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Season 8: News, Spoilers And Leaks

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6 hours ago, sweetsunray said:

That was soooooooooooooo stupid, especially since they did make a plot point out of Moat Cailin, by having Ramsay send Theon to retake the damn thing as in aDwD. You'd think that Ned's "ward" and Ramsay would know of a shortcut around Moat Cailin better than Brienne would, no? :lmao:

But why would they need to go via Moat Cailin?  I feel like I'm missing something obvious here!

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2 minutes ago, Ser Gareth said:

But why would they need to go via Moat Cailin?  I feel like I'm missing something obvious here!

Moat Cailin is the only way through the Neck which connects the north and south.

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4 hours ago, 21st Century Moose said:

The army of the dead may be waddling at 2 miles per hour but they don't tire, they don't rest, they don't sleep. They'll be waddling 24 hours per day, so will easily make almost 50 miles per day. 

We were only shown what happened at Last Hearth, but Tormund did remark that anyone left north of Winterfell was part of them now. That includes Last Hearth, Karhold, the Dreadfort and Deepwood Motte. So they were either spread out wide and thin across the North, or the full army was zig-zagging about quite a bit. 

Wouldn't be as the crow flies though.

And the show emphasized Edd as having horses.  On horseback, pushing them hard, you could do quite a distance.

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1 minute ago, longest night said:

Moat Cailin is the only way through the Neck which connects the north and south.

Yes, I know that.  That's why I am confused.  People keep laughing about how Edd / Tormund got to Winterfell before the Undead and laughing about how they casually bypassed Moat Cailin to do it.

Moat Cailin wouldn't be on the path for either Edd/Tormund or the Undead to get to Winterfell.

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Ser Gareth said:

Yes, I know that.  That's why I am confused.  People keep laughing about how Edd / Tormund got to Winterfell before the Undead and laughing about how they casually bypassed Moat Cailin to do it.

Moat Cailin wouldn't be on the path for either Edd/Tormund or the Undead to get to Winterfell.

I don't know about any of that. Maybe they were joking? I know the Golden Company will have to pass through the Moat to get north, much like the Vale would have had to, yet nothing is ever mentioned about it. As far as we know, the Boltons still have it.

Edited by longest night

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9 minutes ago, longest night said:

I don't know about any of that. Maybe they were joking? I know the Golden Company will have to pass through the Moat to get north, much like the Vale would have had to, yet nothing is ever mentioned about it. As far as we know, the Boltons still have it.

Even if they land at White Harbour?

A precedent was set in an earlier season too.  Didn't Brienne and Pod have to take the long way around?

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6 hours ago, Dragon in the North said:

It was definitely feasible. The Army of the Dead has been moving at a notoriously slow rate. They clearly aren’t in any hurry.

Adding to their numbers too and they probably stop in their tracks when the Whitewalkers aren't around.

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2 minutes ago, Ser Gareth said:

Even if they land at White Harbour?

A precedent was set in an earlier season too.  Didn't Brienne and Pod have to take the long way around?

That is a possibility. 

 

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19 hours ago, Ser Gareth said:

Adding to their numbers too and they probably stop in their tracks when the Whitewalkers aren't around.

like for instance when the WW's stop to do abstract art on the walls made of human body parts? I guess the zombies are just standing around during these creative moments from their bosses?

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38 minutes ago, Suzanna Stormborn said:

like for instance when the WW's stop to do abstract art on the walls made of human body parts? I guess the zombies are just standing around during these creative moments from their bosses?

Maybe, but more like when Bran saw them all when he was marked or like in the books where two were found unanimated and then re-animated at night to attack the Old Bear.

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Posted (edited)

I would not be surprised to find out that the living win in episode 3 and either they outright defeat the Night King or the Night King retreats. All the fleaks reflects the idea that people have the expectation that they lose. It could very well be they win and then the Golden Company attacks. I certainly don't see another battle against the dead, that would be redundant. 

Edited by longest night

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19 minutes ago, longest night said:

I would not be surprised to find out that the living win in episode 3 and either they outright defeat the Night King or the Night King retreats. All the fleaks reflects the idea that people have the expectation that they lose. It could very well be they win and then the Golden Company attacks. I certainly don't see another battle against the dead, that would be redundant. 

Those are the only logical outcomes. If the dead win then they can kill almost all the people in westeros until they arrive in KL… That would make them unbeatable!

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, divica said:

Those are the only logical outcomes. If the dead win then they can kill almost all the people in westeros until they arrive in KL… That would make them unbeatable!

I expect in any scenario it will be Jon vs the Night King in a one on one duel. The Night King actor pretty much hinted at this.

So either they win episode 3 or early episode 4 by Jon defeating him, or they lose and the only option is Jon defeating him at a future point. Both situations are sort of "against the clock" scenarios, the latter stretched out as the dead continue south growing larger and larger. I definitely think we are going to see Daenerys turn her sights on King's Landing since we have set leaks indicating that.

Also, I don't see Cersei being the main villain at the end, she doesn't really have any power. She's more of a catalyst for the end game.

Edited by longest night

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34 minutes ago, longest night said:

I would not be surprised to find out that the living win in episode 3 and either they outright defeat the Night King or the Night King retreats. All the fleaks reflects the idea that people have the expectation that they lose. It could very well be they win and then the Golden Company attacks. I certainly don't see another battle against the dead, that would be redundant. 

I think the living will lose at Winterfell and beat a hasty retreat south.  The victory, against all odds, will come in Ep4 or Ep5.  I also think there is a strong chance we'll encounter Meera Reed and her father Howland Reed, who will confirm Jon's heritage.

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1 minute ago, longest night said:

I expect in any scenario it will be Jon vs the Night King in a one on one duel. The Night King actor pretty much outright stated this.

So either they win episode 3 or early episode 4 by Jon defeating him, or they lose and the only option is Jon defeating him at a future point. Both situations are sort of "against the clock" scenarios, the latter stretched out as the dead continue south growing larger and larger. I definitely think we are going to see Daenerys turn her sights on King's Landing since we have set leaks indicating that.

I don t know if jon will be able to kill the NK with longclaw but I think one duel between them is a must. They have been sending stares to each other for 2 seasons...

I just don t know if having the NK reach kl is better that having the series ending in a similar way it started with people paying the game of thrones.

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7 minutes ago, divica said:

I don t know if jon will be able to kill the NK with longclaw but I think one duel between them is a must. They have been sending stares to each other for 2 seasons...

I just don t know if having the NK reach kl is better that having the series ending in a similar way it started with people paying the game of thrones.

Jon dueling it out with the NK to me would be really cliche, I don't want to see that, I am hoping for something more clever as a way that the NK is either beaten or beaten enough he takes his army back to the far North.

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Some spoilers:

Miguel Sapochnik, director of episodes 3 and 5, revealed that he was initially meant to direct episode 4 as well, because those 3 episodes play like a single story, a complete piece with a beginning, middle and end.  This makes me think the Night King and his army are not defeated until episode 5.

Also, Frikidoctor (who probably has seen episode 3) dismissed the idea that the Night King might skip Winterfell and go straight to King's Landing, saying that it doesn't make sense.  He has been warned by HBO not to spoil anything, so he presented his statement as a theory, but I'm guessing it's more than just a theory.

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, Ser Gareth said:

I think the living will lose at Winterfell and beat a hasty retreat south.  The victory, against all odds, will come in Ep4 or Ep5.  I also think there is a strong chance we'll encounter Meera Reed and her father Howland Reed, who will confirm Jon's heritage.

Maybe. Though that begs the question of why Bran thinks Jon's claim to the throne is important. He even intentionally caused division between Jon and Daenerys by making sure he's informed of her actions with Sam's family. Unless he has to rally all of the seven kingdoms for some reason.

 

17 minutes ago, divica said:

I don t know if jon will be able to kill the NK with longclaw but I think one duel between them is a must. They have been sending stares to each other for 2 seasons...

I just don t know if having the NK reach kl is better that having the series ending in a similar way it started with people paying the game of thrones.

I kind of expect Longclaw to shatter if he's to wield Lightbringer. However, I question what the show plans for any of that.

I just don't expect the Night King to reach King's Landing. None of the set leaks indicate it.

9 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

Jon dueling it out with the NK to me would be really cliche, I don't want to see that, I am hoping for something more clever as a way that the NK is either beaten or beaten enough he takes his army back to the far North.

It's a fantasy epic with a hero. It's been setup for this from the beginning.

6 minutes ago, bloodsteel bitterraven said:

Some spoilers:

Miguel Sapochnik, director of episodes 3 and 5, revealed that he was initially meant to direct episode 4 as well, because those 3 episodes play like a single story, a complete piece with a beginning, middle and end.  This makes me think the Night King and his army are not defeated until episode 5.

Also, Frikidoctor (who probably has seen episode 3) dismissed the idea that the Night King might skip Winterfell and go straight to King's Landing, saying that it doesn't make sense.  He has been warned by HBO not to spoil anything, so he presented his statement as a theory, but I'm guessing it's more than just a theory.

That doesn't really indicate that. If say the Night King's army is defeated in episode 3 and the Golden Company attacks and destroys Winterfell, it could easily continue into episode 4 independent of the threat of the dead. We know the Golden Company attacks Winterfell. If the Golden Company attacks, it means either they think the dead are defeated or the dead are actually defeated.

Edited by longest night

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2 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

Jon dueling it out with the NK to me would be really cliche, I don't want to see that, I am hoping for something more clever as a way that the NK is either beaten or beaten enough he takes his army back to the far North.

It can be a duel that ends before they can kill each other, but I think they have to fight at some point.

Honestly, I would be satisfied to see the dragons having kamikaze atacks ending with jon and the NK crashing in an isolated place and fighting until jon kills him. I think the smart part will be about how to kill viserion and separating the NK from all the wights.

And I think we have enough profecies about a AA or prince that was promised that point that the NK will be killed. 

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6 hours ago, Ser Gareth said:

I think the living will lose at Winterfell and beat a hasty retreat south.  

I’m wondering how the living will manage to beat a hasty retreat south during the worst winter imaginable along all fifteen hundred miles of Kingsroad that stretch between Winterfell and King’s Landing when they’re being slowed down because they’re pushing a boy in a wheelchair who’s being tirelessly pursued by an immortal adversary who always knows precisely where that boy who is his chief target happens to be and who can fly directly to the boy’s position at dragon-speed at the least opportune moment.

Let’s hope that wheelchair doesn’t get a flat tire. :eek:

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