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Euron Lannister

JonCon's greyscale and Aegon's reign

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21 minutes ago, Megorova said:

Why not? Master of coin position was promised to Illyrio. So Varys is also going to be on Small Council.

But would the (f)Aegon, who is no longer so easily biddable, and specifically not taking direction about who belongs in what role, really appoint the second-most powerful position in the realm to a man he does not actually know personally? I think he'd be more likely to make Duck his Hand than Varys.

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21 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

But then he hints at the real reason, that he has "debts of affection to repay." Even Tyrion notes that Illyrio has something more in this venture than coin or castles.

And that's the main reason, why he will move to Westeros - to be near fAegon, and give him counselling and aid. Varys isn't going to ever go back to Essos. And when fAegon will seize Iron Throne, then there will be no more need for Illyrio to stay in Essos. Thus he will relocate to 7K. In fAegon's court he will be much more than just a Master of coin. They are relatives, so Illyrio will have much more influence over the King, than just average court official.

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28 minutes ago, Therae said:

But would the (f)Aegon, who is no longer so easily biddable, and specifically not taking direction about who belongs in what role, really appoint the second-most powerful position in the realm to a man he does not actually know personally? I think he'd be more likely to make Duck his Hand than Varys.

Of course he knows him personally. fAegon for first five years of his life lived in Illyrio's mansion. 12 years ago, both Varys and Illyrio approached JonCon with revelation about Rhaegar's son. Prior that and after that Varys was staying in Westeros, so little fAegon was under Illyrio's care. Though probably in the last 12 years they did occasionally contacted each other. And Illyrio with Varys is like a bargain deal, you can't get one of them, without addition of the other one.

Even if fAegon don't remember Varys, because he have seen him 12 years ago, I don't think that they never even contacted each other after that. Varys knows too much about fAegon's upbringing, and his progress, to not be part of fAegon's close circle.

During their youth in Lys, Illyrio was muscles and Varys was brain. And later Illyrio became moneybag, and Varys a mastermind. So if Varys will bring fAegon to Iron Throne, and fAegon will know who was helping him to get there, for all those years, then obviously that he will make Varys his Hand.

It seems to me, that he already started to distance himself from JonCon. I think that while they were separated, fAegon found out truth about who he really is - a Blackfyre. So he's not going to make JonCon his Hand. Thus - who else if not Varys?

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1 hour ago, Megorova said:

Of course he knows him personally. fAegon for first five years of his life lived in Illyrio's mansion. 12 years ago, both Varys and Illyrio approached JonCon with revelation about Rhaegar's son. Prior that and after that Varys was staying in Westeros, so little fAegon was under Illyrio's care. Though probably in the last 12 years they did occasionally contacted each other. And Illyrio with Varys is like a bargain deal, you can't get one of them, without addition of the other one.

Even if fAegon don't remember Varys, because he have seen him 12 years ago, I don't think that they never even contacted each other after that. Varys knows too much about fAegon's upbringing, and his progress, to not be part of fAegon's close circle.

During their youth in Lys, Illyrio was muscles and Varys was brain. And later Illyrio became moneybag, and Varys a mastermind. So if Varys will bring fAegon to Iron Throne, and fAegon will know who was helping him to get there, for all those years, then obviously that he will make Varys his Hand.

It seems to me, that he already started to distance himself from JonCon. I think that while they were separated, fAegon found out truth about who he really is - a Blackfyre. So he's not going to make JonCon his Hand. Thus - who else if not Varys?

These are reasons for Illyrio to suggest Varys as Hand, yes, but they are not reasons for Aegon to make that choice.

Varys has been serving the Iron Throne since Aerys was king; he would not have had a lot of opportunity to visit Pentos. I see no evidence that he has had any direct contact with "Aegon" since the baby swap, and "Aegon" was not of an age to really have much of a personal relationship with him at that point.

I don't agree that (f)Aegon knows he is a Blackfyre (and we don't actually know that he is a Blackfyre). I think it's pretty clear that Aegon absolutely believes he is Rhaegar's son. But even if he is, which isn't established, and Varys is, which isn't established either, that doesn't mean he's going to make him Hand. Nor is it established that he actually will follow through with making Illyrio Master of Coin. It seems to me that fAegon is already showing signs of giving positions to people he favors for reasons that have not much to do with their skill set, and he'd give Hand to someone he trusts, not someone he is told he should trust (although Illyrio is probably the only person in the world who would ever tell him to trust Varys--and no one else really trusts Illyrio).

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1 hour ago, Therae said:

These are reasons for Illyrio to suggest Varys as Hand, yes, but they are not reasons for Aegon to make that choice.

The best reason for fAegon to agree to Varys being his Hand, is that Varys is a Blackfyre thru female line, and a descendant of Bittersteel. Thus Golden Company is actually obeying to him, and it's with him their contract, that is signed with blood.

Without Varys, fAegon will have no troops to conquer 7K. Without provided by him information, fAegon won't even know what he should do.

Soldiers, money and information, all of it was given to fAegon from Varys. Without him the boy is just a pisswater prince. Even JonCon is a gift from Varys. Without Varys fAegon won't become King. And Varys didn't spent 24 (or 22?) years of his life in 7K, to prepare it for Sixth Rebellion of Blackfyres, just to give the Throne away to some boy. He's also planning to rule over 7K. And he will be able to do it, if he will be Hand of King Aegon. Everything that fAegon owns actually belongs to Varys, even fAegon's clothes, thus if Varys will ask, fAegon will have to give him anything Varys will want. He's not in any position to decline that, Varys owns him.

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30 minutes ago, Megorova said:

[snip]

He's not in any position to decline that, Varys owns him.

That is all based on the assumption that Varys is a Blackfyre. This is not established.

As for Varys owning Aegon, I think it's pretty well established that Aegon would disagree with that notion. Even if everything above is accurate and he does owe everything to Varys (which he does, although I don't think we agree on the nature of that debt), it does not necessarily follow that Aegon will consider himself obligated to permit Varys to rule through him. Aegon believes he is a prince. His right to rule, as far as he is concerned, derives from his descent from Aerys through Rhaegar, and if he requires a lot of assistance to make his claim, well, that is exactly what loyal subjects are supposed to provide. He will surely reward them--but as he sees fit, not as they do--and if Varys were to actually threaten to relieve him of the support of the Golden Company unless he's made Hand (which is frankly not a position I could ever see Varys taking in the first place), I think we'll be seeing a head, and probably a hand, too, less of Varys, and the GC won't blink an eye.

Honestly I don't even see Varys wanting to be made Hand. In the Spotlight is not his milieu.  But whatever Varys wants or deserves or demands does not determine what Aegon will give him once his backside is in the pointy chair. He is not the boss of Aegon--and I think what we are seeing from Aegon is the realization that NO ONE is the boss of Aegon, and after Connington goes, he's going to be good and sure he gets a Hand who understands that (or who is able to convince him that they do).

I'd keep an eye on Arianne. 

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Posted (edited)

He will jump from a tower to learn if he can fly and to his delight, not only he can fly with his stoney wings but he can also breathe shadow fire.

He has greyscale and wars in westeros last years so he won't have much time to live after the war. Unless Sam the Slayer of Whites goes a shade darker and uses his dragonglass to give his gray a scratch before Dany the Slayer of lies gives him another kind of scratch.

After that the two of them can marry and their children will slay white lies, like Jon(Snow not connington)

Edited by Corvo the Crow

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Posted (edited)
On 17.4.2018 at 7:19 PM, Lost Melnibonean said:

Who would be Aegon's next Hand?

Depends on the way he gets to the throne, if he marries a familie with access to it like the tyrells, they would likely want to have the second powerful position of the kingdom.

if not i think one of his closest allies, maybe even varys

Edited by Euron Lannister

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