Football: CLeaning up

[ljkeane]

47 minutes ago, Warm-hands said:

ETA: heck, I know I'm not Jurgen Klopp, but when you also have to look for a top GK, a decent CB to pair with VVD, (conceding 6 goals to Roma is never a good sign

I doubt we're going to look to buy either a keeper or a centre back actually.

Karius has done enough to show that it's probably not worth going out and getting someone like Butland and to get Alisson looks like it'd take stupid money. Karius is young enough that he might improve too so I expect they'll stick with him.

In central defence they've just spent £75 on van Dijk, there's Lovren who cost £20 million back when that was a lot of money, Matip who was hand picked to come in and a very talented prospect in Gomez. I don't think it's a position they're going to want to make another big signing in.

In fairness there's been a few wobbles but since van Dijk's come in and Karius and Robertson have cemented their places the defence has been fairly decent. They're joint second in clean sheets for the Premier League. Given how attacking Klopp's system is I'm not sure how much room there is for improvement on that front.  

[Mexal]

5 hours ago, Warm-hands said:

Arsenal's playing identity is miles different from Allegri's one, though. Allegri is a very defensive-minded manager (not as much as Mourinho, don't worry) who adores a counter-attack, I don't think he would suit Arsenal.

I think that’s fine. Arsenal needs to embrace defense as an identity and their strikers are perfect for a counter attacking side. I think Ramsey, Ozil and Mhki would be suited towards this style as well if a Allegri could get them to focus on shape and speed to attack.

[Daemon the Leaner]

1 hour ago, Mexal said:

I think that’s fine. Arsenal needs to embrace defense as an identity and their strikers are perfect for a counter attacking side. I think Ramsey, Ozil and Mhki would be suited towards this style as well if a Allegri could get them to focus on shape and speed to attack.

The evolution in Arsenal's identity would indeed be interesting, should Allegri be appointed.

But he would probably have to buy a couple of strong midfielders as he likes (such as Khedira, Matuidi, Marchisio), because at the moment, Arsenal's midfield is rather shaped for possession than winning the ball back and going on a counter. In a sense, that would be a kind of return to Arsenal's roots: Wenger built his team around solid, dynamic players such as Vieira, Gilberto Silva, Campbell...

PS: I don't even know why we are talking about Allegri while knowing that David Moyes is going to take over the job.

[Mexal]

40 minutes ago, Warm-hands said:

The evolution in Arsenal's identity would indeed be interesting, should Allegri be appointed.

But he would probably have to buy a couple of strong midfielders as he likes (such as Khedira, Matuidi, Marchisio), because at the moment, Arsenal's midfield is rather shaped for possession than winning the ball back and going on a counter. In a sense, that would be a kind of return to Arsenal's roots: Wenger built his team around solid, dynamic players such as Vieira, Gilberto Silva, Campbell...

PS: I don't even know why we are talking about Allegri while knowing that David Moyes is going to take over the job.

Agreed on strong midfielders. It's what Arsenal fans have been arguing about for the last 5 years. We're tired of possession play that sees us fail to convert chances only for one single counter attack or long ball to undo our entire defense.

[polishgenius]

5 hours ago, Warm-hands said:

 

-It sentences an attacking-minded Keita to play in a defensive position, which could work on the long term,

I don't think that's a problem. Keita's not attacking per se, he's box-to-box. Him, Fekir and one other would be ideal really - probably someone they got in but they might work Henderson into a deeper role. The one that really suffers in that scenario is OxCham, because you could rarely ever play those three together and he doesn't really offer anything that one or the other of Fekir and Keita don't do better.




I could see Allegri taking over at Arsenal having a similar effect to when Wenger inherited George Graham's squad back when. Suddenly ally all that passing finessing they've been doing for a decade with a more direct attitude and stronger midfielders plus sounder defenders, and you've got a potentially devastating threat of a countering side.

 

[Iskaral Pust]

I doubt Liverpool have any problem ahead with too many midfielders.  We were rotating quite well when Can and Coutinho were both available.  Fatigue crushes our tactics and set-up, so better to overload the squad and rotate early and often. 

We definitely need another new CM in addition to Keita and we need another forward too, possibly two.  I doubt Ings, Sturridge, Origi or Solanke are adequate back-ups.  I’d like Woodburn, Wilson, etc to get some development time, but that’s what the LC and FAC are for.  

[Consigliere]

Absolutely massive for the Saints. Not a game high in quality but Southampton looked the more threatening going forward. That goal by Gabbiadini looks like it might be enough to keep them up given their superior goal difference (+9) over Swansea and +11 over Huddersfield. Huddersfield in serious trouble now.

ETA. and WBA are officially down as well with this result.

[A Horse Named Stranger]

Yep, that was the worst case scenario for them imho.

And it's not the goal difference that meks this result so tough for Huddersfield.  The problem are the fixtures on the final matchday.

The Saints will probably not win against Manchester City. So if the Saints had lost to Swansea they would've finished the season behind Huddersfield.

Swansea on the other hand play Stoke. So there's a fair chance that they will get the 3 points they need.

So Huddersfield now actually has to find a point against Chelsea or Arsenal to be safe.

[Iskaral Pust]

I was trying to decide beforehand which result would best help Huddersfield.  A draw would have left both teams two points behind but with better GD.  A Swansea win would probably make them safe (presumably getting at least a point from Stoke) but might have doomed Southampton with their final game against City.  Either of those is OK.  The Southampton win is probably worst because Swansea have a good chance of beating Stoke at home. 

Bottom line now is if Huddersfield can get a point against Chelsea or Arsenal then they are safe.  Preferably against Chelsea. 

Good riddance to WBA. 

[Jeor]

16 hours ago, Mexal said:

Agreed on strong midfielders. It's what Arsenal fans have been arguing about for the last 5 years. We're tired of possession play that sees us fail to convert chances only for one single counter attack or long ball to undo our entire defense.

This is why I'd like Allegri. Even if his style is very different and not as fun to watch, Arsenal's defence has been a major problem for years now, and Allegri's the best guy out there to fix it. I'm tired of seeing us get continually torn apart by good attacking teams, or leak goals to teams we should be shutting out. Even if the quality of the football goes downhill a bit, it would be nice to have a decent defence.

And as I've said before, our attackers have the speed and skill to easily switch to a counterattacking style (Ozil, Aubameyang, Mhiki, Welbeck, Lacazette). We just need 1-2 good CBs and a defensive midfielder. Probably a GK in a year or two as well. And having Allegri as manager should also help us attract the best defenders.

[Consigliere]

Classic Caballero. Huge goal for Huddersfield. Chelsea don't look all that good tonight.

 

8 minutes ago, The Mother of The Others said:

<snip>

Wrong thread.

[ljkeane]

Huddersfield are staying up. Great effort given their resources.

Liverpool only need a draw at the weekend too which is a bit of a bonus.

[Iskaral Pust]

Huddersfield!!

[Consigliere]

Great stuff from Huddersfield. They had a very difficult run in but manage to secure survival with a game to go. Well deserved too since they only spent something like 8 days in total in the bottom 3 this season. Chelsea's chances of CL football are over now unless Brighton can do them the mother of all favours at Anfield. Swansea need a miracle.

[l2 0 5 5]

Certainly don't deserve top 4 with the amount of bottom shelf teams we either lost to or drew with this year. 

Huddersfield celebrating like they won a trophy. This is comical. 

[Consigliere]

For Huddersfield, given their modest resources, survival is like winning a trophy. The celebrations are great to see, imo and well deserved too.

[Mark Antony]

Just now, Consigliere said:

For Huddersfield, given their modest resources, survival is like winning a trophy. The celebrations are great to see, imo and well deserved too.

Agreed. Very cool to see them stay up. Cool to see all the newly promoted sides staying up. 

Only needing a draw vs Brighton is pretty clutch for Liverpool. 

[Mexal]

1 minute ago, Consigliere said:

For Huddersfield, given their modest resources, survival is like winning a trophy. The celebrations are great to see, imo and well deserved too.

This.

[l2 0 5 5]

Yeah I get the happiness and cheer in staying up, but when you see grown men take their shirts off, get on their hands and knees, and crawl around the grass as the 4th worst team in the league, it's kinda funny, that's all. I can fully accept that I'm the only person on this thread that will think this way on that. 

[Consigliere]

And Juve have beaten Milan in the Coppa Italia final, quite comfortably in fact. Allegri will become the first manager in European football to win a domestic double in four consecutive seasons.