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Do you think Cersi can stop the propecy?

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On 5/13/2018 at 6:08 AM, Sand-Dragon said:

No, in fact I think that by trying to prevent it from happening she will make it happen. 

Self-fulfilling prophecy 101. She went right ahead and fulfilled Melara’s prophecy. 

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11 hours ago, Angel Eyes said:

Self-fulfilling prophecy 101. She went right ahead and fulfilled Melara’s prophecy. 

yes, and her hatred of Tyrion already caused Tyrion's hatred of her, which he didn't have in book one...and Jaime's paranoia also...Joffrey is already dead, Myrcella has been seriously maimed and Tommen, as sweet and young as he is, might not be off the hook yet...Gold shall be their shrouds.

I'd say a good part of the prophecy is already fulfilled.

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On 12/23/2017 at 12:58 PM, Endymion I Targaryen said:

I think that this prophecy will come true. The question is, Cersei's fate is sealed because of the prophecy or because of her actions to prevent the prophecy?

Cersei: When will I wed the prince?

Maggy: Never. You will wed the king.

For the first time a Lannister becomes Queen Consort so this is good. The fact that this wedding was a failure or that she was obsessed with Rhaegar was Cersei's and Robert's fault. 


Cersei: I will be queen, though?
Maggy: Aye. Queen you shall be... until there comes another, younger and more beautiful, to cast you down and take all that you hold dear.

Cersei believing that this queen is Margaery (it is irrelevant if she is) destroys the Lannister-Tyrell alliance, rearms th Faith and weakens Tommen's rule. She didn't want to share power or her sons attention so she tried to get rid of Margaery. Her choice 100%.

Cersei: Will the king and I have children?

Maggy: Oh, aye. Six-and-ten for him, and three for you. Gold shall be their crowns and gold their shrouds, she said. And when your tears have drowned you, the valonqar shall wrap his hands about your pale white throat and choke the life from you.

It was her choice to have children with her brother and not her husband and also her choice to treat Tyrion the way she did. The results of this will show off when Tyrion allies with Daenerys and share all his knowledge.So any of her actions to prevent the prophecy bring her one step closer to it coming true.

Eh? I would say that her marriage failure was her fault. It's like a Greek tragedy. A self fulfilling prophecy.

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On 5/13/2018 at 2:35 AM, Shmedricko said:

 That’s the way prophecies come true in unexpected ways. The more you try to avoid them, the more you are making them true, and I make a little fun with that.

http://www.adriasnews.com/2012/10/george-r-r-martin-interview.html

Thanks for the quote, but personally I'd find it deeply disappointing if prophecies were set in stone and always fated to come about in some particular way. Because it would cheapen everything and remove accountability from characters, if things were bound to happen the same way no matter what they did. Greek Tragedy was invented some thousands of years ago and it's simplicity is no longer satisfying. IMHO, it would be far more interesting and engaging if prophecies in SoIaF were mere strong probabilities, which could "come true" in a variety of different ways, or even be derailed entirely. Like, in GRRM's example - who is to say that the lord _wouldn't_ have died under the walls of the real castle, if he had gone there? Or that he wouldn't have survived the battle if he never got near that inn?

To be honest, Maggy's prophecy is particularly egregious, because it is so deterministic for so many important characters - like Rhaegar never becoming king, as he never would have had 13-16 bastards, like Robert surviving the Rebellion and gaining the crown, as he was the only one among the rebel leadership who would have, etc. So, I really hope that it doesn't come true in every particular, and that Cersei remains wholly responsible for the parts of it that she actively brought about. My wish is that Myrcella survives - that it turns out that the Darkstar's attempt was where she should have died according to Maggy, but it just didn't happen. And that Cersei learns about it shortly before she killed and realises as she is dying that what happened to her children wasn't an inevitability, but her own fault. 

 

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Well, I am pretty convinced Maggy’s prophecy will fully come true. But does this mean all of Cersei’s children have to die as kings or queens? Joffrey has, Tommen will. What about Myrcella? Some Dornish already tried to crown her; maybe there will be a second attempt. Or she simply becomes queen after Tommen’s death?

And what if her golden hair is all the crown she needs to fit into that prophecy?

The valonquar will be Jaime or Tyrion, or (as an outside bet) Arya using Jaime’s face - I think it will be Jaime after all, using his real hand together with the golden one.

However, before she dies someone will cast her down and take all she holds dear - another queen. Dany is the obvious choice, but by no means the only one - there are a lot of potential and former queens around:

Current queens:

Margaery - suspected by Cersei.

Dany - seems all too likely, doesn’t it?

Past queens:

Jeyne Westerling? Faded into obscurity after the Red Wedding, but she clearly has a reason to hate the Lannisters who killed her beloved.

Potential future queens:

Sansa - would have to become queen first. Littlefinger succeeding, and marrying her to himself? Queen in the North with her brothers believed dead?

(Arya - good at killing; just don’t see how she could become queen)

Asha - another Kingsmoot? Unlikely they’d elect a woman, see her first attempt. Does not seem to have a particular reason to go after Cersei.

(Selyse - Stannis’ queen; not sure if she is indeed younger than Cersei. Also not known to be a beauty.)

(Shireen - definitely not a beauty).

She will lose all she holds dear - her children? An implication that the younger queen will be involved in the death of Tommen and/or Myrcella? 

Perhaps even GRRM doesn’t know the resolution yet, which is why it takes him so damn long to finish the next book?

 

 

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