. This show is praised by everyone. Except some book fans, who are completely irrelevant, when it comes to analyse television.

I don t think anyone has to be an expert in cinematography to know if what they are seeing makes sense or not. No one is judging the quality of the filming, special effects and tecnichal things like that.

Most people criticize that there are several flaws in the story and actions the characters take sometimes. And I think we could write several pages about the awful decisions D&D have taken since season 5...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Lollygag said:

Instead of trying to change the subject, the correct response would be to tell me why Dany burning the Tarlys doesn't raise issues over her being crazy like her Dad. Tell me why burning them was smarter than holding them captive especially in the light of so much book and show context to the contrary and why she didn't have any other choice as you claim (rewatch the clip below). And also please address why the show is making a huge deal over Dany doing this if it's as you imply, no big deal and won't come up when Dany's at Winterfell (contrary to the leaks which were confirmed by people who were at the premiere btw). 

Also, give another think about the circumstances surrounding Mance and Olenna both in show and out. Those examples aren't helping your point. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXGBZ1s5k9Q

Per the video, Westeros has been given very solid reasons to question Dany. It can't be brushed off as those stupid Westerosi, stupid Northerners, stupid Starks, stupid Sansa. 

I think you are chosing your battles wrong. The tarlys betrayed their lord, fought against danny and refused to bend the knee. Danny had every right to kill them. They are her enemies… She doesn t have the moral obligation to imprision her enemies and try to convert them to her cause… Hell, after what they did to the tyrells they deserved to die.

And we start the season with sansa wanting to punish "kids" for their fathers crimes. While she didn t want to kill them it isn t a nice thing to do… At least danny is only punishing the people that actually do the crimes...

And while I understand that targs burning people is politicaly stupid given what the mad king did it is also the words of their house… If a stark went crazy with cutting people's heads should they stop cutting people's heads?

If you want to talk about the other million reasons for westerosi to not want danny I would support you. Like nobody would want the dothriaki in westeros, nobody would like that the iron born are supporting her, nobody would like that she is a foreigner that doesn t know anything about westeros, nobody would like that her claim is based on being the mad king's daughter and probably other stuff.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
30 minutes ago, Dragon in the North said:

I disagree. It’s my favorite television show, and the vast majority of the viewing audience love what D&D have done with it. It’s ok if you don’t agree, but you’re in the minority. 

Oh, it's your favorite, so that makes it a flawless show?  I'm sorry but a show can be successful despite obvious defects in construction, coherence, storytelling, whatever. 

btw, every show with a lot of nudity and sex will make a big audience. We all know that tits, ultra violence and dragons are the main attractions of this show for a large part of the audience. Not the Dorne plot…

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Nowy Tends said:

Oh, it's your favorite, so that makes it a flawless show?  I'm sorry but a show can be successful despite obvious defects in construction, coherence, storytelling, whatever. 

btw, every show with a lot of nudity and sex will make a big audience. We all know that tits, ultra violence and dragons are the main attractions of this show for a large part of the audience. Not the Dorne plot…

 

the dorne plot

the iron islands plot (after euron appears)

the vale plot (since season 5)

the riverlands plot (whatever it may be since the red wedding)

And even the north plot despite having several of the main characters has serious flaws.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, divica said:

I don t think anyone has to be an expert in cinematography to know if what they are seeing makes sense or not. No one is judging the quality of the filming, special effects and tecnichal things like that.

Most people criticize that there are several flaws in the story and actions the characters take sometimes. And I think we could write several pages about the awful decisions D&D have taken since season 5...

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/game-of-thrones

In average 94% on Rotten Tomatoes, by both proffesional critics and by viewers. This is nearly perfection. I'll take those critics anyday more serious than a pissed off book fan. Only Breaking Bad has with 96% critical ratings a better rating than GoT. 

Btw: Season 1 has the lowest ratings with 91%, which was the closest book adaption. 

Edited by T and A

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, divica said:

I think you are chosing your battles wrong. The tarlys betrayed their lord, fought against danny and refused to bend the knee. Danny had every right to kill them. They are her enemies… She doesn t have the moral obligation to imprision her enemies and try to convert them to her cause… Hell, after what they did to the tyrells they deserved to die.

And we start the season with sansa wanting to punish "kids" for their fathers crimes. While she didn t want to kill them it isn t a nice thing to do… At least danny is only punishing the people that actually do the crimes...

And while I understand that targs burning people is politicaly stupid given what the mad king did it is also the words of their house… If a stark went crazy with cutting people's heads should they stop cutting people's heads?

If you want to talk about the other million reasons for westerosi to not want danny I would support you. Like nobody would want the dothriaki in westeros, nobody would like that the iron born are supporting her, nobody would like that she is a foreigner that doesn t know anything about westeros, nobody would like that her claim is based on being the mad king's daughter and probably other stuff.

I'm keeping on track with the original point made rather than follow other posters down a rabbit hole of their choosing because they don't have anything on the original point. Unfortunately, way too many posters on this site use that tactic and it makes for a crap discussion and derails threads to nonsense. 

My problem and the original point was with folks ranting about stupid Northerners/Starks/Sansa not prostrating themselves for Dany on first sight and having valid questions and concerns which were actually put into the show just for that purpose.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Lollygag said:

I'm keeping on track with the original point made rather than follow other posters down a rabbit hole of their choosing because they don't have anything on the original point. Unfortunately, way too many posters on this site use that tactic and it makes for a crap discussion and derails threads to nonsense. 

My problem and the original point was with folks ranting about stupid Northerners/Starks/Sansa not prostrating themselves for Dany on first sight and having valid questions and concerns which were actually put into the show just for that purpose.

After watching her armies and dragons arriving in winterfell and knowing that the army of the dead are coming what should they do?

They might not like her or being suspicious of her, but they must be gratefull and happy to have so many people to fight the dead. Given the size of her army and situation in the north there wasn t much that could be done. jon had to form an aliance with danny and danny had all the power to decide the terms of the aliance. He would either bend the knee or marry her...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, T and A said:

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/game-of-thrones

 I'll take those critics anyday more serious than a pissed off book fan. 

Btw: Season 1 has the lowest ratings with 91%, which was the closest book adaption. 

When did I mention the books??? Anyway "pissed off book fan" is still better than "couch potato fascinated by tits and dragons"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Lollygag said:

Just curious, but can you explain why @divica 's list is quality tv? What are we missing? 

She said "most people", which is obviously bullshit as I just pointed out with the general critics about the TV show. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Nowy Tends said:

When did I mention the books??? Anyway "pissed off book fan" is still better than "couch potato fascinated by tits and dragons"

What? Who the hell are you? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, T and A said:

She said "most people", which is obviously bullshit as I just pointed out with the general critics about the TV show. 

I said most people don t criticize the technical details of filming got.

We critize the story arcs and actions of several characters. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, divica said:

I said most people don t criticize the technical details of filming got.

We critize the story arcs and actions of several characters. 

I know that. All I am saying is, that this has allways been the case with bookfans and adaptions. But generally speaking,  GoT is concidered one, if not the best television show so far.

Edited by T and A

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, T and A said:

I know that. All I am saying is, that this has allways been the case with bookfans and adaptions. But generally speaking, GoT is concidered one, if not the best television show so far.

And a lot of that fame came from the earlier seasons. You don t see much critizism of got before season 5...

And then what people are trying to tell you is that the hardcore fans stayed hooked because of the violence, sex and dragons instead of a good story.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, divica said:

And a lot of that fame came from the earlier seasons. You don t see much critizism of got before season 5...

And then what people are trying to tell you is that the hardcore fans stayed hooked because of the violence, sex and dragons instead of a good story.

So proffesional critics, who by the way love to destroy famous shows or movies, are also hyped about Dragons, tits and violoence? Have you take your time to read a proffesional critic?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
48 minutes ago, Nowy Tends said:

 

btw, every show with a lot of nudity and sex will make a big audience. We all know that tits, ultra violence and dragons are the main attractions of this show for a large part of the audience. Not the Dorne plot…

 

I agree the show has got flaws but this I completely disagree with. Those things you mentioned don't get BIG audiences, certainly not GOT biggest show in the world big. Sex, nudity gets old fast - and people can get that fix much easier online. Thrones has cut down on this too and the audiences have only grown. Things like dragons are ordinarily a turn off in terms of mass appeal, and so many ultra violent shows get no where. There are many reasons why GOT is as big as it, but these aren't any of them. Not really

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, T and A said:

So proffesional critics, who by the way love to destroy famous shows or movies, are also hyped about Dragons, tits and violoence? Have you take your time to read a proffesional critic?

Thrones has the foundation of great characters and great overall story, the development of which hasn't since been so spectacular in more recent years. The thing about critics is they watch and review so many programmes every week that they perhaps don't follow all the many individual storyline's, arcs and nuances Thrones has to offer the way dedicated fans do (how could they?!). BUT one thing that has remained and improved with every season though is the specticle of Thrones, which has reached a level the like of which has never been seen on TV before. This is why I think it still garners such praise from critics, because it's an incredible achievement and a one off.

Edited by HouseLancaster

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, divica said:

After watching her armies and dragons arriving in winterfell and knowing that the army of the dead are coming what should they do?

They might not like her or being suspicious of her, but they must be gratefull and happy to have so many people to fight the dead. Given the size of her army and situation in the north there wasn t much that could be done. jon had to form an aliance with danny and danny had all the power to decide the terms of the aliance. He would either bend the knee or marry her...

The characters don't have reader/viewer omniscience. Also, did you see the clip in the trailer where people were terrified of the dragons?

I'm not arguing the decision, just the expectation that people should prostrate themselves for her on first sight and ask no questions. They don't know that she's there to help them, they haven't seen the show or read the books and they're not going to be quick to take her word on that. She came to Westeros to conquer. Concurrent to Dany claiming to help them will be Cersei claiming to help when she's doing the opposite. We've been through how many books and how much tv? This is how Westeros works going back thousands of years. It's not gonna change on a dime to give Dany a Mary Sue moment. 

The show's theme from the beginning is how people don't prioritize the important challenges, sometimes for valid reasons and sometimes not (the Game). Dany went through this cycle of disbelief to belief herself. Most of the North and Westeros haven't seen, and of those who've seen 1 ice zombie, it's not like seeing the whole horde. It's the way we're wired (insert your favorite real-life example here). So no, like just about everyone in the series thus far, they don't really understand what's coming except in a very abstract way, and humans are notoriously bad at processing abstractions. We don't understand the gravity of the challenges until it's staring us in the face. And even then some don't see. Jon saw first hand and he still kneeled when it wasn't necessary knowing - KNOWING - it would cause political destabilization at the worst time. The way the theme is treated is making us aware that we have this same flaw irl, and the arguments about the game and rightful claims that posters like you and me get into are telling us that yes, we can be just as blind to stuff as the Westerosi. It's tricking the reader into the same bias the Westerosi had against Jaime all over again. 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, T and A said:

She said "most people", which is obviously bullshit as I just pointed out with the general critics about the TV show. 

You didn't answer why those listed items were quality tv or in general, how people critical of the show are missing something important. 

When we criticize the show, we go into (excruciating) detail to explain why we think that. But when people state that it's a good show, they don't address its problems and hand-wave off legit criticisms as "complaining" or "being negative" instead of showing us how we've misjudged the show. 

If you like it, then like it and own it. But don't conflate liking something with its quality. We all like bad stuff sometimes. I like disco and baloney, but I'd never, ever, ever put either of these forward as things of quality that others are wrong for disliking. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×