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Shouldn’t it be the War of the Six Kings?


Canon Claude

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On 10/25/2017 at 0:32 PM, Ferocious Veldt Roarer said:

They don't call it "War of the Six Kings" for the same reason they don't talk much about the Ottoman Empire's role in the American War of Independence. Yes, it's obviously racism.

They talk even less about the fact that England outlawed slavery a few years before the American Declaration of Independence was written. Coincidence?

I can see why today's history books would leave out the Ottoman Empire; too "Islam-y." But I didn't see any mention of the Turks in the ancient books I learned from, back in the day. And I'm from the part of the country that never seceded.

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56 minutes ago, zandru said:

They talk even less about the fact that England outlawed slavery a few years before the American Declaration of Independence was written. Coincidence?

I can see why today's history books would leave out the Ottoman Empire; too "Islam-y." But I didn't see any mention of the Turks in the ancient books I learned from, back in the day. And I'm from the part of the country that never seceded.

This is spinning way off topic, but since we're there...the history books don't talk about slavery in Africa, or the fact that it was Africans who sold people to the rest of the world as slaves.  

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7 hours ago, DarkBastard said:

but since we're there...the history books don't talk about slavery in Africa,

Right again! So much interesting history ends up being abbreviated or sanitized. Sorry about the digression! Trying to get on track, it's not just the unreliable narrators but also the carefully edited histories and "song versions" that make the whole Westerosi thing even harder to puzzle out. No wonder George RR is having trouble weaving all his threads together to the logical conclusion, even though he knows where he's going.

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On 10/25/2017 at 8:09 AM, TMIFairy said:

Five sounded more "cool" than Six.

For similar examples look at the history of China - e.g. the Five Dynasties and Ten Kingdoms period. The distinctions between one and to other are pretty arbitrary, simply the local "maesters" decided that "Five X and Ten Y" is cool!

"The Period of Five Dynasties, or at least four and possibly up to eight, and Ten Kingdoms, depending on how you count them from eight up to fifteen" does not roll off the tongue so well ...

If I recall correctly, and if the story has merit...

My oldest brother had a roommate in college that was of Chinese descent. The roommate's birthdate was May 5, 1950. Fives are good. :) So 5-5-50, which was also the year of the tiger, was... In grrm terms, the Prince that was Promised, and such... ;)

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15 hours ago, zandru said:

They talk even less about the fact that England outlawed slavery a few years before the American Declaration of Independence was written. Coincidence?

I can see why today's history books would leave out the Ottoman Empire; too "Islam-y."

No. They don't talk about the Ottoman's Empire participation in the American War of Independence because, guess what, there was none. That's the point.

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5 hours ago, Ferocious Veldt Roarer said:

No. They don't talk about the Ottoman's Empire participation in the American War of Independence because, guess what, there was none. That's the point.

No mate it was racism it had to be there is no other explanation.

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Meh.  It was part of the overall struggle, but, more along the fringes. I can think of an analogy from RL history.   

Here in the US we talk about the War of 1812.  We fought against  the British in a few places.  It was important to our country, but  little  more than a nuisance to the British Empire, and nothing more than a blip against the backdrop of the Napoleonic Wars. Now those wars had massive implications worldwide.

 

I'm as patriotic a US citizen as any Wull or Norrey is a patriotic Northerner, but if I'm honest, the war of 1812 was really a side note, as was the invasion of the King Beyond the Wall.  Any Brits  in here ever hear about the War of 1812? Any French,  Dutch, or Belgians?

 

I know it's not a perfect comparison and the fine points could be debated at length, but I hope the main point came across.

 

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Because the maesters named the war, and they didn't consider Mance to be important.

Despite in world disagreements, the name makes sense. There are 5 seperate factions fighting for independence, control of the IT, or simply against each other. Mance and his war is a seperate conflict altogether, really.

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On 10/25/2017 at 4:15 AM, SirArthur said:

And then we have Balon's war, the strangest of them all: an independence war against the Iron Throne and against seperatists. He is in a revenge war. 

Good point. Balon declared Iron Born independence from the Crown by attacking a Kingdom that was in active rebellion against it. Had he not claimed himself to be a King Joffrey would have rewarded his loyalty. 

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On ‎10‎/‎26‎/‎2017 at 4:44 AM, DarkBastard said:

Mark my words, next thing we'll see is a post pushing for GRRM to adopt "Wildling Lives Matter" as the official words of House Giantsbane in The Winds of Winter.

 Indeed! Then maybe we can start calling Northern bastards by the surname "Snowflake".  

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12 hours ago, Ralphis Baratheon said:

Good point. Balon declared Iron Born independence from the Crown by attacking a Kingdom that was in active rebellion against it. Had he not claimed himself to be a King Joffrey would have rewarded his loyalty. 

Balon was mad, just like most of the Greyjoys.

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On 10/27/2017 at 9:45 PM, zandru said:

Right again! So much interesting history ends up being abbreviated or sanitized. Sorry about the digression! Trying to get on track, it's not just the unreliable narrators but also the carefully edited histories and "song versions" that make the whole Westerosi thing even harder to puzzle out. No wonder George RR is having trouble weaving all his threads together to the logical conclusion, even though he knows where he's going.

I couldn't agree more.

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