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Curled Finger

Brienne's Honor in Pennytree

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19 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

You know, I really didn't care for Harry Lloyd's narration of the Dunc & Egg novellas.  OTH I LOVED Iain Glen's TPATQ.  But, I still compare everyone to Dotrice and they all fall flat.   What has Anton Lesser read?   I will check him out post haste.  

My reread begins 1/1/18.  I will try listening and reading together to see what I pick up.  That's like ringing in the New Year with an old friend.  

Iain Glenn reading TPatQ, dear me, how did I miss that? I'm sure he does a fenomenal job, and I will get that [and listen to it repeatedly] ASAP!

Anton Lesser is an actor I adore. Sadly, the show mis/underused completely. Much like w/ Dillane, MvS, Siddig and many others... I'm not sure these are all the books he's ever read, but it's a good list: https://www.naxosaudiobooks.com/lesser-anton/

I have listened to Great Expectarions and Pygmalion, and I loved both. 

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7 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Iain Glenn reading TPatQ, dear me, how did I miss that? I'm sure he does a fenomenal job, and I will get that [and listen to it repeatedly] ASAP!

Anton Lesser is an actor I adore. Sadly, the show mis/underused completely. Much like w/ Dillane, MvS, Siddig and many others... I'm not sure these are all the books he's ever read, but it's a good list: https://www.naxosaudiobooks.com/lesser-anton/

I have listened to Great Expectarions and Pygmalion, and I loved both. 

Take it with a grain of salt.   I sit at a desk and talk to people all day for a living.   Voices are a big deal to me.  Charles Dance has a great voice, but who knows if he can read?  If you ever watch any of the histories and lore animated shorts, most the the GOT actors do a really good job with their little stories.  But that's maybe 10 pages compared to thousands.  I will follow your link and get some listening in.   Thanks for the tip!  

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1 hour ago, Curled Finger said:

Welcome to the discussion, Ser.   I'm with you to a certain extent.   LSH has a plan.  A live Jamie Lannister is crucial.   If the gossip is true, she's right there by the Twins when Brienne finds Jamie.   I don't know about intelligence--Beric seemed to just cling to the vows he made, which ended up being valiant and productive whereas LSH does appear to be hellbent on revenge.    It's written to make us underestimate this wraith.  So what is a live Jamie Lannister good for?  Right now he's Mr. Man in the Riverlands, ending sieges, taking hostages, dividing land and calling the shots.  I think he could gain access to the Twins, but I'm sure there are other situations this guy could be very useful in.   

Lady Stone Heart has hung 2 knights and a little boy.  She's pretty terrible.  But I'm sure there is a plan in this.   Do you have an idea about what Jamie could be useful to her for? 

I am completly convinced that she wants to put Jaime on trial for his crimes. However when he is found guilty (and he is indeed guilty of several crimes) Brienne will intervene and convince him to take the black. THAT will be a defining moment for LSH because ned was also going to take the black and a lannister decided to kill him anyway. Afterwards the BwB will go north and try to get to the Wall (depending on the timeline maybe they are already pretty close?)...

It would be completly idiotic for LSH to make plans to use Jaime to rescue hostages or infiltrate the freys because the last time cat/LSH did that it went terribly wrong! It doesn t make sense to make such mistakes again. 

In addition she probably thinks arya is in winterfell and for the readers it would be interesting to have a meeting between LSH and jon snow (the 2 starks that don t want to meet each other) and Jaime is one of the best povs for us to understand the actual fighting strenght of the watch and the wildlings.

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4 minutes ago, divica said:

I am completly convinced that she wants to put Jaime on trial for his crimes. However when he is found guilty (and he is indeed guilty of several crimes) Brienne will intervene and convince him to take the black. THAT will be a defining moment for LSH because ned was also going to take the black and a lannister decided to kill him anyway. Afterwards the BwB will go north and try to get to the Wall (depending on the timeline maybe they are already pretty close?)...

It would be completly idiotic for LSH to make plans to use Jaime to rescue hostages or infiltrate the freys because the last time cat/LSH did that it went terribly wrong! It doesn t make sense to make such mistakes again. 

In addition she probably thinks arya is in winterfell and for the readers it would be interesting to have a meeting between LSH and jon snow (the 2 starks that don t want to meet each other) and Jaime is one of the best povs for us to understand the actual fighting strenght of the watch and the wildlings.

Thanks for getting us back on track, divica!  Beric was easy to determine and get behind and support.   LSH not so much.   All I've seen her do is extreme acts of vengeance.  Until Brienne is captured.   At that point we see a deeper level of strategy from LSH.   She's manipulating Brienne to get Jamie.  What does this mean for Brienne?   Tests.   Lots of tests for our most honorable knight.   

You've obviously got an idea about LSH's motivations.  I agree completely with your assessment of having Jamie's POV at the Wall.  The group is said to be making their way north and it's entirely plausible they've heard Arya is in Winterfell.   Where does Brienne fit into this? Just a means to an end?  

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11 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

Take it with a grain of salt.   I sit at a desk and talk to people all day for a living.   Voices are a big deal to me. 

Wow that's like the opposite of what I do... I can go through a whole day's work w/o saying a single word to another human being. I kinda envy you! And agreed, voices are a big deal. That's why I am so keen - now that you've learned me - on trying TOatQ w/ Glenn. He has an amazing voice, but very importantly, like Roy he is also a great actor w/ beautiful range. I honestly can't wait and I am 100% sure I will love it despite all the insufferably similar Targ names!

11 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

Charles Dance has a great voice, but who knows if he can read? 

Absolutely, I would definitely give any most audiobooks a go if Dance is the narrator. 

 

11 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

If you ever watch any of the histories and lore animated shorts, most the the GOT actors do a really good job with their little stories.  But that's maybe 10 pages compared to thousands.  I will follow your link and get some listening in.   Thanks for the tip!  

Nope, I stopped giving any of my hard earned money to the abomination at some point in 2012 or so - series 2 was on. :D

 

6 minutes ago, divica said:

I am completly convinced that she wants to put Jaime on trial for his crimes. However when he is found guilty (and he is indeed guilty of several crimes) Brienne will intervene and convince him to take the black. THAT will be a defining moment for LSH because ned was also going to take the black and a lannister decided to kill him anyway.

This is an interesting idea, but is it really a Lannister who is responsible for Ned's death?

6 minutes ago, divica said:

Afterwards the BwB will go north and try to get to the Wall (depending on the timeline maybe they are already pretty close?)...

I don't think that would be possible, unless a lot of times passes. Like, many months and I don't think that's gonna happen.

Ooops accidentally deleted a paragraph here, will address it at the end.

6 minutes ago, divica said:

In addition she probably thinks arya is in winterfell and for the readers it would be interesting to have a meeting between LSH and jon snow (the 2 starks that don t want to meet each other) and Jaime is one of the best povs for us to understand the actual fighting strenght of the watch and the wildlings.

I don't think so, I think LSH and the BwB know Arya is really fArya... 

I think a meeting w/ LSH and Jon has huge potential, fingers crossed it happens! 

As to the bold... Jaime IS the best PoV - full stop! :D

 

 

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24 minutes ago, divica said:

It would be completly idiotic for LSH to make plans to use Jaime to rescue hostages or infiltrate the freys because the last time cat/LSH did that it went terribly wrong! It doesn t make sense to make such mistakes again. 

The paragraph I accidentally deleted... 

I think LSH will go to RR for the wedding, not North...

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9 hours ago, kissdbyfire said:

There are so many variables... but of one thing I'm dead certain: Brienne will not betray Jaime, nor will she kill him. And if it comes to that, if she brings Jaime to LSH and is ordered to kill him, she won't do it. And no, I don't think her vows to Catelyn will matter at all. Firstly because when Brienne and Catelyn exchanged vows, Catelyn swore she'd never ask Brienne to dishonour herself, and to trap Jaime and kill him, would be dishonourable given the circumstances. Secondly, because Brienne made her vows to Catelyn, and LSH is not Catelyn.

“And I vow that you shall always have a place by my hearth and meat and mead at my table, and pledge to ask no service of you that might bring you into dishonor. I swear it by the old gods and the new. Arise.” As she clasped the other woman’s hands between her own, Catelyn could not help but smile. How many times did I watch Ned accept a man’s oath of service? She wondered what he would think if he could see her now”

I also think Jaime may end up leading the BwB... :wideeyed:

 

Ha! That's my loony theory too. 

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1 hour ago, Curled Finger said:

Hey Springwatch, that's a good reminder about Jamie.   I think that's an interpretive thing, too.   Jamie is conflicted about all vows, but he swears this one and he means to keep it. You could be right about Brienne's state of mind as well.   Thanks for bringing it up. 


Another quote for the OP:

 

Quote

[Edmure, on the release of Jaime] "You had no right.... He was Robb's captive, your king's captive, and Robb charged me to keep him safe."

[Cat] "Brienne will keep him safe. She swore it on her sword."

ASOS

 

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16 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

Thanks for getting us back on track, divica!  Beric was easy to determine and get behind and support.   LSH not so much.   All I've seen her do is extreme acts of vengeance.  Until Brienne is captured.   At that point we see a deeper level of strategy from LSH.   She's manipulating Brienne to get Jamie.  What does this mean for Brienne?   Tests.   Lots of tests for our most honorable knight.   

You've obviously got an idea about LSH's motivations.  I agree completely with your assessment of having Jamie's POV at the Wall.  The group is said to be making their way north and it's entirely plausible they've heard Arya is in Winterfell.   Where does Brienne fit into this? Just a means to an end?  

I think Brienne's case is more complicated. I think this situation with Jaime could be a test of brienne's loalty to her oath to cat. Assuming she passes we could have Brienne resuming her search for the stark girls (either going to winterfell or somewhere else (maybe the BwB heard rumours about LF bastard daughter and cat ends up sending Brienne to the vale) or LSH might decide to spare her life but make her take the black with Jaime as punishment for failing to find sansa and arya and helping Jaime at the trial (she is after all mildly mad and very angry).

I think it will depend on where grrm wants to take the story. In the show brienne found sansa and wanted to "save" her from LF... So maybe we will get something similar but in the vale? Maybe brienne becomes one of the winged knights from LF tourney due to some scheme from royce?

Edited by divica

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10 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Wow that's like the opposite of what I do... I can go through a whole day's work w/o saying a single word to another human being. I kinda envy you! And agreed, voices are a big deal. That's why I am so keen - now that you've learned me - on trying TOatQ w/ Glenn. He has an amazing voice, but very importantly, like Roy he is also a great actor w/ beautiful range. I honestly can't wait and I am 100% sure I will love it despite all the insufferably similar Targ names!

Absolutely, I would definitely give any most audiobooks a go if Dance is the narrator. 

 

Nope, I stopped giving any of my hard earned money to the abomination at some point in 2012 or so - series 2 was on. :D

 

This is an interesting idea, but is it really a Lannister who is responsible for Ned's death?

I don't think that would be possible, unless a lot of times passes. Like, many months and I don't think that's gonna happen.

Ooops accidentally deleted a paragraph here, will address it at the end.

I don't think so, I think LSH and the BwB know Arya is really fArya... 

I think a meeting w/ LSH and Jon has huge potential, fingers crossed it happens! 

As to the bold... Jaime IS the best PoV - full stop! :D

 

 

I envy your job.   You wouldn't believe what I imagine people to look like.   Most have these giant bodies and tiny little heads.  Glen just has a lovely voice.   I listened to it over and over for a week just because he lulled me.  He can tell a story, but he doesn't have 1001 voices.  Just a nice nice listen.   You can hear every single 1 of the histories and lore on YouTube for free!  I spent too much $ on these damned books in 3 mediums to be able to afford DVDs.  

Jamie doesn't register that Jeyne isn't Arya (Please God, don't let that be a show thing again) -- why wouldn't LSH or anyone else assume it really is Arya at Winterfell? 

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@divica, Brienne will at some point - if she hasn't already, which I find more likely - realise that Cat is dead and the vow she made to Cat is just as dead. LSH is not Cat. She's like bizarro-Cat - where Cat wanted an end to the violence, all LSH wants is revenge and blood. And not just that, but she made a vow to Jaime as well. Jaime who is still himself, and the man she loves to boot. 

Here's an interesting bit...

ASoS Jaime IX 

Brienne's homely face twisted in fury. "If you believe that I would harm my lady's daughter for a sword, you—"

"Just listen," he snapped, angered by her assumption. "I want you to find Sansa first, and get her somewhere safe. How else are the two of us going to make good our stupid vows to your precious dead Lady Catelyn?" 

The wench blinked. "I . . . I thought . . ."

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5 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

Jamie doesn't register that Jeyne isn't Arya (Please God, don't let that be a show thing again) -- why wouldn't LSH or anyone else assume it really is Arya at Winterfell? 

He does! He tells Brienne it's a fake... lemme find it...

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10 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

This is an interesting idea, but is it really a Lannister who is responsible for Ned's death

As far as cat know joffrei killed ned. 

10 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

I don't think that would be possible, unless a lot of times passes. Like, many months and I don't think that's gonna happen.

Well, there are a lot of people that think harwin is the hooded man and we don t know how the events in AFfC alligns themselves with ADwD. I think that within 2 months the BwB can go from the neck to the Wall. If by jon's last chapter they have traveled half the distance or more I don t think it is impossible. It all comes down to the timeline.

10 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

I don't think so, I think LSH and the BwB know Arya is really fArya... 

Can they know it? They would need word from someone in winterfell that has seen fArya to know. I don t think it is possible.

16 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

The paragraph I accidentally deleted... 

I think LSH will go to RR for the wedding, not North...

That might have been the original plan. But walking around the riverlands with Jaime is a huge danger. The sooner they either kill or get rid of him the better.

And I simply can t imagine LSH wanting to use Jaime in some clever plot. She wants revenge/justice(?). She has already released Jaime once and things went very wrong. She can t force Jaime to act the way she wants (for her Jaime has to be some kind of monster, there is no way she thinks she can manipulate him by threatning brienne and once again things could go very wrong).

At most I can see LSH sending a few members of the BwB to somehow poison people at the wedding. 

And the last we know Jaime is missing, so it would be very weird for him to desapear for a while and come back at a frey wedding uninvited.

 

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@Springwatch--another great quote.   Keep this up you will have to add your name to the OP author line!  

I had a thought here.   Brienne swore it on her sword.   What does it mean that Brienne no longer carries that sword?   I mean she could be.   She carries 2 swords.  But I'm not sure now. What does it mean if she's no longer carrying that sword?  Is there a code to that? 

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27 minutes ago, divica said:

I think Brienne's case is more complicated. I think this situation with Jaime could be a test of brienne's loalty to her oath to cat. Assuming she passes we could have Brienne resuming her search for the stark girls (either going to winterfell or somewhere else (maybe the BwB heard rumours about LF bastard daughter and cat ends up sending Brienne to the vale) or LSH might decide to spare her life but make her take the black with Jaime as punishment for failing to find sansa and arya and helping Jaime at the trial (she is after all mildly mad and very angry).

I think it will depend on where grrm wants to take the story. In the show brienne found sansa and wanted to "save" her from LF... So maybe we will get something similar but in the vale? Maybe brienne becomes one of the winged knights from LF tourney due to some scheme from royce?

Yah lots of directions GRRM can go with this.  Of course, poor Brienne has sworn oaths to Renly Baratheon, Catelyn Stark and Jamie Lannister and could be pulled in any direction.   I just hope she doesn't get sworn to anyone or thing else.  

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2 hours ago, Curled Finger said:

Let's step it up a notch, LynnS.  Do you have any idea what LSH wants Jamie Lannister for? 

I'm not sure that LSH can be reasoned with.  Catelyn's last act in life was to cut some innocent's throat or am I confusing the show?  She seems more of a grim reaper executioner type.  If Lem as the Hound is brutalizing innocents under her aegis; she's more demonic than anything.  It might be up to Brienne to put an end to her and the fHound.   But then what possessed Beric to bring her back to life?  How does he have the power to do that in the first place?

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The Brienne/Jaime story has always been one of the hardest for me to figure out.   I am reasonably certain that she is lying to Jaime in that I don't think she is taking him to either Sandor or either Stark girl.  But I have no idea what is next.  I am surprised at Jaime's disappearance.  It appears as if he has been for some weeks.  I would have expected him to reappear - either dead or alive.  In fact, the only reason I'm not convinced he's dead is that his body has not appeared.

If either Jaime or Brienne dies,, I would expect it to be Jaime.  I think his story might have come to its end.  I do not for a second believe that he will lead the BwB.  They are too different in methods and objectives. Nor do I think he will take the black.  I honestly doubt how much he even values his own life any more.  He might just say, "Go on and kill me and get it over with".

By the way, Jaime knows that Jeyne isn't Arya and tells Brienne as much when he gives her the sword. 

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37 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

I envy your job.   You wouldn't believe what I imagine people to look like.   Most have these giant bodies and tiny little heads. 

I also work mostly alone and don't interact with people much until the days end when they come home, or I am out running errands. My friends are all O.L.D. and prefer comfy pants nowadays :D Most people to me are their avatar online, whether it be a cat, a hand, a piece of fruit, or a majestic bouffant princess.

Quote

Glen just has a lovely voice.   I listened to it over and over for a week just because he lulled me.  He can tell a story, but he doesn't have 1001 voices.  Just a nice nice listen. 

I love Ian Glenn's readings... except he gets a little "sshhhy" with some of his words, like he needs to unlock his jaw. However, when he reads the part where Rhaenyra gives birth, I do get chills in a sad way...

On Dragonstone, no cheers were heard. Instead, screams echoed through the halls and stairwells of Sea Dragon Tower, down from the queen’s apartments where Rhaenyra Targaryen strained and shuddered in her third day of labor. The child had not been due for another turn of the moon, but the tidings from King’s Landing had driven the princess into a black fury, and her rage seemed to bring on the birth, as if the babe inside her were angry too, and fighting to get out. The princess shrieked curses all through her labor, calling down the wroth of the gods upon her half brothers and their mother the queen, and detailing the torments she would inflict upon them before she would let them die. She cursed the child inside her too. “Get out,” she screamed, clawing at her swollen belly as her maester and her midwife tried to restrain her. “Monster, monster, get out, get out, GET OUT!”

Quote

 You can hear every single 1 of the histories and lore on YouTube for free!  I spent too much $ on these damned books in 3 mediums to be able to afford DVDs.  

Same here... although I stopped watching that abomination a while ago. I may check out the youtube vids (for free!) one day. Maybe.

Quote

Jamie doesn't register that Jeyne isn't Arya (Please God, don't let that be a show thing again) -- why wouldn't LSH or anyone else assume it really is Arya at Winterfell? 

Jaime knows Jeyne is not Arya. So does Brienne, Cersei, Tywin (of course), Littlefinger, Lady Dustin, Roose, Ramsay, and all of the north that we hear about. LSH has her faction of the BWB looking for Arya, which is in part what the duty of Gendry is at the Inn at the Crossroads. This is part of the historic Nymeria/Orphans of the Greenblood that our little Arya and her wolf are somewhat reenacting in the current story (in a looser way).

A Storm of Swords - Jaime V

"Oh, trout makes for a tasty supper." Bolton lifted a pale finger toward his cupbearer. "Though my poor Elmar is bereft. He was to wed Arya Stark, but my good father of Frey had no choice but to break the betrothal when King Robb betrayed him."
"Is there word of Arya Stark?" Brienne leaned forward. "Lady Catelyn had feared that . . . is the girl still alive?"
"Oh, yes," said the Lord of the Dreadfort.

A Storm of Swords - Jaime IX

Jaime studied her closely. "You know me, then?"
She bit her lip. "You may not recall, my lord, as I was littler then . . . but I had the honor to meet you at Winterfell when King Robert came to visit my father Lord Eddard." She lowered her big brown eyes and mumbled, "I'm Arya Stark."
Jaime had never paid much attention to Arya Stark, but it seemed to him that this girl was older. "I understand you're to be married."
"I am to wed Lord Bolton's son, Ramsay. He used to be a Snow, but His Grace has made him a Bolton. They say he's very brave. I am so happy."

A Storm of Swords - Jaime IX

"Aye, and we've shared it out. You have my thanks." The northman grinned. "A Lannister always pays his debts."
"Always," said Jaime, with a last glance at the girl. He wondered if there was much resemblance. Not that it mattered. The real Arya Stark was buried in some unmarked grave in Flea Bottom in all likelihood. With her brothers dead, and both parents, who would dare name this one a fraud? "Good speed," he told Steelshanks. Nage raised his peace banner, and the northmen formed a column as ragged as their fur cloaks and trotted out the castle gate. The thin girl on the grey mare looked small and forlorn in their midst.

A Storm of Swords - Jaime IX

"You gave her to him?" she cried, dismayed. "You swore an oath to Lady Catelyn . . ."
"With a sword at my throat, but never mind. Lady Catelyn's dead. I could not give her back her daughters even if I had them. And the girl my father sent with Steelshanks was not Arya Stark."

"Not Arya Stark?"

"You heard me. My lord father found some skinny northern girl more or less the same age with more or less the same coloring. He dressed her up in white and grey, gave her a silver wolf to pin her cloak, and sent her off to wed Bolton's bastard." He lifted his stump to point at her. "I wanted to tell you that before you went galloping off to rescue her and got yourself killed for no good purpose. You're not half bad with a sword, but you're not good enough to take on two hundred men by yourself."
<snip>
Brienne shook her head. "When Lord Bolton learns that your father paid him with false coin . . ."
"Oh, he knows. Lannisters lie, remember? It makes no matter, this girl serves his purpose just as well. Who is going to say that she isn't Arya Stark? Everyone the girl was close to is dead except for her sister, who has disappeared."
"Why would you tell me all this, if it's true? You are betraying your father's secrets."
The Hand's secrets, he thought. I no longer have a father. "I pay my debts like every good little lion. I did promise Lady Stark her daughters . . . and one of them is still alive. My brother may know where she is, but if so he isn't saying. Cersei is convinced that Sansa helped him murder Joffrey."
Edited by The Fattest Leech
Found it! I added the quote

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35 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

@divica, Brienne will at some point - if she hasn't already, which I find more likely - realise that Cat is dead and the vow she made to Cat is just as dead. LSH is not Cat. She's like bizarro-Cat - where Cat wanted an end to the violence, all LSH wants is revenge and blood. And not just that, but she made a vow to Jaime as well. Jaime who is still himself, and the man she loves to boot. 

Here's an interesting bit...

ASoS Jaime IX 

Brienne's homely face twisted in fury. "If you believe that I would harm my lady's daughter for a sword, you—"

"Just listen," he snapped, angered by her assumption. "I want you to find Sansa first, and get her somewhere safe. How else are the two of us going to make good our stupid vows to your precious dead Lady Catelyn?" 

The wench blinked. "I . . . I thought . . ."

That quote shows that even after cat's death brienne wants to find and protect her daughters.

I believe she may break her oath of service to LSH because she is not cat. But I don t believe she will ever stop trying to make sure her daughters are ok. Besides, I don t know if Brienne is capable of killing LSH. We would need more information to know how evil LSH is or if she is only blinded by revenge and can yet be "saved".

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1 minute ago, LynnS said:

I'm not sure that LSH can be reasoned with.  Catelyn's last act in life was to cut some innocent's throat or am I confusing the show?  She seems more of a grim reaper executioner type.  If Lem as the Hound is brutalizing innocents under her aegis; she's more demonic than anything.  It might be up to Brienne to put an end to her and the fHound.   But then what possessed Beric to bring her back to life?  How does he have the power to do that in the first place?

Bingo.  I don't think she can be reasoned with either.   Higher conspiracy sure, but not reason. Beric's after lives were like ghosts or mists of his life--all knightly and good.  That was his purpose when he died.  And died.   And died.   LSH was in a totally different state of being.   She was defeated and horrified, betrayed, vengeful and murderous upon her death. And she was dead a long time, 3 days as opposed to Beric's nearly instantaneous resurrections.   Long story short I think LSH has lost all her humanity.   There is nothing left to reason with.  I like where you're going with Lem, too.   That wasn't how he was under Beric's command.  There is some evil magic coming off her.  Thoros isn't happy even a little bit with her.  

I can think of a bunch of people who could put LSH out of her misery.   My personal favorite is Arya learning the real gift of mercy instead of all her righteous vengeance.  But that's me and highly improbable.  I can't say too much about Beric's choice to give Cat the kiss of life.   I'm saving that for a topic I wrote for our friends at the Riverlands Web when they get going again. But I know I came up with at least 3 reasons why he would do this thing. I think this life transfer sort of fits in with our friend @hiemal's ideas about soul transfer.  Someone has to be able to bring Jamie, Brienne, The Hound, Lem, Hyle, Pod, Gendry or any number of other characters back when this is all said and done.   We've got 2 life givers but I doubt LSH will be kissing anyone.  That kindness is simply not in her. 

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