The Last Jedi, not the last spoiler thread

[Rockroi]

16 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said:

OK, question, how are they able to track the Falcon in ANH? Isn't that hyperdrive tracking?

Also, as I think about it more, that hyperdrive ram is kind of some bullshit. It just looked so cool I think people are willing to forgive it.(Well, some)

Tarkin installs a honing beacon on the Falcon.  To do that he needed access to the ship and the ability to put a tracking device on the ship itself.  Because Tarkin had the Falcon the whole time, he could do this.  Hux had no ability to do that in TLJ.  So he had to track the ships through Hyperspace which, until then, was impossible.  

I think.  

[Darth Richard II]

6 minutes ago, Rockroi said:

Tarkin installs a honing beacon on the Falcon.  To do that he needed access to the ship and the ability to put a tracking device on the ship itself.  Because Tarkin had the Falcon the whole time, he could do this.  Hux had no ability to do that in TLJ.  So he had to track the ships through Hyperspace which, until then, was impossible.  

I think.  

Duh, thanks. My brain is not completely working right today.

[Darth Richard II]

Also, just throwing this out there, but John Williams rocks your socks.

[aceluby]

6 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said:

Also, just throwing this out there, but John Williams rocks your socks.

Best part in all the films

[Derfel Cadarn]

Since Disney now own 20th Century Fox, does this mean we can now get the distinctive fanfare?

[mormont]

2 hours ago, denstorebog said:

 Suffice to say though, you will find very few people who didn't think Rey's parentage was an issue after TFA. If you're in doubt, watch the hundreds of interviews where JJ or the actors are asked about her parents, and they immediately go coy about it. This was a big deal to pretty much everyone who watched the movie.

I think you're wrong about that. I'd be prepared to bet cash money that most who saw the movie didn't walk out pondering theories about Rey's parents being a known character like Luke.

It's the same phenomenon as noted above, about loud critics being more visible than happy audiences. It only takes one person in ten to believe there might be something in a theory like that for it to be seemingly everywhere, for cast members to get asked about it, and so on. Obviously, people who don't have questions don't tend to be as visible as those who do.

Anyway, I'm quite content with the idea that Rey's parents aren't important. It fits well with the idea that the Force is about balance, not bloodlines.

2 hours ago, denstorebog said:

If this was not intended to be a central mystery, why not just come out and say "hey, it's not that important"?

Why would anyone quash interest in their own film?

We should never judge intentions by outcomes, anyway.

1 hour ago, The BlackBear said:

Domnhall Gleeson is a fun baddie, (but with Snoke now gone, I just can't see these two kids running the FO.)

Kids? Gleeson and Driver are both 34.

1 hour ago, The BlackBear said:

But elements I really didn't like. I think I may have sprained my eyes, rolling them at Leia flying through space.

Cold, dead soul.

It's the one and only time Leia will get to show cool Force powers on screen. It's easily more credible than any other show of Force power in the film. It's a beautiful shot. It's brief. It does no damage whatsoever to the plot. It's trivial in comparison to numerous other problems the film has. It brought joy to lots and lots of fans. Let Leia have her moment.

[Ran]

What was that earlier about arguments couched in emotional language? Hmm...

[Eggegg]

Ray's parenthood, Snoke's irrelevance and Leia superman flying skills are all moments that many people are up in arms about around the internet, and I agree they all pretty much take a dump on the story, but I also agree that those problems are trivial compared to the extremely long run time, Finn and Rose's detour, the out of place humour and  the fact that really nothing of consequence has changed during this movie.

 

[Ferrum Aeternum]

I went to see the movie on opening night. My initial impressions were mixed, and I've found that having time to process what I saw hasn't helped that. While I was pleased with the overall direction of the story, loved the design and visuals, and didn't mind most of the trope bending, there were some decisions that I found puzzling or frustrating. As far as where I would rate the film - It's about on par for me with TFA. Not nearly as good as ANH or ESB in my view. And I still prefer Rogue One in terms of plot cohesion and overall feel to either TFA or TLJ. I also think it's telling that I haven't felt the need for a re-watch yet despite being an affirmed Star Wars nut. 

The good:

I very much appreciated the humor. In fact, I'd say this was easily the funniest SW movie to date. It all worked for me. I even loved the Porgs, which I wasn't expecting at all. They were used in exactly the right dose and context. Even some of the heaviest moments in the film (like the battle at Crait) benefited from some spot-on comedic intervention.

I thought all the performances were very good. Still a big fan Rey and Kylo Ren as the "lead" characters and now they are set up well for whatever final showdown IX will bring. While I would like to have known more about Snoke, Kylo Ren taking him down was a highlight of the film for me.    

Don't care if the funky Starwars-science made sense or not:  the hyperspace ram was bad ass as hell, and easily my favorite moment of the movie. Admiral Holdo was a fun character overall and her final act of sacrifice was amazing to watch unfold.

I've come around on Leia's force flight. It was a bit jarring to see at first, but the more I thought about it the more it made sense. 

The not-so-good:

I'm not going to reinvent the wheel on the criticisms (the Canto Bight side story, dismissal of allegedly important plot points and characters from TFA, numerous silly holes/contrivances) - suffice to say that several posters here have pretty well covered it. In fact, those arguing the various criticism are exercising considerably more logic IMO than those arguing that the film is top 2 or 3 in the franchise. 

A personal beef - filmmakers, can we please stick to Easter eggs (which are fun and can be used to provide meaningful context) and drop the damned callbacks (which are lazy, boring and frequently pointless)? For a film being hyped as so "original" there were far too many sequences taken almost directly from the OT. I mean most of the battle on Crait essentially was the Battle of Hoth. Chewie leading TIE fighters on a mad chase through tight confines, even turning the Falcon sideways to squeeze through a narrow opening as the ships explode behind them...hmm, oddly familiar. And then Kylo and Rey riding up the elevator to see Snoke...where have I seen that one before? Dunno, maybe in the last SW movie to include a Big Bad Guy sitting on a throne surrounded by staff-wielding guards wearing red outfits.    And yes, I'm aware the OT itself was full of callbacks and straight up copycats of other movies; the important distinction being those were other, unrelated movies. Not earlier movies from the same franchise. I don't know, maybe most people like that kind of thing. I find it to be boring as hell and a detraction from an otherwise "fresh" experience.

[Darth Richard II]

Not sure how Leia's awesome as fuck moment dumps on the story.

[Eggegg]

15 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said:

Not sure how Leia's awesome as fuck moment dumps on the story.

Why did it even happen? She spent most of the rest of the movie in a coma. It only seemed to happen to give her some sort of ‘moment’ at the end with Luke and to make her more badass 

[Darth Richard II]

31 minutes ago, Eggegg said:

Why did it even happen? She spent most of the rest of the movie in a coma. It only seemed to happen to give her some sort of ‘moment’ at the end with Luke and to make her more badass 

I don't even know how to respond to that. By that logic why does anything that happen in a movie happen?

What would you have preferred she do in the movie? Stand around in a gold bikini?

[A True Kaniggit]

In response to the argument that the light speed ram wouldn't work because the cruiser was in hyperspace-

In ANH Han tells Luke right before he goes into hyperspace for the first time,"Traveling through hyperspace ain't like dusting crops, boy! Without precise calculations we could fly right through a star or bounce too close to a supernova, and that'd end your trip real quick, wouldn't it?"

So it was already established in the first movie released that objects in real space and objects in hyperspace do interact. 

[Darth Richard II]

Perhaps, I don't try and understand Hyperspace things even in silly things like this. It hurts my brain. I do wish they were a bit more consistent though.

[Spring Bass]

Hyperspace ram only worked because they weren't expecting it, it was a huge-ass ship doing it, and an even bigger ship being targeted. If they started regularly trying to hyperspace ram other ships, tactics would change (especially since Star Wars ships are capable of moving at a significant fraction of light speed even without using FTL).

1 hour ago, Eggegg said:

Ray's parenthood, Snoke's irrelevance and Leia superman flying skills are all moments that many people are up in arms about around the internet, and I agree they all pretty much take a dump on the story, but I also agree that those problems are trivial compared to the extremely long run time, Finn and Rose's detour, the out of place humour and  the fact that really nothing of consequence has changed during this movie.

It's weird seeing Snoke talked about as if he was a mystery being set up that wasn't answered. We found out about Snoke about as much as we found out about the Emperor and Tarkin in the Old Trilogy, and not much less than what we know about Palpatine from the first six movies. He's just what he appears to be on the surface - a powerful dark-side force user who is trying to reassemble the Empire, and recruited Ren.

If you can pull on stuff with the Force, it logically makes sense that you could grab on to stuff and pull yourself towards it - equal and opposite reaction and all that.

The point of Finn and Rose's detour was that it was a disastrous plan that ultimately made things worse, which was the whole point of Poe's character arc this movie.

[aceluby]

1 hour ago, mormont said:

I think you're wrong about that. I'd be prepared to bet cash money that most who saw the movie didn't walk out pondering theories about Rey's parents being a known character like Luke.

Can I take that bet?  Even my mom wondered who Rey's parents were going to be coming out of the theater.  It was literally the biggest open question left by the film.  I'm seriously wondering how you missed that.

[Mark Antony]

Just now, aceluby said:

Can I take that bet?  Even my mom wondered who Rey's parents were going to be coming out of the theater.  It was literally the biggest open question left by the film.  I'm seriously wondering how you missed that.

Yup saw TFA with my brother who is as casual a Star Wars fan as it gets and he was theorizing about who her parents were. 

Still I'm pleased that her parents turned out to be no one and hope it stays that way.

[divica]

1 hour ago, mormont said:

I think you're wrong about that. I'd be prepared to bet cash money that most who saw the movie didn't walk out pondering theories about Rey's parents being a known character like Luke.

Get ready to lose Money. Most people I talked with about the movie theorized the her parents were related to luke. I mean, there are so manny moments in the first movie about who her parents are and how she relates to the older characters... 

[Darth Richard II]

3 minutes ago, aceluby said:

Can I take that bet?  Even my mom wondered who Rey's parents were going to be coming out of the theater.  It was literally the biggest open question left by the film.  I'm seriously wondering how you missed that.

Yeah got to go with ace here, Rey's parents/bloodline was a huge deal and a huge mystery to just about everyone. Now, I like how the resolved it a lot, but it was the most talked about thing about 7 up til the release of 8.

[Derfel Cadarn]

Does her parentage matter? Luke, Leia and Ben are pretty much unique in being descended from a Jedi.  Every other Jedi no matter how powerful is descended from regular people - we know this as Jedi were forbidden to have kids etc, so by default jedi are descended from ordinary janes and joes.  Why should Rey be different?

Maybe the Force led her to the resistance? Qui-gon believed it led him to Anakin.

Interesting how Obi-wan and Luke both think they're crappy teachers compared to Yoda.  They both had young apprentices go bad, but Yoda's apprentice (Dooku) went bad while an old adult  former Jedi master.

While rambling, I think Luke couldnt duel Kylo anyway.  We never (flashbacks aside) see his green lightsaber sugesting it either broke when Ben whacked him or he threw it away.

i did like his "See you around kid" to Kylo.  Hope he returns.