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Frey Kings

House Frey should be respected

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On 2017-12-23 at 8:17 PM, Bernie Mac said:

And Robb attacking and killing a neutral House is somehow not murder? Because he is a Stark?

Strawman, what does a fictional character's house name have to do with the definition of murder?

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It is precisely taking a side. They would be offering safe passage to an enemy of the Crown and once inside the much larger Stark army could easily take control of Twins. 

The neutral option is to do what they were doing, nothing. Not open their gates to rebels of the Crown. 

Letting an army pass is a passive action. (neutral)

Impeding the passage of an army, and taking up arms if necessary, to prevent said army from advancing through territory under the jurisdiction of the Frey's Liege Lord - who undoubtedly granted passage to Rob - is an aggressive action. (not neutral)

ETA: Besides, at this point, what has Rob done to make him an enemy of the Crown? He was summoned to Kings Landing to pledge his allegiance to the new King, why is Walder preventing him from doing this?

...that's right, because his reluctance to letting "rebels of the Crown" pass has nothing to do with his allegiance to the Crown, it's so that he can manipulate gains for himself out of whichever side, at the moment, can help him advance the standing of his own house. He is an opportunist who is playing the game, so you can stop with all the bs of him being neutral and not wanting to anger Tywin or the Crown. He had no problem rebelling himself, and sending men to fight against the Crown when there was something in it for him.

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Is that really the excuse you want to be using? Do you think many people who commit atrocities wanted to do them?

Who's making excuses? You asserted that Rob wanted to attack the Twins, clearly a false accusation, based off of ignoring the facts and the context of the quotes you are providing to back your claim.

Are you now back tracking, and implying that Rob didn't want to commit this atrocity that you've conjured up, and didn't happen in the books that I've read?

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Robb had other options, shit the only reason he left Moat Cailin, in his own words, was because the lands could not feed his army. The Twins was convenient for him, he wanted to destroy an entire House and the denizens that resided in there because he was impatient. Sorry dude, that is not a good enough reason. Like Walder Frey wanting to kill people out of revenge and self preservation, it is a poor excuse. 

Again, you seem to not comprehend the situation. These aren't a group of men on vacation, going on a leisurely stroll through the woods. This is an advancing army with strategic and vast logistical concerns. Being able to cross at the Twins could very well be the discerning factor between a victory or a loss.

To claim that Robb was being lazy, and had other options is just ignorance.

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It is not just Robb, all his generals are disapointed when they see it. Did you not actually read the quotes I supplied you? 

These are not the reactions of men who had no intention of attacking the Twins if it was a weaker castle or had a smaller garrison. Their disappointment speaks for itself, as does Cat's threat when inside the Twins

Another strawman. I've never said that they weren't willing or prepared to attack the Twins. Your argument was that Rob "wanted" to attack.

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Well Frey men had died for that agreement. Not one of Robb's battles was not won without Frey support on the battlefield and they supplied more men than any of his vassals gave him. Robb's war would have been over, all his glory came down to the agreement his mother made with the Freys, an agreement that was made in good faith. 

 

And if you really think like that then why should the Freys honour an agreement of guest rights when Robb has already betrayed them?

I don't really think that. It was a rhetorical question that seemed on par with the response you gave. You see how ridiculous attitudes and excuses like that are?

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Robb betrayed the Freys first. 

That's an argument of a child, not a defense for murder.

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I'm not. Where have I cried foul? I'm pointing out the hypocrisy talking about honour in wartime. 

You're on a Frey sympathizer thread that is demanding respect for the Freys, defending the Freys, and twisting the text in order to make false accusations against Rob and make the Freys look like some poor innocent victims. Close enough for me.

Only thing with your attempt to point out the hypocrisy of honor in war, is you're comparing Rob's action in war against his enemies, to the despicable actions of a man against his allies at a wedding, and under protection of guest's rights - which wether you want to acknowledge or not, is considered to be one of the most atrocious and vile crimes one can commit in the Seven Kingdoms.

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Nope, Robb knew exactly were he stood with Walder. He was forced to beg for help as there was no other way to take back the North without the Freys help.

Robb looked more amused than afraid. "I have an army to protect me, Mother, I don't need to trust in bread and salt

What Robb did not know is that half of his remaining army wanted to see him dead. It is not the Freys betrayal that took by surprise, it was his fellow Northmen. 

But in general it was just poor from him, allowing his soldiers to get drunk while the Crown had around 70k troops not too far away. Robb's best victories came when the enemy had no idea how close he was, frankly it is sloppy on Robb's part. Someone who uses surprise to such devastating effect against his enemies should have known better. My only head canon explanation I can think of is that the 5 or so months since Oxcross had made him complacent in fighting a real enemy. 

Honestly, I've no idea what your going on about here. This makes no sense, and has nothing to do with my comment or the discussion at hand.

Edited by Blackwater Revenant

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On 12/22/2017 at 4:06 PM, Frey Kings said:

Want to talk about whores? Freys aren't prostituting themselves or sending their men off to die in some war because someone got their feelings hurt. That only happened recently but only because people from all sides came knocking on their door. They weren;t the ones that knocks.

 

Also, most of the houses in Westeros are whores to the Iron Bank and to their IT/Lord. IB calling in their debts = houses go crazy and so much of their "honor" & "prestige" & legendary status goes out the window. lol

The Freys have always been cheap laggards. The Late lord Frey is his moniker for a reason.  Lord Frey did not demand marriage to use hte crossing out of loyalty. He did it to become royalty. the price is right = whoredom  

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6 hours ago, Casca Longinus said:

The negative criticisms of the Freys came from Hoster Tully and you know that is because Walder arrived late in battle.  We don't know the reason for Walder's lateness.  He could have had a good reason.  What we know is this.  Walder was on time for Robb.  The Freys fought bravely for Robb.  They didn't give any bullshit excuses they just did what they agreed to do. 

We have no idea what circumstances led to Walder arriving late after the battle of trident.  The Tullys just assumed he did it on purpose.  And Robb was not a king but only a rebel who was hoping to become king.  Walder is touchy but so are the Starks.  Would you say Tywin is touchy too?  I think so.  Stannis?  Yes.  All of the nobles are touchy about their honor.  All of them are easy to insult.  That's not a trait exclusive to the Freys.

:agree:

All highborn are prickly.  They put family first.  Any one of them would ignore guest rights to avoid losing their lives and their lands.  The R/W was driven by fear, fear of the Lannisters.  Robb was an oath breaker and a fuck up.  Walder and Roose needed an exit strategy that would avoid punishment.  They had to do the R/W.  Walder and family could lose their magnificent bridge.  Roose would certainly lose his head for letting Jaime go.  Robb had to die in order for these men to protect themselves.

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4 hours ago, Sigella said:

No, because Robert only fathered bastards, which might not be the kindest to the children - but 250 heirs certainly isnt good for any House let alone a small on with only one seat.

Walder keeps a constant string of too young wives because he likes shagging them and he could give two phracks what becomes of them or their offspring. He supports them for now but leaves them to fend for themselves in case he or his oldest dies, none of which is "respectable" behaviour. It is dubious that all his wives dies prematurely, not respectable. 

Imagine being a cut off Frey out in the world on their own... They'd wish they were Baratheon bastards with good looks and physical talents.

Do you think Robert would remarry again for the fifth time if he had, say, 12 legal kids? (should be more if his wives weren't all as uncooperative as Cersei) No, even if he wanted to his council would dissuade him. Because its irresponsible.

I read it like you are arguing that there are two characters that you think might have turned as bad as Walder and therefore he is exempt of responsibility? 

Walder is way more like Aegon Unworthy than Robert tbh. House Frey needs some Blackfyre-pretenders and self-regulate.

Hi there.  I could say the same of the north.  They have more babies than they can support in winter.  At least they self-regulate and the old go to die out in the snows.  Human sacrifice to their old gods take care of the rest.

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7 hours ago, Adam Yozza said:

Yeah, for the most part we're meant to decide for ourselves what's right and what's wrong. However you'd have to be incredibly naive to believe that this is the case in all circumstances.  Are you going to defend Ramsay next? Claim his actions were his only option? How about Euron or Lorch or Hoat or Gregor? There are clearly some characters we are absolutely meant to view as the 'bad guys'.  Some of them have depth. Some of them can even be empathized with. But that doesn't mean we should defend their actions.

Viewing them as bad guys doesn't mean every action they do has no real good reason behind it by default that doesn't mean everything bad we hear other supposedly "good" characters say about them make them really that much  worse than they are or the horrificness of one action being as great as being as great as people are pretending.

We are meant to decide for ourselves who is good or who is bad. Some characters actions would make the most if not all sensible people view them as bad but Martin has repeatedly made clear just exactly who is entirely up to the reader.

 

The Red Wedding was not Walder's only option. He could have denied Robb when he tried to make amends And made everything he poured into Robb's war campaign be for naught and have him placed as an enemy to be quashed by the Northmen and south? He could have just barred his gates and trapped Robb on the wrong side of the Green Fork for Roose and Tarly and Clegane to deal with.  That alone would have been enough and wouldn't have relied on treachery. 

Needless risks and odds of getting Robb there would would be unlikely  and at the end of the day the Freys would have gained nothing really substantive for all their loses accumulated in the war

 

They wouldn't have to deal with Tywin's fury even if they'd remained loyal. We've been shown that. Tywin does nothing to the house's that bend the knee after the Red Wedding beyond a few hostages.

Readers' hindsight can be a beautiful thing; you see knowing the aftermath of an action makes it so that you can call a character in story wrong for doing or thinking something they couldn't have known would be wrong having not read the book. Tywin has had up to this point a reputation of massive over kill in enacting punishment.He literally exterminated two houses who rose up against the Lanisters, burnt the Riverlands because Catelyn arrested  Tyrion. There's very good reason why the Freys would think when it's in his power, he's going to make them who are the reason his favorite son was captured are going to be face sever reprisal

The Blackwoods and Tully's are the only ones that have land taken from them.

I'm not making this into a black and white scenario just because the Stark's are on one side. If the Starks had done this to the Baratheons when Robert visited Winterfell I'd be condeming them just as much.

And you'd be making a false equivalence. The Baratheons(well Robert and Cersi because the children are bastards), up to  this point have not wronged the Starks, hadn't got them to spill blood and refused to give payment and didn't stand to lose that much more if having not done it because they're being pressed on all sides by enemy forces.

Robb messed up. He made a mistake; a big one; but that's all it was, a mistake. The Frey's had every right to be angry, I'm not denying that. But Robb did try to make amends. He deliberately broke the deal they agreed to for aiding him, they're position is now jepordized, over a thousand of their men and their kin died for Robb to be king because of the oath he made to them. It wasn't just a mistake

They could have refused. That would have trapped him in the south, with the Ironborn raiding his home and the Lannister-Tyrell alliance closing in. Most people would consider that revenge enough.

Some would. A small some. But most would  want their revenge first hand. And there's always the possibility of  Robb trying to make peace and surrendering which would spare his life. We (the readers)know he wouldn't but to the Freys who want to right the slights they felt that remains a distinct possibility.

And you can cite Stevron and the other dead Frey's; there weren't that many; as much as you like but in reality Walder doesn't give a real shit about his kids. If one dies then it's just one less to support.

Its still a massive insult on him and his house from Robb. He  said they're(the Freys) aren't  going  to get the payment they agreed to participate in his war even though they've sacrificed a plenty. It's not about finial affection it's the  goddamn pride of a noble house who is being denied its respect which is pretty much everything. 

We could keep going with this, but I don't really see the point. You're obviously not gonna move and this is one issue I know I'm never going to change my mind on. So I'm done with this argument. But I'll leave you with this; with everything that's happening to the Frey's ever since the RW; all the hangins, the deaths, the Frey Pies, the settup for Red Wedding 2.0; the way they are universally despised in universe now and the way they're presented to us; by the author, who has the final word on any matter pertaining to his world; do you really, honestly think they in any way should be respected for their actions from Storm onwards?

Truth be told? I stand by my previous statement of most of the nobles participating in the war being self-centered, entitled assholes shown to be not having acted not much better than the Freys during the war. Robb's bannerman would let Sansa and Arya be beaten,raped and murdered rather than trade Jamie even though as a hostage he's worth very virtually nothing given he's in the Kingsguard which places him outside the line of succession, and Tywin has another full grown heir to take up his place because of good old  misogony.

They more than willing to destroy the Freys when they have done nothing to do them if it was convient.Robb Stark was more than willing to hire on the BC and ironborn to rape and pillage his enemies just like Tywin hired on Gregore to rape and pillage his enemies and neither really cared about the little people who suffered in their spats. And he would push this war that has already took so many people's lives not because he thinks that's the best thing for the people under his rule but to avenge Ned as if there aren't thousands of peasants who've lost so much more and would lose so much war because of it.The Freys broke social-decorum which is why they're getting so much flack It's ok to murder people so long as you add on the qualifier of it being war, conquest in it of itself could be a noble thing, who cares about how many of the little people suffer for the big people's ego but dont you dare kill people at a wedding! Guest right is important to nobility not because of the gods(which are useless), but because  it helps when hammering out negotiations, or fulfilling agreements(I.e marriage), you know that the societal repercussions for those who hurt you would be big. The Freys violated the compact nobles have with eachother; treat us like humans not like the peasants thus they are hated. You know when Jaimie threatens to torture Edmure if Edmure didn't say where the hell is the Black fish, Edmure's reaction really highlights what I'm talking about. Edmure's offended at Jaimie for threatening to torture someone of his stature, torturing POWs is acceptable but not those of proper birth.

Walder Frey is scum, his family and house has been set up almost deliberately to be politically unstable while he's alive and the amount of infighting after he dies would likely be disasterous for his house but he's no more a villain or hero in this  war than really any of the other nobles who are pushing this quite frankly pointless war for ego and vegence. 

None really deserve respect for what they did in the war or pushing this damn war.Except for Edmure.

Not Robb, not Tywin, or Walder. They're all fixated on wrongs done on them, no matter the cost for everyone else.

 

Edited by Varysblackfyre321

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31 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

 

It took me a while to figure out the quote system on this form. This my present to you whether you want it or not.

A person types something. I'm gonna use @Dorian Martell's son as an example. Let's say I only want to talk about one thing he said. What I do is click and highlight the words and then a little quote this box comes up.. Click it and the quote appears.

3 hours ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

He did it to become royalty. the price is right = whoredom  

Now, how about you give it a try using my text to see if it works.

Edited by Clegane'sPup
if you want the red highlight to appear type @ with no spaces the name and you will be given a list to pick from.

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2 hours ago, Clegane'sPup said:

It took me a while to figure out the quote system on this form. This my present to you whether you want it or not.

A person types something. I'm gonna use @Dorian Martell's son as an example. Let's say I only want to talk about one thing he said. What I do is click and highlight the words and then a little quote this box comes up.. Click it and the quote appears.

Now, how about you give it a try using my text to see if it works.

Thank you for trying to be helpful. Really nice of you.

Edited by Varysblackfyre321

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Okay, I tried to read every single post, but I had to stop halfway through. Everyone defending the Freys, you are really not understanding one piece of information : how important guest right is in Westorosi society. From what I read, guest right is kind of like....not eating people, or not raping children is in our culture. You just don't break it, no matter what. Essentially, Walder Frey breaking guest rights would be like if the British soldiers started killing and then eating American soldiers during WWII. Just like the Westorosi feel about the Freys, the world would be appalled. I don't how people are not understanding this. GRRM is very clear on how important this thing is to their society. It's like you guys are reading a different series or something with different rules. When you read a book, you have to accept the terms the author rights in. Killing people in battle or in a siege is acceptable behavior in Westeros. Betraying your enemy and breaking perhaps one of their most important taboos, is not. If a man chooses to break the taboo of his society, he is not honerable. If you met someone who killed and ate a bunch of Germans, trust me, you wouldn't be patting him on the back. You would think he was a monster and a war criminal. 

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On 12/24/2017 at 8:10 AM, Blackwater Revenant said:

I see, so this past Remembrance day, when I payed tribute to all the brave men and women who gave their lives for my freedom, I was actually honouring a bunch of murderers.

And if they were neutral, they wouldn't have impeded Rob's progress.

Then Walder should have broken the alliance, and declared war on the North instead of feigning to accept the reparations Rob attempted, in order to murder him in cold blood.

Exactly. 

On 12/24/2017 at 10:56 AM, Blackwater Revenant said:

That is ridiculous, I'm glad I didn't make a comment as to that. You can argue the immorality of Rob's imagined decision to attack the Twins all you want, it still wouldn't make it murder.

So? What's your point? I'm not debating this matter with Walder Frey, I'm having a debate with members of a forum who have presumably read the books, and do know the truth.

No, denying him passage that normally he'd be granted is aiding Rob's enemies, that's not staying neutral.

If you want to argue that the Freys deserve respect, and don't deserve the vitriol that they receive, yes.

If they would have let Rob pass, and actually stayed neutral, they would have been left alone. Only, Walder saw this as an opportunity to coerce Rob into marrying his daughter to improve the standing of his house. 

And they didn't cheat, they committed a violation of the most sacred customs in the Kingdom, which is looked down upon by men and gods alike as the severest of crimes. That is a fact, not a quibble or a childish gripe.

Again, exactly, especially the last paragraph. It's like the Frey supporters didn't even read the books. GRRM drove this point home repeatedly. 

On 12/24/2017 at 0:11 PM, Bowen 747 said:

Oaths are legally binding. Robb not only violated honor but he broke something legally binding.  The Freys broke guest rights, which is just a custom.  The king sanctioned the red wedding; therefore, it cannot be illegal.  It was a desperate measure to end the lives of some rebels.

It's not just a custom. That is like saying not eating dead people is just a custom. Even if Trump pardens them, I still think they are disgusting horrible people. Breaking a marriage contract is also something a King can pardon. Oh wait, ROBB IS LITERALLY THE KING. Murder and breaking marriage contracts are both illegal. However the fact you put more stock in the marriage contracts seems a little frightening. 

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2 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

Okay, I tried to read every single post, but I had to stop halfway through. Everyone defending the Freys, you are really not understanding one piece of information : how important guest right is in Westorosi society.

Um no people get how important guest right is perceived. It's just that some concede the the fact the Freys hadn't much alternative to violating it.

 

2 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

From what I read, guest right is kind of like....not eating people, or not raping children is in our culture. You just don't break it, no matter what.

The reason why it's important rather than being some divine mandate or ultimately ethical qualm  is because it's simply practical. You need to parley and conduct business when you're in the hand of a enemy/potential enemy/ potential allies hand. You don't break it because it'd possibly dissuade others from meeting you if they have to go to your home to do it. 

 

2 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

Walder Frey breaking guest rights would be like if the British soldiers started killing and then eating American soldiers during WWII.

Meh, the shock and revulsion would be the shame true, but the latter is far more worse the former considering there's no valid reason for British soldiers to eat Americans, while still horrendous the RW was motivated for "practical reasons" and the same reason Robb had been so willing to drag out the war he had lost; revenge.

 

2 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

don't how people are not understanding this. GRRM is very clear on how important this thing is to their

I don't know why you've concocted this view of in your head on many people in this thread saying guest right isn't  seen as an important thing in westeros. No one said that. At most I and others have pointed out its not simply important because the gods will come down and smith you for your sacrilege for their fury is great and they can't abide such a crime and blah blah blah but simply doing violates the clear social decorum noble houses rely on to keep them safe when having to put themselves right in someone's hands and power

2 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

When you read a book, you have to accept the terms the author rights in. Killing people in battle or in a siege is acceptable behavior in Westeros

So? Lots of things are socially acceptable in westeros that go many reader's modern sensibilities. Doesn't mean we have to show the same level of disgust towards Briene attempt at being a knight because the role the society has placed on her for her gender or see the level of outrage over it being somehow just.

 

2 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

If a man chooses to break the taboo of his society, he is not honerable. I

So Loras isn't honorable because he participated and will likely again participate in homosexual acts? The taboos in a feudal society aren't simply on the level of people being killed in a bad way. And the things that are deemed socially acceptable can involve getting loads of people killed in conquering a land because conquest is noble, torture(of none-highborns of course), treating bastards like disease because they're bastards and whole list of things that we in our modern society would buckle at. 

 

2 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

If you met someone who killed and ate a bunch of Germans, trust me, you wouldn't be patting him on the back. You would think he was a monster and a war criminal. 

K

Look the points  a lot of people were making is that Walder Frey had valid reasons for starting the red wedding, doesn't make it not sad and despicable thing but yeah and in terms of awful conduct during the war the Freys aren't that much worse than most everyone else whose waging they're all highborn entitled self-centered assholes, more than willing to step on or throw the smallfolk under the bus for strategic advantage to fight a war primarily being waged for just ego and revenge. 

Edited by Varysblackfyre321

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3 hours ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

Um no people get how important guest right is perceived. It's just that some concede the the fact the Freys hadn't much alternative to violating it.

Which, too, is BS. They had all alternatives in the world.

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15 hours ago, Only 89 selfies today said:

Hi there.  I could say the same of the north.  They have more babies than they can support in winter.  At least they self-regulate and the old go to die out in the snows.  Human sacrifice to their old gods take care of the rest.

I still haven't read one good reason for respecting them. The best the pro-Frey-camp has come up with is that the Starks are just as bad (probably worse) and it isn't convincing. Throwing shade doesn't change the topic at hand.

Old Walder was written repulsive right from childhood, if thats your thing its fine, but don't try to make that old creep and his ugly, lying brood out to be something actually worth respecting.

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On 12/24/2017 at 9:42 PM, Shouldve Taken The Black said:

We see the general revulsion felt towards the Freys, as reported by Qyburn, in their reception in the North, and Davos's instinctive reaction when he hears about it. 

...and in the Vale, too:
"Put up your steel, ser! Are you a Corbray or a Frey?"

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16 hours ago, Only 89 selfies today said:

:agree:

All highborn are prickly.  They put family first.  Any one of them would ignore guest rights to avoid losing their lives and their lands.  The R/W was driven by fear, fear of the Lannisters.  Robb was an oath breaker and a fuck up.  Walder and Roose needed an exit strategy that would avoid punishment.  They had to do the R/W.  Walder and family could lose their magnificent bridge.  Roose would certainly lose his head for letting Jaime go.  Robb had to die in order for these men to protect themselves.

Walder and especially Roose were sabotaging Robb way before the RW. Roose needed the RW even more than Tywin did.

When Ramsay sacked and burned Winterfell and killed the people there he spared the two Freys. What does this mean?

Roose releasing Jaime was part of that betrayal. He did it in excange for something else, not because he liked Jaime very much. 

 

Edited by The Sunland Lord

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20 hours ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

The Freys have always been cheap laggards.

IIRC, only Walder's generation is known for being slow (although his father was also connected to the Second Blackfyre Rebellion). While the Tullys were neutral at the start of the Dance, Lord Forrest Frey enthusiastically supported Rhaenyra and died in her cause. 

20 hours ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

Lord Frey did not demand marriage to use hte crossing out of loyalty. He did it to become royalty. the price is right = whoredom  

Remember, Ned was still alive at when the alliance was negotiated, so Walder's daughter would have been marrying the heir to Winterfell. Robb was proclaimed King in the North later at Riverrun. 

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The Frey family are respected.  People pay at the gate to cross their bridge and they always do.  The Freys always get their payment. 

The only people to openly speak ill of the Freys are the ones above them in the social hierarchy, the Tullys.  If I recall, not even Hoster Tully openly criticized the Freys.  He did it with soft insults such as refusing to attend Walder's wedding. 

That other medium did not represent the Freys accurately.  The House of Frey is not only respected but feared. 

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On 12/22/2017 at 10:12 PM, Agent Orange said:

They have power and that is enough.  All the backroom bitching from the envious is nothing to take seriously.  Now if they can just hunt down and destroy the Brotherhood all will be well.

I want to add to my above comment.  People fear the Freys.  A more apt question is "why are the Freys unpopular?"

To which the answer is apparent.  It has to do with their family business.  They collect toll on every person who needs to cross their bridge.  Can you see how that will piss people off?  It's great entrepreneurship and you too would collect a fee if you were in their position.   Their ancestors were clever enough to see the potential income from their strategic location and invested in the construction of a bridge.  Not an easy feat and expensive.  Many Freys probably lost their shirts during the construction but it has been paying off ever since.  

Edited by Agent Orange

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48 minutes ago, Aline de Gavrillac said:

The Frey family are respected.  People pay at the gate to cross their bridge and they always do.  The Freys always get their payment. 

The only people to openly speak ill of the Freys are the ones above them in the social hierarchy, the Tullys.  If I recall, not even Hoster Tully openly criticized the Freys.  He did it with soft insults such as refusing to attend Walder's wedding. 

That other medium did not represent the Freys accurately.  The House of Frey is not only respected but feared. 

They're feared in the Riverlands at the moment because they theoretically have the backing of the Lannisters and hold a bunch of prisoners. They were not feared. We have no evidence of this. And Hoster Tully was not the only one to speak badly of the Frey's, either before or after the RW.

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Do people fear the Manderlys?  Not really.  Do people insult Lord too fat to sit a horse?  Yes.  Seems to me, both Walder and Wyman are underestimated because they lack martial prowess.  

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They should be respected. New richs also deserve respect. That was in part one of the reason Frey went again the Starks (Robb's incursion in the Crag was considered badly by the Freys).

Apart from that, Walder Frey is one of the most clever characters, IMO. I mean read the chapters in which he stars in. He even make ol' Cat look bad. 

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