Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted November 11, 2017 Author Share Posted November 11, 2017 Laurie Kilmartin wrote a solid Op-Ed piece in the NYT regarding how this sort of thing affects all female stand-ups. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/10/opinion/sunday/louis-ck-harassment.html?smid=tw-nytopinion&smtyp=cur It is still a Men's Club of sorts. Hopefully this scandal helps to change that dynamic somewhat. She also outlines ways in which her job is kind of unique for women, which is an interesting counterpoint, methinks. From the article: If I am interrupted at my workplace (almost always by a man), I am encouraged to insult him, on the spot. I can mock his clothing and speculate on his abilities in the bedroom. I can tell his girlfriend that she can do better. I can smack him down, like an insect. Instead of losing my job, like the woman who flipped off President Trump, I get applauded. Cheered. Even better, if this man persists in interrupting me, I can signal to a bouncer and have him kicked out. Yes. I can have a rude man removed from my workplace. I wonder if Hope Hicks, the White House communications director, might want to have that power. Wouldn’t any woman? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mankytoes Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 21 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: From some of them, yeah. I think Jen Kirkman, Abby Schachner and Rebecca Corry have all said that he apologized to them either on the phone or in person prior to the NYT article coming out. Corry was not happy with his apology though, as he seemed to confuse whatever he tried with her with another incident. https://www.vox.com/culture/2017/11/9/16629400/louis-ck-allegations-masturbation From the article: There were a couple of times when C.K. allegedly reached out to the women involved, seemingly contrite. Both Schachner and Corry told the Times C.K. had tried to apologize, chalking the incidents up to “a bad time in his life.” But Corry bristled when his apology to her in 2015 seemed to mix up her incident with another — “When he phoned her, he said was sorry for shoving her in a bathroom” — and explained that he “used to misread people.” This, Corry felt, “implied she had done something to invite his behavior.” A little harsh, because MISread seems to be saying she wasn't doing anything wrong, he just thought she was. On the other hand, he is still saying he genuinely thought women wanted him to wank in front of them, which is a little hard to believe. ] I think most people on here have the tone right- we don't want to equate him with a rapist, while still emphasising that what he did is genuinely harmful and unacceptable. I can't help but think part of the reason he isn't inspiring the "hate mob" mentality is how well he is liked, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted November 11, 2017 Author Share Posted November 11, 2017 2 minutes ago, mankytoes said: A little harsh, because MISread seems to be saying she wasn't doing anything wrong, he just thought she was. On the other hand, he is still saying he genuinely thought women wanted him to wank in front of them, which is a little hard to believe. ] I think most people on here have the tone right- we don't want to equate him with a rapist, while still emphasising that what he did is genuinely harmful and unacceptable. I can't help but think part of the reason he isn't inspiring the "hate mob" mentality is how well he is liked, though. Yeah, that was part of the reason Corry wasn't satisfied with his apology. It implied that perhaps she had sent him some signal that was misread. It made her second guess herself for a bit. It seems to me that he is inspiring some measure of "hate mob" mentality, (see the Lena Headey Twitter above) it's just not as pronounced. I'm sure some of that is mitigated by how popular he is, but I think his reaction has also helped in this regard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eggegg Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 20 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Yeah, that was part of the reason Corry wasn't satisfied with his apology. It implied that perhaps she had sent him some signal that was misread. It made her second guess herself for a bit. It seems to me that he is inspiring some measure of "hate mob" mentality, (see the Lena Headey Twitter above) it's just not as pronounced. I'm sure some of that is mitigated by how popular he is, but I think his reaction has also helped in this regard. Yeah his likability and the apology have come into it. I also think that it just seems like the act of a sad lonely man with an odd sexual disfunction rather than the act of a malicious sexual predator. That CK has always been happy to admit to being a sad lonely man with a number of sexual disfunctions in his act probably makes all this less of a surprise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 1 hour ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Yeah, this topic just keeps gaining steam. As terrible as it is in some ways, I think it's high time all this crap came to light. Honestly, I hope it continues to roll, at least up until the Alabama Senate election takes place. Keeps the child molester Moore on the hotseat. It's insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zelticgar Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 15 hours ago, Joe Pesci said: George Takei accused of pulling a Cosby on a guy in the 80s...honestly wouldn't have expected that one. I'm not that surprised. They always bring guys on for him when he works the Stern show and he has grabbed a few guys on air in the past. His partner, Brad only gives him sex on Sundays and George has admitted he is super horny. I love George and if it turns out this is the only allegation then I'll give him a pass. However, I would not be surprised if all of a sudden people start coming out of the woodwork. Edited - here is the clip. I remember he was talking about this a few weeks ago on Stern and basically admitted he was not shy about forcing the issue if he thought someone needed to loosen up a little. Howard and Robin were trying to steer him in the right direction but he wouldn't take the advice. He is going to regret this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 4 hours ago, Darth Richard II said: From Our Lady and Savior Totally agree with her. *shrug* A lot of narcissistic drivel mentioning each and every one of his projects. I mean yeah he probably does feel gross for what he did...and quite frankly...good? Do I want him to crawl into a hole an die as someone aptly put it? No. I don't but do I think he's to be applauded for a well written apology? Nah not really. I was never a fan so I'm glad I don' have to feel conflicted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Honestly it felt like one of those non apologies to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Warlock of Qarth Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Meh, as far as apologies go, it's an adequate one, especially compared to all the other guys that have been outed so far. At least it seemed somewhat sincere, though words are wind and he'll have to prove he's a changed man. If he can show he's changed, I won't mind watching his new material in the future. The fact that Louis C.K. denied all the allegations until recently doesn't really bother me though. I'm a lawyer specialized in criminal law and my experience is that the vast majority of people will deny any allegations, until they're confronted with too much evidence, and even then a significant minority will keep denying it. Quite frankly, if the consequences for confessing are high (career wise, socially or both), most people are cowards and would rather deny everything rather than fess up. So yeah, Louis is a moral coward, just like the rest of us (barring a few exceptions). I have no doubt that most people would've done same thing as Louis C.K., despite their indignation that he didn't fess up earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 I mean I would never have masturbated in front of someone to even be in the same situation but okay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted November 11, 2017 Author Share Posted November 11, 2017 43 minutes ago, Theda Baratheon said: Totally agree with her. *shrug* A lot of narcissistic drivel mentioning each and every one of his projects. I don't think that was narcissistic at all, although I can see why some folks think that. I think it's more of an apology to all the crews, actors, writers, etc who put time into those projects only to have it torn down and thrown away because of his fuckup. Most folks don't realize how much collective work goes into a film or television production. The shittiest film or TV show you've ever seen likely involved thousands of hours of work by a large number of people. And Louis CK just effectively destroyed multiple shows and productions on the back of this. I have to imagine that he feels badly for all the folks who worked hard on those projects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Warlock of Qarth Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 7 minutes ago, Theda Baratheon said: I mean I would never have masturbated in front of someone to even be in the same situation but okay Oh, definitely! I merely meant that most people will not admit to major fuckups (be it masturbating in front someone, causing a fire that results in multiple fatalities, or causing a multi million dollar loss for your employer) if the consequences for them will be severe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Someone pointed out he never actually says sorry anywhere in the apology. I dunno I'm cynical as fuck this week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 2 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said: Someone pointed out he never actually says sorry anywhere in the apology. I dunno I'm cynical as fuck this week. Same. I'm not about to jump at the chance to applaud someone because sometimes he Does a Funny. 5 minutes ago, Warlock of Quarth said: Oh, definitely! I merely meant that most people will not admit to major fuckups (be it masturbating in front someone, causing a fire that results in multiple fatalities, or causing a multi million dollar loss for your employer) if the consequences for them will be severe. Fair point but I still don't think we should be so quick to forgive an abuser for finally admitting to being a shit when he' basically forced to. Like I said - I don't think he's the scum of the earth that should be burned at the stake I just think...he's a gross guy...and I dont really feel sorry for him Loads of people have weird sexual kinks and don't thrust them on other unconsenting people ya know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted November 11, 2017 Author Share Posted November 11, 2017 4 minutes ago, Theda Baratheon said: Same. I'm not about to jump at the chance to applaud someone because sometimes he Does a Funny. Fair point but I still don't think we should be so quick to forgive an abuser for finally admitting to being a shit when he' basically forced to. Like I said - I don't think he's the scum of the earth that should be burned at the stake I just think...he's a gross guy...and I dont really feel sorry for him Loads of people have weird sexual kinks and don't thrust them on other unconsenting people ya know? I don't think anyone is saying he should be forgiven. As others have pointed out, only his victims can grant that, and it seems like that has been a mixed bag so far. I think at this point the only positive you can give him at this point is that his "apology" was far more sincere, self-reflective and responsible than anything we've seen up to this point. He's leagues ahead of Weinstein, Spacey or anyone else you could care to name at this point of this scandal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Yeah and i just don't think his apology was great just because it wasn't as bad as the apologies given by men in similar positions. Bur yeah at least he apologised it's the least he could do just short on continuing to deny everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eggegg Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 4 hours ago, Darth Richard II said: Someone pointed out he never actually says sorry anywhere in the apology. I dunno I'm cynical as fuck this week. Yep. Thats taking cynicism too far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 9 minutes ago, Eggegg said: Yep. Thats taking cynicism too far. ...what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 5 hours ago, Theda Baratheon said: I mean I would never have masturbated in front of someone to even be in the same situation but okay Seriously I feel like a super sheltered kid lately. Like, did I miss something growing up? Did masturbating in front of other peopel suddenly become some American coming of age ritual I missed?(I'm joking there, but seriously what the fuck, don't whip it out in front of other people. What the fuck). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 4 hours ago, Theda Baratheon said: Yeah and i just don't think his apology was great just because it wasn't as bad as the apologies given by men in similar positions. Bur yeah at least he apologised it's the least he could do just short on continuing to deny everything. Well, I don't think anyone else has apologized yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.