Crazy Ex-Girlfriend S4 - We Want to Be Here [spoilers]

[Buckwheat]

This show just gets better and better. This was hilarious and so full of draaaaaaama.

[HexMachina]

I loved the redo of Everything I've done for you but this one was by far my favourite

Choke on your cocksuredness 

[SpaceChampion]

5 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Choke on your cocksuredness 

In-nu-en-do!!!!

 

There was a certain point in the episode where I just burst out laughing, and kept laughing for many minutes.  I don't remember what it was now, guess I'm going to have to watch it again!

[Buckwheat]

7 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

I loved the redo of Everything I've done for you but this one was by far my favourite

Choke on your cocksuredness 

I remember you linking this some time ago, I expected you to like that. (Okay, I did not realise this version had Dutch subtitles, but fine.)

2 hours ago, SpaceChampion said:

In-nu-en-do!!!!

Well, that was hardly the only instance of innuendo in this song (kiss around my sense of right and wrong - but not on it, it's sensitive, wink wink nudge nudge).

As wrong as this whole situation is, Nathaniel and Rebecca's scenes are really hot.

2 hours ago, SpaceChampion said:

There was a certain point in the episode where I just burst out laughing, and kept laughing for many minutes.  I don't remember what it was now, guess I'm going to have to watch it again!

I laughed at the whole Tim the Canadian lawyer suddenly becoming this profoundly tragic character after we have only known him as a wannabe-funny-but-just-ends-up-being-annoying side character. He is ridiculous. And also, Maya is adorable. I noticed Esther Povitzky being credited at the beginning of the episode now.

I think it was quite clear last season already that the whole priest thing is just Josh running away from responsibility and it is great that they address it in that way. He obviously does not know what he is doing and why. Loved his imagination of the holy Spirit (off to see Casper!) - it shows that even his faith is very ... simple. He believes in God and all, obviously, but he is not able to study theology which can be really philosophic and complicated. Even White Josh and Hector laughed at him when he told them he was "academically inclined".

Did this episode pass the Bechdel test? I can think of some scenes that came close, but they are all dubious:

• Maya and Mrs. Hernandez were talking about statistics Maya read, but they were talking more to Tim than to each other.
• The title sequence has four female characters talking about being or not being crazy, but ... they are all Rebecca? Do they even count as different characters?
• Rebecca talked to these women at the party about scool system and whatnot, but I do not remember any of them being named and they were certainly not important (well, you never know what proves to be important in the long run, but I do not think these women are going to appear again).

No Valencia or Heather. Not even Darryl in this episode!

[HexMachina]

2 hours ago, SpaceChampion said:

In-nu-en-do!!!!

 

There was a certain point in the episode where I just burst out laughing, and kept laughing for many minutes.  I don't remember what it was now, guess I'm going to have to watch it again!

I think it was when the chorus just chants in unison "EEL!" that I abandoned self-restraint

[Buckwheat]

^ The audience, err, congregation is entirely too calm here. I know they are not the focus, but a bit more shock on their faces would be nice.

27 minutes ago, HelenaExMachina said:

I think it was when the chorus just chants in unison "EEL!" that I abandoned self-restraint

I cannot understand what she says just before that. "You slither like a" WHAT? Can you tell me what she says there?

Ok, there are lyrics under the video on youtube. Just need to google around a bit. Silly me. Sorry.

[HexMachina]

11 minutes ago, Buckwheat said:

^ The audience, err, congregation is entirely too calm here. I know they are not the focus, but a bit more shock on their faces would be nice.

I cannot understand what she says just before that. "You slither like a" WHAT? Can you tell me what she says there?

Ok, there are lyrics under the video on youtube. Just need to google around a bit. Silly me. Sorry.

Mornay or moray or something along those lines which I assume is a kind of eel  

Also I just recognised the significance/relevance of the Harry Potter reference because Nathan said he enjoys Harry Potter in Santa Ana Winds  

[Buckwheat]

1 minute ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Mornay or moray or something along those lines which I assume is a kind of eel  

Also I just recognised the significance/relevance of the Harry Potter reference because Nathan said he enjoys Harry Potter in Santa Ana Winds  

I recognised that instantly. Big bad boss likes childish wizard books!

[SpaceChampion]

5 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

I think it was when the chorus just chants in unison "EEL!" that I abandoned self-restraint

I found it: it was Tim's song at 24 minutes in, especially when he sung "Now I know the meaning of the words, "Tim, that was nice.""

 

[Kalbear]

This keeps getting stuck in my head, especially the 'don't finish on my chest' bit.

 

[Buckwheat]

That song is indeed very catchy. Also very inappropriate to sing aloud in public.

Now there is quite a chorus of spiritual beings dancing and singing in this show: three dream ghosts, two memory spirits (certainly not dream ghosts!), and the Holy Ghost. They should do a group number.

I wonder if they are going to have any more songs where they include the "innocent" (cough cough) version in the show to air on TV, and then Rachel posts the "explicit" version online. I kind of feel this differentiation is somehow unnecessary after how explicit Tim's song and Rebecca seducing Nathaniel were. (And also, you cannot cut the spoken parts, like the dialogues between Tim, Maya, Paula, and Mrs. Hernandez.) So it is probably not necessary because they just include everything into the episode ...

 

[HexMachina]

3 hours ago, Buckwheat said:

That song is indeed very catchy. Also very inappropriate to sing aloud in public.

Now there is quite a chorus of spiritual beings dancing and singing in this show: three dream ghosts, two memory spirits (certainly not dream ghosts!), and the Holy Ghost. They should do a group number.

I wonder if they are going to have any more songs where they include the "innocent" (cough cough) version in the show to air on TV, and then Rachel posts the "explicit" version online. I kind of feel this differentiation is somehow unnecessary after how explicit Tim's song and Rebecca seducing Nathaniel were. (And also, you cannot cut the spoken parts, like the dialogues between Tim, Maya, Paula, and Mrs. Hernandez.) So it is probably not necessary because they just include everything into the episode ...

 

They are pushing the boundaries of what they can do given their timeslot on TV right now. They can't use expletives (hence "It was a shit show" getting a bleeper) and here are specific rules on the sexual stuff they have been doing. Like, they couldn't talk about Rebecca being "wet" for Nathaniel but they can use innuendo very extensively. I suspect they only got away with Tim talking about making his wife "Come" by tagging the next line on which makes it sound like it is a continuation of the sentence. 

Anyone more familiar able to tell me the more specific rules on this in the US? 

[Buckwheat]

These rules must be ridiculously detailed ... and also really silly. So you can say both poop and crap (and they did in the show), but not shit? They can speak so openly about orgasms, but not say she "came"? It is literally the same thing. As a linguist, yes, I understand words have not only the denotative meaning but also connotation and some sound more vulgar than others, but seriously ... The difference between the explicit and the "innocent" version of I'm a Good Person is that she says "fuck you" in one and "screw you" in the other. I do not think one is so much worse than the other.

And I can freely admit that I find some things in the show too much and not in good taste - parts of Sexy Getting Ready Song, Maybe this Dream. But it is not because of special words, but because of how they are used together. Or well, imagery. Which only goes on to show how subjective this is. Not that I would give this show to a child to watch, but I guess what I am trying to say is that once you have an open convesation about everything sexual and everything about poop, then you might just as well say so and it won't be any better or worse.

[GrimTuesday]

Man, I just about died when Nathanial relieved his method for dealing with his feelings. That may be one of my favorite songs they have done.

I love the fact that somehow they have made Rebeca somewhat repulsive yet still sympathetic. She may be kind of nuts, but at the same time, she is quite damaged, and while it doesn't make what she does ok, it brings home the fact that she just doesn't know any other way to interact with others other than being manipulative. Makes me sad but also root for her to get the help she needs and find happiness.

[HexMachina]

Heather’s apathetic uplifting musical theatre song was hilarious. And also I see too much of myself in her - I don’t want to graduate, I’m a student, I like saying I’m a student!

Lots of set up for next week though, and the music felt toned back after three big musical theatre numbers last week (well, four kind of, since we got the premiere of the intro song too). Still loved the episode as a whole though. Agree with GrimTuesday, Rebecca is obviously a terrible person but she’s so obviously facing mental health issues it’s hard to root against her and I want her to get the help she needs. Kind of helps that Josh was always pretty terrible too

[Buckwheat]

After last week, this episode did not seem as good, and I found the songs a tiny bit disappointing. Heather's "inspirational" song was funny, but Nathaniel's just left me wondering what the hell that was. This must have been the first episode without Rebecca singing.

Great to see younger Rebecca talking to older Rebecca though. And I am really glad some things are now out in the open and the friends might take care of Rebecca getting some help. She is probably the hardest patient in Dr. Akopian's career.

I got a weird Mr. Darcy vibe from Nathaniel when he went to talk about his feelings. I am not sure he is still convincing as this authoritative boss he is supposed to be, especially from his conversations with George.

So um ... did Heather just take all the classes or did she actually pass them too? I used to think she never graduated because she quit everything.

[SpaceChampion]

The choices this show makes always feel so right.

[HexMachina]

(Copy pasted from my post in pm so ignore anything that seems like a response to something someone else said):

 

I really loved this episode, although you are right it was very creepy and fucked up. But somehow it was believable. Even Greg’s dad, who, let’s be honest, never gave the impression of being a very good person. Rebecca was Greg’s girlfriend but isn’t now and Greg apparently moved on so Marco doesn’t have to worry about hurting his son (also a case of what Greg doesn’t know can’t hurt him). In addition to that, people have sex with people they hate more often than you would guess for various reasons. Often to hurt someone, or even because of self-hate. Or it could even just be Marco taking advantage of someone in a vulnerable state. But point is I saw many ways to rationalise it.

Jarl was possibly the only real comedic part of the episode, and I also really missed the musical elements but it was actually appropriate to have an episode like that when Rebecca has truly hit rock bottom. The end scene with utter silence and a close up of Rebecca’s face had me feeling incredibly sad.

Heather/Hector would be fun and I liked how direct they were. Totally in keeping with Heather’s character.

Hardest part of this episode (and last week’s too) was seeing Rebecca tear down her friends. Especially Paula  

if Daryll and WhiJo break up I might actually go into mourning

The song at the end was so meta and awesome though. 

[Buckwheat]

8 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

I really loved this episode, although you are right it was very creepy and fucked up. But somehow it was believable. Even Greg’s dad, who, let’s be honest, never gave the impression of being a very good person. Rebecca was Greg’s girlfriend but isn’t now and Greg apparently moved on so Marco doesn’t have to worry about hurting his son (also a case of what Greg doesn’t know can’t hurt him). In addition to that, people have sex with people they hate more often than you would guess for various reasons. Often to hurt someone, or even because of self-hate. Or it could even just be Marco taking advantage of someone in a vulnerable state. But point is I saw many ways to rationalise it.

I loved it too, but the tone is now completely different than in the previous seasons. Much darker and more serious.

I think it is really messed up from his side. We already know that Rebecca has serious issues and makes rash decisions and uses sex to distract herself and so on, but I really would not expect that from him. What I remembered about him from previous appearances was basically that he did not care about taking care of his own health, that he wanted his son to better himself and supported him in leaving, and that he disliked Rebecca. There probably were more information, but I do not remember any of it implying that he was a creep preying on younger women to sexually take advantage of their vulnerabilty. And simply, you just don't sleep with somebody your child has slept with. I just do not think the decision makes any sense. But then that probably just makes me a person who would not sleep with somebody they hate.

At least I am glad Greg found his happy ending. His character was special in that him finding happiness was always going to be to leave West Covina and the life of all the other characters, and I think it is fitting.

I think part of the reason the makers decided to put that scene in was to finally shut all the speculations of Greg coming back and ending up in a romantic relationship with Rebecca that kept popping up around the internet or in the questions in interviews and such. "We can't unscrew each other's friends" - much less parents.

Also, I completely guessed rightly that the Greg call was a mistake. I never get anything right, so happy that at least I guessed this.

8 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Jarl was possibly the only real comedic part of the episode, and I also really missed the musical elements but it was actually appropriate to have an episode like that when Rebecca has truly hit rock bottom. The end scene with utter silence and a close up of Rebecca’s face had me feeling incredibly sad.

I thought that Jarl was somewhat creepy himself too, with that "Can I get my hunting knife back?" horrible smile. The funniest part of the episode for me were the credits:

Stand-In BROOM DARRYL

Best Boy JARL THEDANISHGUY

Worst Boy JOSH CHAN

Catering REBECCA BUNCH and then a whole list including cookies, candy, various types of cheese etc., all being catered by her

This makes this the second episode in a row without Rebecca singing.

8 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Heather/Hector would be fun and I liked how direct they were. Totally in keeping with Heather’s character.

Hardest part of this episode (and last week’s too) was seeing Rebecca tear down her friends. Especially Paula  

Indeed. I think they are going to be a sideplot for a time, but I cannot see them sticking together for some reason. But maybe we get to see Hector's mother.

I knew what was coming there, that she would hurt everybody at once. I think it is amazing that they recognised she does not really mean it and this is just coming from a place of hurt and fear, and they still went to search for her. Even Hector and White Josh, who are not even really her friends (they are more of Josh's friends, you would expect Josh to call them for help, actually), came to look for her. But then comes the realistic Heather-insight and tells us she is not really looking for her because she has to figure out she needs help and ask for it before they can actually help her. I thought that was horrible, true, but it just goes on to show what a difficult situation Rebecca's is.

8 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

if Daryll and WhiJo break up I might actually go into mourning

The song at the end was so meta and awesome though. 

Agreed and agreed. At first it looked like Darryl just jumped into "we should have a baby" randomly and without actually thinking about it, but now it seems that it might be a serious dealbreaker. Also, do they live together now?

[HexMachina]

8 hours ago, Buckwheat said:

I loved it too, but the tone is now completely different than in the previous seasons. Much darker and more serious.

I think it is really messed up from his side. We already know that Rebecca has serious issues and makes rash decisions and uses sex to distract herself and so on, but I really would not expect that from him. What I remembered about him from previous appearances was basically that he did not care about taking care of his own health, that he wanted his son to better himself and supported him in leaving, and that he disliked Rebecca. There probably were more information, but I do not remember any of it implying that he was a creep preying on younger women to sexually take advantage of their vulnerabilty. And simply, you just don't sleep with somebody your child has slept with. I just do not think the decision makes any sense. But then that probably just makes me a person who would not sleep with somebody they hate.

At least I am glad Greg found his happy ending. His character was special in that him finding happiness was always going to be to leave West Covina and the life of all the other characters, and I think it is fitting.

I think part of the reason the makers decided to put that scene in was to finally shut all the speculations of Greg coming back and ending up in a romantic relationship with Rebecca that kept popping up around the internet or in the questions in interviews and such. "We can't unscrew each other's friends" - much less parents.

Also, I completely guessed rightly that the Greg call was a mistake. I never get anything right, so happy that at least I guessed this.

I thought that Jarl was somewhat creepy himself too, with that "Can I get my hunting knife back?" horrible smile. The funniest part of the episode for me were the credits:

Stand-In BROOM DARRYL

Best Boy JARL THEDANISHGUY

Worst Boy JOSH CHAN

Catering REBECCA BUNCH and then a whole list including cookies, candy, various types of cheese etc., all being catered by her

This makes this the second episode in a row without Rebecca singing.

Indeed. I think they are going to be a sideplot for a time, but I cannot see them sticking together for some reason. But maybe we get to see Hector's mother.

I knew what was coming there, that she would hurt everybody at once. I think it is amazing that they recognised she does not really mean it and this is just coming from a place of hurt and fear, and they still went to search for her. Even Hector and White Josh, who are not even really her friends (they are more of Josh's friends, you would expect Josh to call them for help, actually), came to look for her. But then comes the realistic Heather-insight and tells us she is not really looking for her because she has to figure out she needs help and ask for it before they can actually help her. I thought that was horrible, true, but it just goes on to show what a difficult situation Rebecca's is.

Agreed and agreed. At first it looked like Darryl just jumped into "we should have a baby" randomly and without actually thinking about it, but now it seems that it might be a serious dealbreaker. Also, do they live together now?

I seem to recall him making disparaging remarks about Rebecca and some seedy comments about women in general but might be wrong about that.

I never expected a return from Greg myself, but even so I got stupidly excited from Rebecca walking into that bar (That’s where Greg did his study drinking! I shouted at the TV) and was practically jumping up and down when “Oh my god I think I like you” started playing in the background. And was crushed when it was a mistaken call. I am glad it seems unlikely they bring him back though, much as I liked him it’s probably for the best narrative wise.

Yes Jarl was creepy but he still provided the more overtly comedic scenes this episode. We should thank the Danish school system for that!  

Rebecca’s hurtful rant was all the more difficult to watch because I recognise the behaviour having acted similarly myself towards my loved ones when they try to step in and help me. And yes, that includes throwing tsomewhat truthful thing so in their faces in order to hurt them. I’m not proud of them but it’s what mental illness does to you. 

I do hope Valencia gets some more screentime soon, and also another song, because she is always great when she sings and I want to see more from her character. As you mentioned elsewhere though, kind of difficult to predict what they’d do with her, since most of her stuff has focused on “Josh’s girlfriend” and then making amends with Rebecca, giving less time to focus on Valencia as a character in her own right. 

Speaking of characters in their own right...is George now a series regular? He has been in every episode so far I think  

also where is Karen? Or Angelique if she prefers...

whenever Loudres pops up I always remember her face and reaction at the wedding: “so I guess he’s not marrying this one either.”