Jump to content
Angel Eyes

So, how well will the Northern lords take

Recommended Posts

Jon bending his knee to Daenerys and subsequently screwing her? They're fair-weather friends at best and mutinous at worst.

Will they stick with him as the White Wolf? Will they deride Daenerys as a Talisa 2.0, a "foreign whore"? Will they declare for Sansa?

Edited by Angel Eyes

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, jcmontea said:

The Rule of Drama answers that question 

True, it does. But what do you think?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Whatever happens, all characters will behave in unexpected ways so as to create artificial tension.  I imagine the northern lords protest briefly and Jon does one of his "we don't have time for this, I have seen the nights king" bits and then the subject gets mostly dropped. Maybe a scene where Davos or some other character who has never actually seen Danerys do something that wasn't entirely self-serving will have a one on one talk with another character about how inspiring Danerys is and how amazing and unbelievably lucky everyone is to have a ruler like her.

I really don't care for show Danerys and how D&D and Emilia have interpreted her.  At least Varys and Tyrion halfway get that she sucks, yet somehow still say they're convinced that she is the only person fit to rule the 7 kingdoms.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Angel Eyes said:

True, it does. But what do you think?

My guess is that at the end of the day the Northern Lords will not rebel because they would have to be stupid to do so given the WW. 

But by the Rule of Drama we should expect as much tension as possible until we get to that resolution. 

What makes this one tough to know is there are SO many potential contlict points its hard to know which ones they will focus on.

I would say this one won’t be focused on though because the Northern Lords don’t have a major character in contrast to the following bits of conflict:

Jon v Dany: who is the rightful ruler 

Jon v Sansa: who is the rightful leader of the north and why did you bend the knee

Dany v Sam: you killed my father and brother 

Jaime v Starks: you pushed our brother out the window 

Jaime v Dany: you killed my father 

Dany v Sansa: your father killed my grandfather 

Dany v Tyrion: we gave up so much to reach a deal with your sister and she betrayed us and made us look like a fool 

Jaime v Arya: i want to kill your sister lover 

Jorah v Jon: your sleeping with the love of my life

etc. etc. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, jcmontea said:

My guess is that at the end of the day the Northern Lords will not rebel because they would have to be stupid to do so given the WW. 

But by the Rule of Drama we should expect as much tension as possible until we get to that resolution. 

On the other hand, my guess is that the Northern Lords will be stupid.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Angel Eyes said:

On the other hand, my guess is that the Northern Lords will be stupid.

Wouldn’t bet against you

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the North will be divided on this issue

Lyanna Mormmont will probably side with Jon because she usually does

Jon was the only person that fought for the Karstark and Umber kids so unless Sansa says to them 'I know what it's like to be called the daughter of a traitor, I should have fought for you'  then I think they'd side with Jon.

A couple of the Northern Lords have already started to tell Sansa that they should named her Queen over Jon but we don't know if that was because of anything she's done for them or if Littlefinger was whispering in their ear.

A lot of the older Lords will have a problem with Daenerys and will probably question why Jon knelt to her.

tough to say really

EDIT (forgot to add this  - Tyrion Sansa's husband is coming North as well. Will they want to support Sansa while a Lannister is there?

Edited by WildlingWitch

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it'll be natural for many to not be happy but faced with the fact that the north is between the force of the others and Daenerys and her dragons. Rebel against them or fight for their lives along side them? hopefully their stubbornness won't kill them all.

And it's not really a question of Sansa's rights, ahead of her is Bran who seems more than happy to give it up for Jon so if it's a matter of people using the Stark excuse they'll have to go against that as well.

I think it'll make more sense for it to be presented as an alliance not a bending the knee situation, before Westeros Dany talking about marrying for political reasons, on this boat trip a betrothal or wedding could be organised and then place the Stark's as warden's of the North again and get back to surviving and then get rid of Cersei.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think they’ll be pissed but then someone - probably Jon - will give an inspirational speech with swelling music in the background and it’ll all be fine. White Walkers to deal with and whatnot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They will be pissed for about 15 minutes, until they learn the Wall has been breached, and Cersei has lied about sending Lannister forces to join along side them against the WW's. There are plenty of witness's to Dany risking everything for the sake of the North after the the trip North of the Wall to capture a WW. 

 

I mean, do they really think they can stand alone vs the White Walkers, and the Lannisters, and Dany? Besides, precedent is on the side of Jon, not to mention a revelation by Bran stating Roberts war was a farce could be a game changer. The only tensions that might come from this are after the war.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They'll be whining for a good 2 episodes and when they learn of the wall breach and an attack on the nearest castle, they'll be up on the dragon queen's ass.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/14/2017 at 10:12 AM, Faera said:

I think they’ll be pissed but then someone - probably Jon - will give an inspirational speech with swelling music in the background and it’ll all be fine. White Walkers to deal with and whatnot.

This.

It's going to be forced drama that won't make sense at any point (except for maybe the beginning when they don't agree with Jon's choices).

Unfortunately a lot about this show has gotten pretty predictable. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, btfu806 said:

This.

It's going to be forced drama that won't make sense at any point (except for maybe the beginning when they don't agree with Jon's choices).

Unfortunately a lot about this show has gotten pretty predictable. 

Yep, it'll be Jon vs "Pointless Northern Bickering" that goes nowhere and is resolved as quickly as it is established. The Northern Lords are so vacuous, flippant and bland in the show - and yes, that includes Lady Mormont - I hope they don't waste much time on them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Faera said:

Yep, it'll be Jon vs "Pointless Northern Bickering" that goes nowhere and is resolved as quickly as it is established. The Northern Lords are so vacuous, flippant and bland in the show - and yes, that includes Lady Mormont - I hope they don't waste much time on them.

Spoiler

 

:agree:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While I agree that the Northern Lords will accept Dany's help with the War for the Dawn, what happens after is the real question.  If they say 'Thanks.  You've been great.  Now please head back down south because we're not bending the knee.' will she burn them like the Tarleys?  They'd be absolute fools to pass up dragons in fighting the Night King, but afterwards is where it matters.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/13/2017 at 7:19 PM, Lucius Lovejoy said:

Whatever happens, all characters will behave in unexpected ways so as to create artificial tension.  I imagine the northern lords protest briefly and Jon does one of his "we don't have time for this, I have seen the nights king" bits and then the subject gets mostly dropped. Maybe a scene where Davos or some other character who has never actually seen Danerys do something that wasn't entirely self-serving will have a one on one talk with another character about how inspiring Danerys is and how amazing and unbelievably lucky everyone is to have a ruler like her.

I really don't care for show Danerys and how D&D and Emilia have interpreted her.  At least Varys and Tyrion halfway get that she sucks, yet somehow still say they're convinced that she is the only person fit to rule the 7 kingdoms.

Agreed, there will most definitely be some exaggerated conflict between the Northern lords Jon + Daenerys that we all know is just D&D fabricating some strain and false outrage as filler for the show. Not that I don't understand how the presence of a Targayren would be problematic to the North considering history and all that, I just hope the show doesn't spend too much time on the drama of it all. Considering she still has dragons left and the dead are on their way... and its important to remember that the dead will be gathering meat for their army in the North first. Priorities, priorities..

Anyway show Dany sucks in my opinion. I love her character but she's just becoming increasingly more hypocritical as time goes on and it's clear Tyrion and Varys have noticed which makes me wonder why they bother still supporting her. I mean, Cersei is an asshole but she doesn't really pretend like she's not. Daenerys keeps acting like she's about to restore peace to the realm, as if the Targaryens are known for being peaceful. I require redemption from her, and shes not gonna get it from bedding her nephew (another thing I'm butthurt about) so she's gonna have to some cool badass sacrifice and save the North for me to think she's cool again lol

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Forest Lass said:

Anyway show Dany sucks in my opinion. I love her character but she's just becoming increasingly more hypocritical as time goes on and it's clear Tyrion and Varys have noticed which makes me wonder why they bother still supporting her. I mean, Cersei is an asshole but she doesn't really pretend like she's not. Daenerys keeps acting like she's about to restore peace to the realm, as if the Targaryens are known for being peaceful. I require redemption from her, and shes not gonna get it from bedding her nephew (another thing I'm butthurt about) so she's gonna have to some cool badass sacrifice and save the North for me to think she's cool again lol

I'm 100% on board with that.  Her hooking up with Jon definitely only made things worse because once they find out they're related I am certain they are going to be like "ah, no big deal, we're Targs it's cool" which is pretty disgusting.  Unfortunately I think we are just going to get a sappy childbirth death and never get any explanation whatsoever of what breaking the wheel means or insight into any of Danerys' governing policies besides "bend the knee and no slavery" which actually isn't that radical in Westeros.  It's actually the same policy Stannis had, only Stannis had more sweeping social reforms to protect the smallfolk and he didn't bring a horde of savage rapers and dragons to the country.  No matter, Danerys will be remembered by all show characters as the greatest hero that ever was, even if she does nothing in Westeros to deserve it.  We can only hope that she dies a badass self sacrificing death, but I don't see it.

She would have been such an awesome villain, which is where I thought her story was going until midway through ADWD.  Much better than Euron or Cersei, and I loved S1-S5 Cersei.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Lucius Lovejoy said:

I'm 100% on board with that.  Her hooking up with Jon definitely only made things worse because once they find out they're related I am certain they are going to be like "ah, no big deal, we're Targs it's cool" which is pretty disgusting.  Unfortunately I think we are just going to get a sappy childbirth death and never get any explanation whatsoever of what breaking the wheel means or insight into any of Danerys' governing policies besides "bend the knee and no slavery" which actually isn't that radical in Westeros. 

I can see it bothering them, I'm pretty sure incest was a Targaryen tradition Dany was hoping to abandon after growing up believing she was doomed to marry Viserys. When Jon learns of his parentage from Sam or Bran he'd be sickened to find out he boned his father's sister. But I can also see them being like "we're both sexy and didn't know, now we're in love..oh wells"

Jon deserves better goddammit. I don't know who exactly... but gods, please, NO MORE INCEST!!! I can forgive it all I guess if Dany breaks the wheel or whatever but doubt we'll see that happen

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Northern Lords? That's a good one! This piece of shit fanfic made up by Dumb and Dumber has turned The North into a JOKE! Lyanna Mormont, a 10 year old CHILD is Jon's greatest supporter and apparently this child can insult Northern Lords and call them cowards to their faces and they just sit there and take it. Lord Wyman Manderly, one of the few Northern Lords still loyal to the Starks and a fascinating character in the books, has been turned into just some old guy who didn't feel like siding with Jon during the battle of the Bastards because.... he didn't want people to die? Brilliant writing! The only person i see starting shit with the foreign whore ( let's be honest, that's what she is in the show version ) is Sansa Bolton. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×