Fat Walda's Future

[Kandrax]

17 hours ago, Nowy Tends said:

what can they do?

Kill themselves.

[The Weirwoods Eyes]

21 hours ago, Lord Lannister said:

I can't picture any scenario where Stannis(or for that matter any of the claimants) would allow Tommen and Myrcella to live. Alive they would always represent a threat to the crown and the realm. Look at the Blackfyres and how many times they and their children contested the crown. Even exiled to the Night's Watch and as a Septa, there's a chance they could escape, have children and eventually become a problem. From Stannis' point of view, he'd be doing his duty to the realm by preventing future wars by killing those two.

I honestly don't think Stannis is the emotionless monster people are trying to paint him as. He isn't Tywin. I don't see the point in repeating myself here. My arguments for why he isn't the type to go round killing children without the strongest of reasons are there to read.

A NW man is bound by his oath, if he escapes he's an oathbreaker. If he has children he is an oathbreaker and they are bastards, if he marries he is an oathbreaker. No way is he going to garner support from enough nobles to ever be a problem. The only region who would be likely to support him are the westerlands, and Stannis or anyone else would be pretty focused on placing their own puppet Lord in CR.  And given Tywins reign of terror in the region I doubt there other noble houses would be too keen on rebelling against the IT to secure an oathbreaking bastard born of incest grandson of his. He ruled via fear and showed he was willing to murder countless women and children to make his point. Women and children related to not just the Reyne's and Tarbecks but many other noble houses too due to intermarriage within the nobility.  

A Septa too is an oathbreaker if she runs away, and again who would support Myrcella's claim? who would marry their legitimate noble born son to an oathbreaking incest bred outcast? Because in order for her sons to be a threat she needs to be married and married to nobility. What Septon will perform a ceremony for a Septa who has run away abandoning her vows? 

[Varysblackfyre321]

On May 3, 2018 at 7:53 AM, UnFit Finlay said:

disagree.

If anything you've got it backwards. He came North to protect the Realm. The Northern Houses supporting him is a by product of that. After all, all but one of the Northern Houses originally rebuffed him and he continued to fight

I think his priorities are made clear when he says this to Jon.

Gaining the fealty of the northern houses is part of his overarching strategy; hench Asha's arrest and parading around; he needs them if he wishes to win this war. The NW's overall wellfare is below his notice. He came specificly to Mance's camp to put down the rogue because like beating the Ironborn such steps are necessary to procure control of the north. He didn't come to specificly save the brotherhood.

On May 3, 2018 at 7:53 AM, UnFit Finlay said:

Also, as irritated as he's been with the Night's Watch's procedures and traditions, he has allowed them to carry them out, when he could simply have seized control. He might not respect those traditions but that does not mean he doesn't respect the institution and the men that are there.

Well even he isn't so ignorant of basic PR, that he could possibly think literally seizing control of the watch by force will look good-him allowing them their automany, that does not show necessarily respect for the men or the tradition; he still rags upon Jon for not totally violating his oaths and the watch for not bending over every time he snaps his fingers. The men of the NW are mostly degenerates, scum of the worse kind

I can see him respect the basic function of the brotherhood; just not the brotherhood itself.

On May 3, 2018 at 7:53 AM, UnFit Finlay said:

moans that Robert didn't "at the very least" send Jaime to the Wall for killing Aerys which suggests he does see it as an appropriate form of punishment.

Nearly Anything would be better  than letting him just go or letting him to retain his current position.

 

On May 3, 2018 at 7:53 AM, UnFit Finlay said:

at Myrcella could be a problem but, by joining the Night's Watch, Tommen is renouncing all his claims and swearing to never have children. If he escapes, and not released from his vows as Stannis and Robb intended for Jon, then he's an oathbreaker whose life is forfeit. The kids he swore never to have can't turn up and demand the birthright that he's already forfeited. It would be like Benjen Stark declaring himself Lord of Winterfell.

It can upon which gods he swears to; if the high septon were to say the 7 no longer wish for Tommen to be in the brotherhood, one could make the case make the case of him being allowed to leave without having broken his oaths. 

[Varysblackfyre321]

On May 3, 2018 at 8:00 AM, Nowy Tends said:

I can't see how.

You forget the "abomination" thing… these children, as the result of an incestuous adultery, will be considered as monsters all their life. They will be pariah.

Tommen at the Wall, Myrcella with the Silent Sisters (based in a sept very distant from KL,) without a penny nor a friend, what can they do?

You forget only few people actually believe Stannis's claim . He has absolutely no proof of his accusations any more than Cersi has that Shireen is the bastard of Stannis's wife and her uncle.  It sounds like the claim a bitter, evil and jealous uncle would give to justify trying to usurp his nephews and nieces throne. Also said uncle just got in bed with this weird foreign religion that requires human sacrifice.

Stannis is really unpopular. And him asending to the throne won't make people any more geared to believing his story. 

And after he burns the idiols of the other religions in westeroes, I'm pretty sure, the faith will release Tommen and Mycerlla from their obligations; to protect tge south's spiritual wellbeing. Hell I actually have to wonder how much support Stannis will lose in the north as his followers burn the godswood especially the one at winterfell. 

[Nowy Tends]

15 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

Hell I actually have to wonder how much support Stannis will lose in the north as his followers burn the godswood especially the one at winterfell. 

You can't seriously think Stannis would burn the weirdwood in Winterfell. To begin with it's in total contradiction with "Gaining the fealty of the northern houses is part of his overarching strategy" as you wrote.

Stannis isn't a brainless fanatic, he knows burning the godswood in WF in front of several northern warriors would lead to a massacre and his end.

[Varysblackfyre321]

43 minutes ago, Nowy Tends said:

You can't seriously think Stannis would burn the weirdwood in Winterfell. To begin with it's in total contradiction with "Gaining the fealty of the northern houses is part of his overarching strategy" as you wrote.

Stannis isn't a brainless fanatic, he knows burning the godswood in WF in front of several northern warriors would lead to a massacre and his end.

The man burned the statues of the 7 allowed his men to burn weretrees while stationed at Castle black allows his followers(even those of high rank), to publicly mock the old gods, and basically took up the moniker of this foreign god's champion and said God is into human sacrifice to which Stannis has provided(albeit crimnals so far). He's not a religious fanatic of any kind; but he lacks empathy to the followers of faith to where he legitmaty doesn't get how doing things like this are really going to turn potential followers against him. Gaining the fealty of the northern houses is apart of his overarching strategy; that doesn't mean he wont for sure do things that can make him quickly lose a lot of them. Short of literal human sacrifice of those not guilty of a crime I don't see him acting in a way that won't piss off the other faiths of Westeroes. 

Really, Stannis seems genuily befuddled with Davos having issue with Stannis's having written his declaration of war with Rh'lor's approval. 

[Lord Lannister]

14 hours ago, The Weirwoods Eyes said:

I honestly don't think Stannis is the emotionless monster people are trying to paint him as. He isn't Tywin. I don't see the point in repeating myself here. My arguments for why he isn't the type to go round killing children without the strongest of reasons are there to read.

Edric Storm would disagree with you.

[hodorisfaclessman]

I think the show has muddied peoples opinions of her chances 

Books a different verse!

Shes a frey that political killer instinct is there shes just as likely to move on ramsey, shes got a strong force of bodyguards with her and ramseys guys are actualy rooses as he stated so

 

[Annalee]

1 hour ago, hodorisfaclessman said:

I think the show has muddied peoples opinions of her chances 

Books a different verse!

Shes a frey that political killer instinct is there shes just as likely to move on ramsey, shes got a strong force of bodyguards with her and ramseys guys are actualy rooses as he stated so

 

I think so.  I could be wrong on this but she was the communication link between the twins and harrenhal.  

[Barbrey Dustin]

Roose Bolton already made Ramsay his heir to the north.  Walda birthing a boy is not going to change that.  A superior claim is not going to retroactively change a will.  

[The Weirwoods Eyes]

14 hours ago, Lord Lannister said:

Edric Storm would disagree with you.

The subject of Edric Storm has been covered already in this thread. Please read it to get a better understanding of what happened. Edric likely would disagree with me. Yes. But that still doesn't make Stannis an emotionless monster.  

[Annalee]

On 5/5/2018 at 3:45 AM, hodorisfaclessman said:

I think the show has muddied peoples opinions of her chances 

Books a different verse!

Shes a frey that political killer instinct is there shes just as likely to move on ramsey, shes got a strong force of bodyguards with her and ramseys guys are actualy rooses as he stated so

 

It would be nice if Walda turns the tables on Ramsey and gets him first to save her child.  Better if the child is a boy and inherits the north instead of Ramsey.  I can think of no better scenario.  Young Lord Walder Bolton named in honor of his g-grandfather becomes the Warden of the North and Lord of Winterfell after the death of his father, Lord Roose Bolton.  

[James Fenimore Cooper XXII]

On 4/29/2018 at 4:18 PM, Kandrax said:

Personally, i don't think that Ramsay would be serious threat to her, he would be dead after Stannis takes Winterfell, unless he escape from justice.

Now, real question is what would Stannis do about her? Spare her, but reduce to common woman? Send her to silent sisters? Kill her to please northmen?

Stannis is a heartless guy.  He might do that if he gets the chance.  I hope it doesn't happen though.

[Varysblackfyre321]

3 hours ago, James Fenimore Cooper XXII said:

Stannis is a heartless guy.  He might do that if he gets the chance.  I hope it doesn't happen though.

Jesus Christ man, the man isn't perfect but he's not a monster and neither are most the northern lords, no ones going to like fat Walda being abused in any way-well except Manderly but he's made his belief of all Freys deserving punishment abundunly clear.

[Kandrax]

5 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

Manderly but he's made his belief of all Freys deserving punishment

When did he make his belief that all Freys are guilty?

[Varysblackfyre321]

Just now, Kandrax said:

When did he make his belief that all Freys are guilty?

From his whole speech on it was best Little Walder died before he could become a Frey speech, and him being giddy of serving the Freys(relatively innocuous Freys like fat Walda), eating their kin he murdererd and cooked into pies. The man is a gross monster little different from that of Rickard Karstark, or Walder Frey. 

[Kandrax]

8 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

From his whole speech on it was best Little Walder died before he could become a Frey speech, and him being giddy of serving the Freys(relatively innocuous Freys like fat Walda), eating their kin he murdererd and cooked into pies. The man is a gross monster little different from that of Rickard Karstark, or Walder Frey. 

I will give you pass for LW, though considering that he would, maybe, become at age 12 a serial rapist, it was really a blessing.

However, Frey pies aren't proof that he thinks that Freys deserve collective punishment

Would you really call Karstark a monster?

Anyway, you would probably agree with me that he would be against child molestation and severe abuse toward Frey children.

[Corvo the Crow]

Manderly has lost a son and has no grandsons. I think he can find a use for a squealy woman coming from a fertile family. Especially if said woman won't crush under his weight.

[Darth Sidious]

The conversation between Roose and Theon seemed like a test to me.  Roose was testing to see if he can trust Theon to play his role.  I am not so sure he's willing to allow Ramsay to murder Walda's potential children.  

[Varysblackfyre321]

20 hours ago, Kandrax said:

I will give you pass for LW, though considering that he would, maybe, become at age 12 a serial rapist, it was really a blessing.

However, Frey pies aren't proof that he thinks that Freys deserve collective punishment

Would you really call Karstark a monster?

Anyway, you would probably agree with me that he would be against child molestation and severe abuse toward Frey children.

Manderly wasn't there for any of little Walder's more psychotic moment, for all Manderly knows the boy was perfectly innocent, he's saying he needed to die because of the blood in his veins.

Feeding Frey pies to innocent Freys with no remorse shows he really doesn't discriminate.

Rickard Karstark did murder two boys over his sons being killed honorbly in combat by the boys' family.

Manderly already said murdering Frey children is a good thing, I see no reason why him being against any of them being sexually abused is a guarantee.