Unpopular Opinions?

[BRANDON GREYSTARK]

1 hour ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

The fact that George hasn't announced that the series is being extended to eight books yet is something I find genuinely surprising. 

Hi there , the series originally was to be three books .

[The Mother of The Others]

But it's been tracking as if there's 4 more coming.   In only 2, it'd have to be as truncated as the last couple books have been stretched.  Or, if it's to move at the same pace we've been at, only 2 more books would imply we're not getting the meat in our sandwich that we've been led to expect.  Some major side- stepping of armageddons and such.

[Vaedys Targaryen]

On 5/3/2018 at 4:49 PM, Lollygag said:

I don't know if it's a thing or not as I've not looked. I assume it's already out there somewhere and is just unpopular. Did a lot of research into Gerion and Brightroar (we know more than we think we do) and then when I read Illyrio a lot of bells went off. I'll do an OP on it at one point. 

Just a summary of some points I'll touch on. Basically, read up on Gerion, then read Illyrio with that in mind. 

· Tyrion asks to go to Essos (Gerion’s fascinated by it) but Tywin says no as he can’t be counted on to not marry a whore. Tyrion says the other Lannister men were allowed to go and Tywin replies neither of his brothers married a whore. Tywin has 3 brothers, not two.

· Illyrio/Serra fits in well with the Lannsiter whore/wife confusion. Also Hands of Gold are always cold but a woman’s hands are warm” which is on Tyrion's mind fits in well with Illyrio keeping Serra's stone hands. 

· Gerion is said to take after his father Tytos, both being called the Laughing Lion. Illyrio has gold hair, laughs a lot, and is grossly overweight like Tytos.

· Gerion taught Tyrion to tumble which ticks off Twyin who thinks it’s acting like a monkey. Illyrio names Tyrion “Yollo” which Tyrion equates to a monkey name.

· Illyrio, Gerion, Tyrion (I recall hearing somewhere on the this forum where GRRM said look to names for clues to alternate identities.

· Illyrio keeps getting compared to Casterly Rock, talks about gold all of the time, brings up repaying debts.

· Gerion marrying a whore might be a reason Tywin might exile him and claim him to be dead. ADWD Tyiron II: The cheesemonger smiled through his forked beard. "And Daenerys will give the exiles what Bittersteel and the Blackfyres never could. She will take them home."

· Tyrion thinks to the effect of “I’ll never see that uncle again” when thinking about Kevan. Tyrion has no uncles left but Kevan so the statement is odd. Tyrion then goes on to meet up with Illyrio.

· Illyrio’s interest in Aegon is similar to Gerion’s interest in Joy. I don’t necessarily think Aegon is Illyrio’s kid though. Gerion seems to have liked kids in general. 

· Illyrio being Gerion fits right in with the toxic Lannister uncle/nephew thing.

· Gerion is described as hanging out with cheesemongers and spice lords.

· Gerion said more or less better to joke than play the game and lose, which means Gerion was gauaging when to play and when not play. Gerion gave Robert a VS steel dagger which Tywin took as Gerion trying to gain Robert’s favor. The general perception of Gerion being just a good-time guy falls apart upon closer inspection. Gerion and Varys is more believable than Illyrio and Varys which Tyrion has already called out as being a BS story, at least partially.

· Gerion as Illyrio trying usurp his own family is so Lannister.

ADWD Tyrion I

"You drink a deal of wine for such a little man."

"Kinslaying is dry work. It gives a man a thirst."

The fat man's eyes glittered like the gemstones on his fingers.

AGOT Daenerys I

"I shall kill the Usurper myself," he promised, who had never killed anyone, "as he killed my brother Rhaegar. And Lannister too, the Kingslayer, for what he did to my father."

"That would be most fitting," Magister Illyrio said. Dany saw the smallest hint of a smile playing around his full lips, but her brother did not notice.

 

I like this.

[Dorian Martell's son]

16 hours ago, talvikorppi said:

This, and your several next posts.

There's too much time between books, so everything gets picked and prodded and analysed, and then picked and prodded and overanalysed, before they get picked and prodded and really over the top analysed.

Another opinion that I've gathered isn't universally popular among the fandom: I really, really like Tyrion's chapters on the Rhoyne. Them slowly sailing down the river. We're introduced to all these seemingly bening charactets - except surly Griff, who sets Tyrion's mind working... And, aaah, Septa Lemore of the naked swimming. 

The way the river trip was described, it was lovely, langruous. I loved reading every minute of it. All the nature about them, the sand banks, even the king turtle. Only Griff could not enjoy any of it. It got seriously serious with the rewind (gods I luuuurve that bit) and the stone men. By then Tyrion had figured out who Young Griff was, or was supposed to be - the lad believed it all right. This perfect prince froze when what's what came to home, while Tyrion the dwarf, Yollo, the fool, saved his sorry princely arse.

But yeah, I really love the Rhoyne chapters. Not many readers apparently do.

They are interesting chapters. Tyrion has become an addict has the shakes from withdrawal, but he is still sharp.  

[Therae]

On 4/15/2018 at 3:39 PM, kissdbyfire said:

Now one that will be proper unpopular:

Hoster Tully was an arsehole, but the Blackfish is an even bigger one. 

Truth be told, Edmure is the only Tully I sympathise with; at least he was actually trying to save all the smallfolk that turned up at RR. 

 (although I do think Hoster was a bigger jerk than the Blackfish).

[kissdbyfire]

15 minutes ago, Therae said:

 (although I do think Hoster was a bigger jerk than the Blackfish).

Let's call it a draw and be done w/ it!

 

[Lollygag]

Wick's blade was coated in sweetsleep and that's why Jon suddenly went from being able to grab Wick's skinny wrist which wouldn't be much bigger than a sword hilt to only seconds later, being unable to grasp his actual hilt.

The sweetsleep lowered his heart rate and blood pressure which along with the cold and Ghost allows him to survive the attack. It also explains the time gaps and his reaction time going from sharp (disarming Wick) to almost nothing (standing there mouth breathing while everyone stabs him) in only seconds.

It parallels nicely with Bran's POV after Luwin gives him sweetsleep. While it suppresses dreams, Bran finds out it really enhances warging.

[Morgana Lannister]

On 1/8/2018 at 9:13 PM, Lady Anna said:

I think Dance is the best book in the series.

My least favourite chapters are the Kingslanding chapters throughout all the books.

I think some theories will never be explained, and even if they're confirmed to the reader they won't have any impact on the characters and their actions at all.

I may be very basic but not for me; okay my fav character is a mess in that book (but has to be lol) but not just that, I was happy with the amount of characters we had before and with the exception of Myranda Royce I would be happier without the new introductions lol  I liked some like the supposed Septa, but hardly anyone newbe...  Personally, I think I am a bit simple and got to a point of saturation; more villains, more heroes or whatever for me too late in the game.... I could accept Euron, say, but what is the point in Victarion???  I would have preferred more dialogue and interaction with the guys we had already established as main characters.  Quentyn was another one I could not see the point in; for his predicament (desperately seeking parental approval) we already have Tyrion and Sam, say... who are by far funnier in my opinion; okay, not as abused, not as disabled or something, but bland or what???   Even Arianne seems a water down version of Cersei or even Margaery to me... why so many more that are less striking that the initial characters???

And if people like, say, Arianne, manages to cast down Cersei, say... why introduce her so late?  It may be just me but I have issues connecting with new comers that late in a huge story like this; simply I root for or against the earlier ones and I hope the new additions will get killed or something lol unless they introduce something new, not a waterdown repetition of our heroes and or villains

 

[Leonardo]

Unpopular? Lyanna Stark was a crappy person until proven otherwise

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

On 4/10/2018 at 4:57 AM, Corvo the Crow said:

You know nothing Old Nan.

I mean, the only time we get a description of giants from her, they are bloodthirsty savages who eat humans raw and use bones for toothpick but they are actually rather peaceful herbivores, unless provoked. I bet her other stories have many false elements as well.

Haven't finished the thread yet, but giants in this instance may mean weirwood.

Quote

at the center the heart tree standing like some pale giant frozen in time.

The heart tree stood before him, a pale giant with a carved face and leaves like bloody hands.

Some hardly looked like trees at all. Buried from root to crown in frozen snow, they huddled on the hill like giants, monstrous and misshapen creatures hunched against the icy wind.

The Horn of Joramun waking the giants could refer to waking the weirwoods.

 

[goldenmaps]

1 hour ago, Leonardo said:

Unpopular? Lyanna Stark was a crappy person until proven otherwise

I agree unless it really was a kidnapping.  She ran off with a married man with two children.  And I know that Robert wouldn't make the best husband but I doubt lyanna would have been any better. what rhaegar and lyanna did was selfish and they only thought about themselves.  

 

[Euron Lannister]

the only reasons why i want jon to be revived, is to see how sansa treats him after she acted as a bastard, for some information about the hardhome mission and to read his thoughts about jeyne poole and theon.

but in the longterm he was one of the more boring povs imo

[Bernie Mac]

48 minutes ago, Euron Lannister said:

the only reasons why i want jon to be revived, is to see how sansa treats him after she acted as a bastard,

why? it is not like Littlefinger has five other legitimate kids who he treats 'better' than her or that he has a wife who sees her as a threat to her children. What new perspective has Sansa learnt considering that as the daughter of Ned Stark she was being betrothed to the heir of the kingdom and as the 'daughter' of Littlefinger she is being betrothed to the heir of the Vale. Her position means she is treated like an equal by Myranda Royce, while she herself orders the likes of Mya. 

She has not really learnt anything about Jon's insecurities about being a bastard, if anything she should be wondering why he was so morose, apart from being the daughter of an inferior House not much has changed.

[Lollygag]

1 hour ago, Euron Lannister said:

the only reasons why i want jon to be revived, is to see how sansa treats him after she acted as a bastard, for some information about the hardhome mission and to read his thoughts about jeyne poole and theon.

but in the longterm he was one of the more boring povs imo

I agree with the bolded. Among a number of other things, the scene where Catelyn Lysa threatened tried to kill Jon  Sansa over Ned Littlefinger is big set up for this. Notice the prominent mentions of snow in that scene.

All of the Stark kids have been thoroughly bastardized. 

[Therae]

20 hours ago, kissdbyfire said:

Let's call it a draw and be done w/ it!

 

Oh gods, yes. Totally a matter of personal taste. The main thing is that they are both jerks who don't seem to consider that the Duty part of their words extends to the very people who depend on them for protection when it actually counts. Only Edmure gets that right.

 

[The Mother of The Others]

So Edmure needs to get rescued by Tyrion.   Frees up the Fish to do more interesting deeds dirt cheap.   (Because he only has his swimsuit on without a wallet pouch, right?)

[Joy Hill]

On 16/04/2018 at 0:39 AM, kissdbyfire said:

Hoster Tully was an arsehole, but the Blackfish is an even bigger one.

So much this. Where to begin?

He kicks the common people out of Riverrun and scours the Riverlands, thus making sure they die of starvation, for no other reason than pride. This is especially dickish considering the fact that those people paid taxes to Riverrun al their lives, and as a member of House Tully he owed them his protection. He is also a knight, sworn to protect all women, children and vulnerable people.

He quickly abandons his duties as knight of the gate because he doesn't like Lysa, leaving the smallfolk at the mercy of the mountain clans.

He bullies Edmure for not being a mind reader and taking perfectly sensible actions, given the orders he received. Later, he abandons his nephew to die without lifting a finger to help him.

Let's not forget that he hurts an animal just to have a good laugh.

Of course, despite this less than honorable behavior, he never gets off his high horse.

[Joy Hill]

On 19/04/2018 at 6:04 AM, Leonardo said:

Unpopular? Lyanna Stark was a crappy person until proven otherwise

I'm not sure if she was a lousy person or if she was just a kid (remember, she was only 14 when she disappeared), but it does seem that from the tourney to "promise me Ned" she kept doing crappy actions (I mean I suspect that "promise me Ned" is the reason Jon grew up in Winterfell rather than be sent to be fostered somewhere, which hurt her brother's marriage).

[goldenmaps]

Just now, Joy Hill said:

I'm not sure if she was a lousy person or if she was just a kid (remember, she was only 14 when she disappeared), but it does seem that from the tourney to "promise me Ned" she kept doing crappy actions (I mean I suspect that "promise me Ned" is the reason Jon grew up in Winterfell rather than be sent to be fostered somewhere, which hurt her brother's marriage).

I have to agree.  Lyanna's actions were crappy.  She constantly made selfish decisions and was not thinking about other people.  And she was not thinking about the consequences of her actions.   And she may have been young and impressionable.   She might not be a crappy person but if it wasn't a kidnapping than Lyanna was making a lot of stupid decisions.

[Bitterblooms]

On 4/19/2018 at 0:04 AM, Leonardo said:

Unpopular? Lyanna Stark was a crappy person until proven otherwise

I actually agree that she was at least capable of serious wrongdoing, if not crappy per se. I was really surprised when I started reading on this forum how many people had a very pleasant and wholesome view of Lyanna Stark. When I first read the books, I got an impression that she was willful and she ran away and she wasn't going to be told what to do by anybody. You know, the kind of person that would run away even though she was engaged to someone else. Maybe the same spirit of impulsivity that made her pour wine over her brothers head led her to run away. The books describe her as a fierce wolf, not a turtledove.