Which Tyler Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 Are we talking about Guinness in Ireland, Guinness that's travelled, or Guinness that's made elsewhere? They are 3 different beasts after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 39 minutes ago, Which Tyler said: Are we talking about Guinness in Ireland, Guinness that's travelled, or Guinness that's made elsewhere? They are 3 different beasts after all. Yup. I have some friends who aren't fans of Guinness here, but they said it was great in Ireland. They basically said there's one version for the Irish, one for Europeans and then one for the rest of the world that's noticeably of poorer quality. Ah a beer derail, the best kind of derail. Now we shall go have a shower beer this evening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S John Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 46 minutes ago, Which Tyler said: Are we talking about Guinness in Ireland, Guinness that's travelled, or Guinness that's made elsewhere? They are 3 different beasts after all. I've had the first two varieties, in Ireland and Guinness that's travelled. I know you're supposed to be able to say "Holy FUCK, Guinness is so much better in Ireland!" But to be completely honest I couldn't really tell much of a difference from Guinness consumed in Ireland to the Guinness available state-side and I drank many of them when I was there, just to be sure. I could see an Irish person for whom it is their alcoholic beverage of choice noticing a difference when abroad, but to me the Guinness in Ireland... tasted like Guinness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 3 hours ago, Mexal said: I buy it. I mean, they didn't really have an exit strategy and they were never going to get an actual deal for the Dreamers. Plus, shutting down the government never looks good. I don't think it'll make a lick of difference come 2018 mid terms. 2 hours ago, Maithanet said: Agreed with all of this. I was surprised the Democrats went the shutdown route, and once it happened it seemed obvious that they weren't in it for the long haul. Their hearts were never really in it, which makes maintaining a shutdown hard to justify, especially if it doesn't look like it's going to be a political winner. I expected that it wouldn't last more than a week or so. The one good thing for the Dems though is the built in perception that they're the party for government while Republicans are seen as opposing it, which leads me to believe they'll take less of a hit than if the shoe was on the other foot. 2 hours ago, dmc515 said: I agree that Trump was the Dems greatest asset, but this is just another example of the feckless skittishness (sorry, I know I shouldn't do that to the English language). Have the balls to wait a few more days. If there's one thing that's predictable about Trump, it's that he'll say something stupidly offensive eventually. Maybe? I think the problem is that Dems never know how to win a messaging war, even when it's obvious what they need to do. Take Obamacare for example. The moment my grandfather heard that he was like, "Wow, what a bunch of idiots. Obama can just turn that around and say 'that's right, I do care about Americans' healthcare and you clearly don't.'" I took Obama like five years to figure that one out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Anti-Targ Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 So, US trade war with China incoming. We're about due for another global recession, looks like this might be the thing that tips us into one. If the US falls into recession because of stupid economic nationalism the world will follow, but hopefully not in as devastating manner as the '08 GFC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMC Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 12 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said: Maybe? I think the problem is that Dems never know how to win a messaging war, even when it's obvious what they need to do. Take Obamacare for example. I think the Dems' lack of messaging prowess, historically, is somewhat overstated. Obamacare was racialized, and now that it isn't so much, it's much more popular. I think that's more a feature of how easy it is to demonize policies when you're in the opposition. The Dems did win the messaging war in the last two shutdowns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 3 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said: So, US trade war with China incoming. We're about due for another global recession, looks like this might be the thing that tips us into one. If the US falls into recession because of stupid economic nationalism the world will follow, but hopefully not in as devastating manner as the '08 GFC. Oh please. China isn't going to go into a trade war because of solar panels. They'll happily sell to the entire fucking rest of the world. The US market needs them a LOT more than China needs their business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martell Spy Posted January 23, 2018 Author Share Posted January 23, 2018 Quote (3) Fights over democracy are part of normal party politics. Studying democratic backsliding in foreign countries makes the crux of the issue easy for Americans to identify. When a president rigs legislative races to protect his party, or abuses law enforcement, or whips up sectarian anger and violence, we recognize those symptoms easily. When they happen in the United States, we process them as familiar red team versus blue team fights. That is one reason why comparative government scholars are relatively alarmed: They recognize Trump’s anti-democratic rhetoric in a context outside the cable-news shoutfests in which Americans have processed it. Democracy Has Survived a Year of Trump. But the Fight Isn’t Over. http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2018/01/democracy-survived-a-year-of-trump-but-the-fights-not-over.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 10 minutes ago, dmc515 said: I think the Dems' lack of messaging prowess, historically, is somewhat overstated. Obamacare was racialized, and now that it isn't so much, it's much more popular. I think that's more a feature of how easy it is to demonize policies when you're in the opposition. The Dems did win the messaging war in the last two shutdowns. Seems like a push on this one. Anyways, one of the other bigger problems with the messaging war is that the Republicans use simply messages while Democrats tend to have these long winded, mealy mouthed messages that often fail to communicate concepts to average people. And by historically speaking, how long a window do you have in mind? Because it does feel to me that there's a big gap, at least since I've been paying attention to politics (which is probably sometime between 2003-4). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGimletEye Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 23 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said: So, US trade war with China incoming. We're about due for another global recession, looks like this might be the thing that tips us into one. If the US falls into recession because of stupid economic nationalism the world will follow, but hopefully not in as devastating manner as the '08 GFC. I'd hope when the Davos crowd wrinkles their noses at Trump when he makes his speech, they might realize they helped to create the Orange Monster and people like Le Pen and so forth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMC Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 27 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said: Seems like a push on this one. Anyways, one of the other bigger problems with the messaging war is that the Republicans use simply messages while Democrats tend to have these long winded, mealy mouthed messages that often fail to communicate concepts to average people. And by historically speaking, how long a window do you have in mind? Because it does feel to me that there's a big gap, at least since I've been paying attention to politics (which is probably sometime between 2003-4). I didn't really have a timeframe in mind, although obviously everyone has a better idea of what they're exposed to, so I guess since around Lewinsky. I think the GOP is better at priming while the Dems are better at framing, if that makes any sense to you. It speaks to the simplicity advantage you mentioned the Republicans seem to have. (Although in this case I think it's unfair to blame Dems because the GOP's message was inherently simpler.) Of course, what Shanto Iyengar would specify is the Dems are better at thematic framing while the GOP is better at episodic framing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jace, Extat Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 HEY! HEY! You fake news junkies listen up! We've made a new thread! It's a big beautiful thread that's twenty feet high and made of concrete and is see through-in some places- and presumably some are good people! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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