Jump to content
Myshkin

MLB 2018: Sho(hei) Me What You Got

Recommended Posts

On 5/28/2018 at 11:49 PM, Triskele said:

So this is partly on topic because it involves a college player that easily could be a future star pro, but he also might not get much of a shot because of a weird situation with a guilty plea to a sexual assault charge from when he's 15.  I know that this came up somewhere on the board last year but I don't think it was in the MLB thread.  At any rate, SI has a long article on the situation now that is fascinating.  

This team has been ranked around #1 in the nation most of the year and so should be in Omaha unless they're upset.  Will be interesting to see how the national media handles it if it gets there.

I can't say that 'weird' is the first word that comes to mind to describe it, but ok. This is the thread from last year. 

 

Dude had every opportunity to push back on the guilty plea and bad legal advice thing long before he was in peril of going undrafted. But only when it became apparent he wouldn't skate through did he start his selective media campaign. And his 12 year old niece gets to go through this yet again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, this situation is highly unusual in the sports world which is part of why SI ran this, and weird is not a bad synonym for unusual.  That's all I meant by that.  For the record, your tone is extremely condescending and accusatory.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Heimlich’s gone undrafted again. Someone may try to sign him as an undrafted free agent and hope it flies under the radar, but I doubt it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/5/2018 at 3:11 AM, DireWolfSpirit said:

Your jesting here right?

The list of great pitching seasons turned in by pitchers 35 or older is a very, very, very long one.

Erm, no, not at all.  Not at Verlander's current level of dominance.  Granted, he's only about 40% through the season, but even if he pitched at a 3.00 ERA the rest of the way, he'd finish with about a 2.30 ERA.  The list of 35+ year old pitchers that have had seasons like that in the past 30 years is a very, very, very small one.  Like, just Randy Johnson and Clemens.  The fist is an absolute freak of nature and the second is, well, like I said, shenanigans.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, Myshkin said:

Heimlich’s gone undrafted again. Someone may try to sign him as an undrafted free agent and hope it flies under the radar, but I doubt it.

At this point my guess is that it doesn't happen unless there's a major change of heart in some clubhouse.  I just can't believe that there's any major difference in the negative pub a club would deal with from a draft pick of a person with Heimlich's background versus a free agent signing of the same.  And since he is having a historically good college season one might have thought that if anyone was willing to take him on they might have just pounced once he dropped a few rounds since he should have been a first round pick on paper.  

As of right now it looks like Oregon State won their regional and plays Minnesota in the Super Regional, so if Oregon State wins they'll be in Omaha and we'll see how the media handles not only the assault history but also the weird/unusual dynamic of "arguably best pitcher in game, legally here just fine technically, maybe has no future in the pros."  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Billy Mckinney now has 5 HRs in 15 games at Scranton for an .886 OPS.  That, my friends, is a trade chip.  I'd rather the Yanks shop in the Hamels/Happ/Ross bin than aim big with Fulmer or Archer - not least of which because the latter two are underperforming.  And the whole Bumgarner or Mets pitcher is just tabloid bullshit.  Anywho, they can get a replacement for Montgomery without giving up Frazier/Sheffield/Florial, is what I''m saying.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, dmc515 said:

Erm, no, not at all.  Not at Verlander's current level of dominance.  Granted, he's only about 40% through the season, but even if he pitched at a 3.00 ERA the rest of the way, he'd finish with about a 2.30 ERA.  The list of 35+ year old pitchers that have had seasons like that in the past 30 years is a very, very, very small one.  Like, just Randy Johnson and Clemens.  The fist is an absolute freak of nature and the second is, well, like I said, shenanigans.

Nolan Ryan, Gaylord Perry, Luis Tiant, Randy Johnson, Mike Cuellar, Steve Carlton, Bob Gibson, Fergie Jenkins, all had fantastic seasons yet at 35+. And those were just players I checked quickly, there are others as well.

I dont think Verlanders level of dominance is indicative of anything other than he's a ferocious competitor driven to be the best he can be, he's had that mindset his entire career, his sucess in Houston surprizes noone in Detroit.

Until proven otherwise I have no reason to suspect shennanigans.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Shenanigans or no shenanigans, Verlander’s a chump. Now that Matt Kemp guy, he’s the real deal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

Nolan Ryan, Gaylord Perry, Luis Tiant, Randy Johnson, Mike Cuellar, Steve Carlton, Bob Gibson, Fergie Jenkins, all had fantastic seasons yet at 35+. And those were just players I checked quickly, there are others as well.

1.  I'd trim that down to Perry, Carlton, and Gibson for comparable seasons.  2.  Reading is fundamental:

7 hours ago, dmc515 said:

The list of 35+ year old pitchers that have had seasons like that in the past 30 years is a very, very, very small one.

ETA:  One easy way to look at this is through WAR.  Verlander has a 3.6 bWAR through 13 starts.  Extrapolated to 33 starts, and that's a 9.1 WAR.  Since I'm bored, I looked over all the pitchers 35 or older with bWARs of 8.0 or better based on this list:

  1. Lefty Grove - 3 times in the 1930s with a high of 11.4
  2. Steve Carlton - posted a 10.2 at 35 in 1980
  3. Phil Niekro - twice, topping out at 10.0 in 1978 at the age of 39
  4. Cy Young - 3 times in the 1900s with a high of 10.0
  5. Eddie Cicotte (?) - 9.6 at 35 in 1919, never heard of him*
  6. Randy Johnson - 4 times, topping out at 9.1 in 1999 at the age of 35
  7. Gaylord Perry - 8.6 in 1974 at the age of 35
  8. Curt Schilling - 8.6 in 2002 at the age of 35
  9. Roger Clemens - 8.1 in 1998 at the age of 35

So, yeah.  I wouldn't say it's anywhere near a "very very" long list, even including three guys that haven't pitched post-Hitler and three guys that pitched in the 70s.  The bWAR test pretty much bares out what I said - Johnson and Clemens - although I'm surprised Clemens' later seasons weren't higher and I missed Schilling's dominance in 2002.  On Clemens, he did post an 11.9 (!) bWAR in 1997 at 34, but I thought his later seasons would be higher.

ETA2:  * Just looked Cicotte up and he was one of the Black Sox eight - and, obviously, that 1919 season was the year they threw the series.  How bout that.

Edited by dmc515

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, dmc515 said:

Billy Mckinney now has 5 HRs in 15 games at Scranton for an .886 OPS.  That, my friends, is a trade chip.  I'd rather the Yanks shop in the Hamels/Happ/Ross bin than aim big with Fulmer or Archer - not least of which because the latter two are underperforming.  And the whole Bumgarner or Mets pitcher is just tabloid bullshit.  Anywho, they can get a replacement for Montgomery without giving up Frazier/Sheffield/Florial, is what I''m saying.

I'd back up some prospects for deGrom or Syndergaard though. They are supposedly becoming available if the Mets continue to falter.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Mexal said:

I'd back up some prospects for deGrom or Syndergaard though. They are supposedly becoming available if the Mets continue to falter.

If the Mets trade one of those two to the Yanks, I'll proverbially eat my hat.  Even if they were willing, I agree with Axisa that the Mets wouldn't be out of line in asking for Torres.  Which obviously is a no-go.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've always thought Michael Kay was a douchebag, but I've enjoyed how flippant he's being towards pitchers batting.  The NL is like the John Birch Society at this point - in other words horribly outdated and doesn't realize it.  When can we stop this farce and just have DHs?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

....and now Tanaka is out of the game after running in, and inexplicably not sliding, a sac fly at home.  It's Chien Ming Wang all over again!  Fuck you NL!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fuck the NL. Really frustrated with that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

God forbid MLB pitchers be made to play baseball. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pitchers have an OPS under .300.  Making them "play baseball" is also making the viewer watch them utterly fail at baseball.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, dmc515 said:

....and now Tanaka is out of the game after running in, and inexplicably not sliding, a sac fly at home.  It's Chien Ming Wang all over again!  Fuck you NL!!!

It's just his hammy or so they say. I was nervous the second he reached first. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The annual DH/pitcher hitting debate is upon us? Go DH!!

5 hours ago, Arch-MaesterPhilip said:

It's just his hammy or so they say. I was nervous the second he reached first. 

It’s both hamstrings and he’s now on the DL. I’m surprised he even tagged on that ball as it was hit pretty shallow. But seriously, fuck the National League and their archaic practices.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, Ramsay B. said:

The annual DH/pitcher hitting debate is upon us? Go DH!!

It’s both hamstrings and he’s now on the DL. I’m surprised he even tagged on that ball as it was hit pretty shallow. But seriously, fuck the National League and their archaic practices.

I thought he hurt himself legging it out to first. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We should just get designated runners for everybody. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×