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Season 8: News, Spoilers And Leaks

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34 minutes ago, lakin1013 said:

The VF article is a very interesting argument, taking Martin's love for Tolkien's work and applying it to main characters in the show.  The argument is well-reasoned and supported.  It is a good read. 

Wow, that's an absolutely brilliant article. I'd never read GRRM's more extensive thoughts about LOTR so a lot is new to me. I'm entirely in keeping with all the arguments until the end. Whilst the article gives the best rationale for who they predict to sit on the throne, I still find it a stretch to see him as an effective ruler.

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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, divica said:

daenerys has a sword… 

Not only that: there are flames on Cersei's card, and ice on Daenerys', who wears her "cold weather flight suite". :ph34r:

That's confusing…

Edited by Nowy Tends

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48 minutes ago, lakin1013 said:

The VF article is a very interesting argument, taking Martin's love for Tolkien's work and applying it to main characters in the show.  The argument is well-reasoned and supported.  It is a good read. 

It mixes the show and the books and does it wrong. One of the objectives jon has in the books is to integrate the wildlings south of the Wall. So he can hardly go noth of the Wall in the books...

Another important thing, in the show jon's time with the wildlings was awful for him because he was always lieing to them and nearly everybody hated him. I don t remember the books exactly, but from my memory it wasnt  a nice experience besides his time with ygrette and tormund...

Another thing is that most of his interactions with aemon is about how to grow up and be a better leader. Thematicaly there isn t a conection between the maester's life and jon.

Frodo in lotr doesn t have a reason to stay in middle earth. The ring changed him profoundly and he has no familly or responsabilities. On the other hand jon has a ton of connections and responsabilities. The reasons frodo left middle earth simply don t aply to jon at the moment. The idea that jon would abandon his siblings to their fate and let westeros fend for itself after all the strife people have gone through is very strange.

Even the danny part starts wrong. In season 7 she behaved as humanly correct as posssible to defeat cersei (and lost a lot because of it). And her not granting Independence to the north is because they are one of the 7 kingdoms. If she gave each kingdom Independence because the people resonsably for them are good then she would end up with only the crownlands… It just isn t the way things work...

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16 minutes ago, Nowy Tends said:

Not only that: there are flames on Cersei's card, and ice on Daenerys', who wears her "cold weather flight suite". :ph34r:

That's confusing…

I don t see the ice on danny's. But yeah, she has her winter clothing. Is it still winter in westeros?

The flames on cersei's should represent wildfire… 

But I think the sword is just a huge clue that she will get one sword in ep 5 no? People even said that it looks like jamie's sword (widow's wail) which is right...

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1 minute ago, divica said:

Is it still winter in westeros?

Is up north. Arya and the Hound were clippety-clopping through a nice snowy scene.

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2 minutes ago, divica said:

I don t see the ice on danny's.

Look at the top of the frame

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1 minute ago, Nowy Tends said:

Look at the top of the frame

AAAHHHHH

I just saw it now! 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, lakin1013 said:

The VF article is a very interesting argument, taking Martin's love for Tolkien's work and applying it to main characters in the show.  The argument is well-reasoned and supported.  It is a good read. 

Really? I thought it was a pathetic attempt at appearing smart by someone who has obviously read the leaks, and is presenting them as his own "predictions" while mixing some LoTR references to appear philosophical.

Jon doesn't resemble Frodo in the slightest, and him leaving the realm instead of doing his duty which is what he has been groomed for during his storyline "you'll find little joy in our command", "let the man be born", etc, would be a terrible conclusion to his story. It would have been much better to have him die fighting the WWs then, instead of letting him live but then completely assasinating his character.

Edited by Xemi

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10 minutes ago, Xemi said:

Really? I thought it was a pathetic attempt at appearing smart by someone who has obviously read the leaks, and is presenting them as his own "predictions" while mixing some LoTR references to appear philosophical.

Jon doesn't resemble Frodo in the slightest, and him leaving the realm instead of doing his duty which is what he has been groomed for during his storyline "you'll find little joy in our command", "let the man be born", etc, would be a terrible conclusion to his story. It would have been much better to have him die fighting the WWs then, instead of letting him live but then completely assasinating his character.

I agree - he lost a lot of his character development in the battle of the WW and if he disappears from all trace having committed what the leaks are hinted at, I am not sure how he can recover from that. I guess we all foresaw, jon and dany having a child, with dany choosing family over power. The dragon is the problem tho as this creates a real imbalance in power.  I also feel jon is severing his connections - and that what happened with ghost. that was a good bye to the starks.  Rhaegal dieing could be his severing of his conection to dany, but also as Lyanna says 'I dont know what you are now' - jon doesn't know. 

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12 minutes ago, Xemi said:

Jon doesn't resemble Frodo in the slightest, and him leaving the realm instead of doing his duty which is what he has been groomed for during his storyline "you'll find little joy in our command", "let the man be born", etc, would be a terrible conclusion to his story. It would have been much better to have him die fighting the WWs then, instead of letting him live but then completely assasinating his character.

1

Jon has never been comfortable being a leader. It was Sam who persuaded him to stand for Lord Commander and that didn't exactly go well. He only got the North (or most of them) onboard due to Sansa's support. He's consistently proved a poor battle commander. He's quiet, brooding and not at all sociable. When we add the next episode's likely WTF moment when he kills the woman he loves, he simply won't have to stomach to rule in her place. It would be entirely in character for him to refuse and slink off for a quiet life.

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57 minutes ago, Nowy Tends said:

Not only that: there are flames on Cersei's card, and ice on Daenerys', who wears her "cold weather flight suite". :ph34r:

That's confusing…

Going out on a limb here but maybe Daenerys ultimately goes North with Jon.

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3 minutes ago, TheFirstofHerName said:

Going out on a limb here but maybe Daenerys ultimately goes North with Jon.

Sansa will be so thrilled :box:

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Posted (edited)

Btw....HBO is also selling t-shirts with the combined Stark-Targaryen sigil.   Hope they sell what they projected before Sunday because who would want one after then if the leaks are true.

Edited by TheFirstofHerName

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4 minutes ago, House Cambodia said:

Jon has never been comfortable being a leader. It was Sam who persuaded him to stand for Lord Commander and that didn't exactly go well. He only got the North (or most of them) onboard due to Sansa's support. He's consistently proved a poor battle commander. He's quiet, brooding and not at all sociable. When we add the next episode's likely WTF moment when he kills the woman he loves, he simply won't have to stomach to rule in her place. It would be entirely in character for him to refuse and slink off for a quiet life.

It would be completly out of character of him to abandon his familly or the responsability he has to westeros because he killed danny. Besides the fact that it would make the whole r+l=j the most stupid plot device used in literature… At this point, if danny daies jon has to be king… 

And jon was only ok with not being a ranger because they explained to him that he was being prepared to be LC. He was groomed to lead since for ever...

The poor battle comander is because D&D can t write a fucking battle, he was sociable in the feast after the battle of winterfell, sansa didn t do shit when they were trying to win the north to fight against ramsay...

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1 minute ago, TheFirstofHerName said:

Btw....HBO is also selling t-shirts with the combined Stark-Targaryen sigil.   Hope they sell what they projected before Sunday because who would want one after the tragedy leaked.

do you have a link to see?

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2 minutes ago, divica said:

sansa didn t do shit when they were trying to win the north to fight against ramsay... 

You must have missed that brief moment when she delivered a whole army to save the day.

 

I agree all that fuss over r+l=j is probably going to turn out to be an enormous red herring.

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2 minutes ago, House Cambodia said:

You must have missed that brief moment when she delivered a whole army to save the day.

 

I agree all that fuss over r+l=j is probably going to turn out to be an enormous red herring.

Northerns aren t people from the vale. IT were the northerns that named him king. She didn t help anything with that.

And with the ending you are talking about it isn t a red herring. It is just a plot in the books that was stupified behond belief. If they wanted to go that route the revelation doesn t make any sense!

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8 minutes ago, TheFirstofHerName said:

Btw....HBO is also selling t-shirts with the combined Stark-Targaryen sigil.   Hope they sell what they projected before Sunday because who would want one after then if the leaks are true.

I find this odd  - they never highlighted the combined sigil. I thought they would have made more if it, a symbolic gesture before the long night battle. That would have added flavour - even the troops had it embossed on their armor, but it was not mentioned. Fuck if things go as per leaks, they will be giving them away. I feel so pissed off with the current turn of events, that I cant even look at my stark t-shirt!

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