The Anti-Targ Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 LoL So, the Australian public turn out in numbers to criticise the govt on its assylum seeker policies. "What should be done?" "Should we bring them here?" Shit no! Send them to NZ, they've already offered. That's tellin' 'em! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 18 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said: LoL So, the Australian public turn out in numbers to criticise the govt on its assylum seeker policies. "What should be done?" "Should we bring them here?" Shit no! Send them to NZ, they've already offered. That's tellin' 'em! Haha. To be fair, a healthy % of the electorate would be more than happy to have them here. But the Government will never go for that, so many of us (including me) are proponents of the NZ option. My main beef with the whole thing though is that these people's livelihoods are only one small part of the broader immigration/refugees puzzle in our region. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Anti-Targ Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Also to be fair, the Aussie refugee quota (through official channels) has historically been higher on a per capita basis than NZ. I do get the perspective of people who are angry and afraid of assylum seekers just randomly arriving by boat, rather than through the proper refugee programme. But there's no recognition, and hence no sympathy or empathy, of the fact that most of these people are acting out of desperation and fear for their lives and wanting a better life for their kids, not because they are criminals and terrorists trying to sneak into western countries and destroy them from within. Would be nice to treat the refugee problem by fixing the cause, rather than dealing poorly with the symptoms. As much as our countries have been enriched in a variety of ways through taking in refugees, I'd much rather that people didn't need to uproot their lives because of unbearable conditions in their home country, and that they could come as regular migrants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 15 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said: Also to be fair, the Aussie refugee quota (through official channels) has historically been higher on a per capita basis than NZ. I do get the perspective of people who are angry and afraid of assylum seekers just randomly arriving by boat, rather than through the proper refugee programme. But there's no recognition, and hence no sympathy or empathy, of the fact that most of these people are acting out of desperation and fear for their lives and wanting a better life for their kids, not because they are criminals and terrorists trying to sneak into western countries and destroy them from within. Would be nice to treat the refugee problem by fixing the cause, rather than dealing poorly with the symptoms. As much as our countries have been enriched in a variety of ways through taking in refugees, I'd much rather that people didn't need to uproot their lives because of unbearable conditions in their home country, and that they could come as regular migrants. I agree on tackling the causes of the problem, but we are incredibly limited in what we can do to influence conditions in places like South Sudan, Somalia, Myanmar, Syria etc. What I would ideally like to see is Australia leading the charge (instead of racing to the bottom) in responding humanely to the overall flow of refugees in Asia and the South Pacific. If that means we have to dramatically increase our intake and/or provide substantial financial and other support to other countries (including the many in our region not signed up to the Refugee Convention), then so be it. The current policy of turnbacks, mandatory detention and protection visas is (apart from inhumane) pathetically inwardly focused and does not sufficiently emphasise international cooperation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karaddin Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 I feel like historically we've been closer to causing the problem than fixing it, and that's definitely going to be the case with future refugees from Pacific Islands that are going to disappear due to the sea level changes. Those people are our neighbours and in need, and contributed far more than they did to the problem - we should be throwing open the door to those neighbours and working together to get through what is coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Winged Shadow Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 Sometimes I wonder if it would be cheaper to just grant them refugee status, let them into the welfare/medicare system and provide them with education opportunities and let them be productive members of society. I read a few months back that it was close 400k/year/person to keep em out. Surely that money would be better in the welfare/health/education system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 24 minutes ago, The Winged Shadow said: Sometimes I wonder if it would be cheaper to just grant them refugee status, let them into the welfare/medicare system and provide them with education opportunities and let them be productive members of society. I read a few months back that it was close 400k/year/person to keep em out. Surely that money would be better in the welfare/health/education system Oh it would definitely be cheaper. As well as more humane. The trouble is that the major parties both believe that this would trigger a massive resurgence in people smuggling and maritime arrivals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 Hmm I sometimes wonder about Phelps. She was on radio today talking about the need to investigate further the eligibility of Dutton and Crewther. Is this wise when she herself could be in s. 44 difficulties with her job as a GP and Sydney City councillor? I'd have thought she would be much better off focusing on real policy issues that Wentworth voters care about: climate change, refugees, corruption watchdog etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karaddin Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 I assume it's meant to be a defence against those already making noise about her s.44 difficulties, whether its an effective one or not is a different story. I don't see any way that the GP angle could be a problem that wouldn't also get Dutton turfed out though, and I feel like the Sydney City councillor one is pretty safe - the local government position from the crown. The coalition should be avoiding talking this up as well unless they want to refer Dutton. I don't disagree with you though, I think the electorate mood is starting to turn on being awful to asylum seekers and she should be hammering climate change constantly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 29 minutes ago, karaddin said: I assume it's meant to be a defence against those already making noise about her s.44 difficulties, whether its an effective one or not is a different story. I don't see any way that the GP angle could be a problem that wouldn't also get Dutton turfed out though, and I feel like the Sydney City councillor one is pretty safe - the local government position from the crown. The coalition should be avoiding talking this up as well unless they want to refer Dutton. I don't disagree with you though, I think the electorate mood is starting to turn on being awful to asylum seekers and she should be hammering climate change constantly. Ah true, I didn't realise that she was getting proactively pushed on s. 44. Just looked it up and it seems like Barnaby has been stirring the pot - silly of him really given that eligibility fights have historically been a form of mutually-assured destruction. For once I think I agree with Katter - get on with it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karaddin Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 Just now, Paxter said: Ah true, I didn't realise that she was getting proactively pushed on s. 44. Just looked it up and it seems like Barnaby has been stirring the pot - silly of him really given that eligibility fights have historically been a form of mutually-assured destruction. For once I think I agree with Katter - get on with it! I can't even put words to the fucking gall of Barnaby. Gets knocked out on s44 himself, creates a huge scandal with his mistress, profiteers off the new kid then cries foul about people covering what he's putting out there as he loses his job. Less than 12 months later he's already trying to get the leadership back and talking shit about other people and s44 while broadcasting to the world that he's learnt nothing and clearly thinks of the position as his entitlement rather than a position of responsibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wall Flower Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 1 hour ago, karaddin said: I can't even put words to the fucking gall of Barnaby. Gets knocked out on s44 himself, creates a huge scandal with his mistress, profiteers off the new kid then cries foul about people covering what he's putting out there as he loses his job. Less than 12 months later he's already trying to get the leadership back and talking shit about other people and s44 while broadcasting to the world that he's learnt nothing and clearly thinks of the position as his entitlement rather than a position of responsibility. I, for one, can't wait to see the lot of them struggling to adjust to the Opposition benches, although I doubt it will dent the 'born to rule' mentality of Barnaby, Abbot, Dutton (if he keeps his seat), etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeor Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 I think a number of the Coalition don't have the stomach for Opposition again and will probably retire, and that's not a bad thing. The Coalition needs a refresh of people and will likely need a couple of elections before they're in good shape again. Lots of Coalition frontbenchers are in their early to mid 50s so may make the calculations about whether it's worth hanging on or dashing off to get a high paying private sector job. Dutton will hopefully lose his seat. Abbott is in his early 60s...he's always a political animal so may hang on, but he could see the writing on the wall and see his time has passed. Morrison's only 50 and if he gets a gallant loss in the election may be able to stay on as long-term leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karaddin Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 There is absolutely no way Tony is letting go, he'll hang onto his seat until either the voters or the party stomp on his fingers or his health gives out. It would be better for the party and for himself to let it go, but he's single minded and angry. The coalition really does need a refresh though, my ideological opposition aside there is a real lack of competence among most of the party - their skills are clearly oriented towards internal power struggles rather than being effective administrators, legislators or appealing to voters. I know my ideological opposition does blind me to that to some extent but most of them really don't inspire confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 4 hours ago, karaddin said: There is absolutely no way Tony is letting go, he'll hang onto his seat until either the voters or the party stomp on his fingers or his health gives out. It would be better for the party and for himself to let it go, but he's single minded and angry. The coalition really does need a refresh though, my ideological opposition aside there is a real lack of competence among most of the party - their skills are clearly oriented towards internal power struggles rather than being effective administrators, legislators or appealing to voters. I know my ideological opposition does blind me to that to some extent but most of them really don't inspire confidence. The trouble with the idea of a 'refresh' is that, in many ways, the current Cabinet is as about as 'refreshed' as the Liberals are likely to get. With the exception of a few old-timers (Pyne, Ciobo, Hunt), a lot of the senior ministry have been MPs/senators for ten years or less. People like Price, Porter and Taylor are very much 'new blood' in federal Liberal terms and will likely stay on in a shadow ministry. Even someone like Cormann, who feels like he has been around forever, is a relative n00b compared to Abbott and Pyne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 I’m no fan of Melbourne Cup at the best of times - but should the race really have been run today after all that rain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Posted November 8, 2018 Share Posted November 8, 2018 Three posts in a row! But I have to comment on the mess that is NSW Labor. Foley must surely be close to the exit now with an ABC journalist now going public with her allegations against him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karaddin Posted November 8, 2018 Share Posted November 8, 2018 49 minutes ago, Paxter said: Three posts in a row! But I have to comment on the mess that is NSW Labor. Foley must surely be close to the exit now with an ABC journalist now going public with her allegations against him. I hadn't seen it yet, he should have already lost it just on the basis of his own atrocious performance, but he should absolutely be shown the door with this coming to light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Posted November 8, 2018 Share Posted November 8, 2018 9 minutes ago, karaddin said: I hadn't seen it yet, he should have already lost it just on the basis of his own atrocious performance, but he should absolutely be shown the door with this coming to light. I live in hope, but not expectation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Posted November 8, 2018 Share Posted November 8, 2018 Sanity prevails!! Good riddance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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