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How did Ned learn where Lyanna was?

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3 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

Clearly, 'cause that's the kind of character the Ned is. 

Of course he is! Just look at Robb, who is his father's son! He raped Jeyne W along with gods know how many goats on the track.

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On 5/5/2018 at 3:34 PM, kissdbyfire said:

Why, it was Bloodraven, obviously! :D

Close.  It was Bran! 

On 5/5/2018 at 6:38 PM, Lost Melnibonean said:

Someone told. Someone always tells. 

Excellent! 

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16 minutes ago, Corvo the Crow said:

Of course he is! Just look at Robb, who is his father's son! He raped Jeyne W along with gods know how many goats on the track.

Wait a minute now... I know the Valyrians were into sheep and gods know what other beasts, but the Starks don't have a drop of dragonblood, so your theory is clearly false. Besides, didn't Jeyne's mum induce Robb's affection with a love potion she received from Maggy the Frog aka Shiera Seastar?

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1 hour ago, Corvo the Crow said:

During his time in Dorne burning holdfasta and raping windows Ned could easily have learned some KG was spotted along with our prince and a wolfish girl.

That's basically my point. It doesn't need to have come from anyone named or important, necessarily. I know a lot of people like to think someone like Varys or Ashara told him but I see no reason to presume that.

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2 hours ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

Wait a minute now... I know the Valyrians were into sheep and gods know what other beasts, but the Starks don't have a drop of dragonblood, so your theory is clearly false. Besides, didn't Jeyne's mum induce Robb's affection with a love potion she received from Maggy the Frog aka Shiera Seastar?

Robb had Sybelle Spicer's affection too? Man that guy is a charmer. What will I learn next, Theon being in love with him also?

Besides, Ned spent a lot of time with Bobby B and we know from Stannis Baratheons do love raping the windows left behind when men rode off to war. It could have rubbed off to Ned from Bob. Personally I am more of a door holding guy but if they are into that... well that's their preference.

Edited by Corvo the Crow

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11 minutes ago, Corvo the Crow said:

Robb had Sybelle Spicer's affection too? Man that guy is a charmer. What will I learn next, Theon being in love with him also?

Besides, Ned spent a lot of time with Bobby B and we know from Stannis Baratheons do love raping the windows left behind when men rode off to war. It could have rubbed off to Ned from Bob. Personally I am more of a door holding guy but if they are into that... well that's their preference.

And don't forget that Jon "he-may-not-have-the-name-but-he's-got-the-blood" Snow's affection for Satin and his pretty curls. 

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This may be far fetched but maybe Bloodraven/Bran gave him a greendream? 

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24 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

And don't forget that Jon "he-may-not-have-the-name-but-he's-got-the-blood" Snow's affection for Satin and his pretty curls. 

No wonder Starks are dying out despite having more than two sons two generations in a row. They are just not that much into women, they much prefer joining to "celibate" orders filled with men with soft skin. Benjen joined the NW, Jon too and Bran wanted to be KG.

Quote

I have to go now," Jon said. "Uncle Benjen is waiting. I'm to go north to the Wall. We have to leave today, before the snows come." He remembered how excited Bran had been at the prospect of the journey. It was more than he could bear, the thought of leaving him behind like this. Jon brushed away his tears, leaned over, and kissed his brother lightly on the lips.

 

Edited by Corvo the Crow

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He probably checked her Facebook feed.

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My thought has always been Ethan Glover. I'm not sure exactly how it worked out, but he was probably of a similar age to Lyanna and of the North. She might have told him either intentionally or accidentally of the location. I think he might not have been confined to the Black cells his whole time. Early on he might have been treated better only to be locked away later. If Lyanna confided in him some details like the Tower of Joy (which they may have visited more than once), he could then pass that onto Ned once rescued.


Edit: Reading other comments I think an Ethan Glover, Ashara Dayne combination might have been responsible.

Edited by GallowsKnight

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On 5/5/2018 at 3:52 PM, Frey Kings said:

Pretty sure it involves the Daynes of Starfall. 

This.

On 5/5/2018 at 8:38 PM, Lost Melnibonean said:

Someone told. Someone always tells. 

This.

8 hours ago, Ygrain said:

2) That would be the Daynes, who were most likely supplying ToJ with food and information. Perhaps even Ashara herself, who would be a convenient go-between.

And this.

The only bit I would add would be that the Daynes of High Hermitage could also be involved because HH is closer to ToJ than Starfall is. Ashara might well have been the messenger, and stayed with her cousins while running errands for Rhae Rhae.

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5 hours ago, Corvo the Crow said:

Robb had Sybelle Spicer's affection too? Man that guy is a charmer. What will I learn next, Theon being in love with him also?

Besides, Ned spent a lot of time with Bobby B and we know from Stannis Baratheons do love raping the windows left behind when men rode off to war. It could have rubbed off to Ned from Bob. Personally I am more of a door holding guy but if they are into that... well that's their preference.

That's the second time you've mentioned that. Couldn't it be dangerous? What if the glass breaks?

3 hours ago, Yukle said:

He probably checked her Facebook feed.

Or Foursquare. If it was Varys though you know he was using Twitter. :D

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10 hours ago, GallowsKnight said:

My thought has always been Ethan Glover. I'm not sure exactly how it worked out, but he was probably of a similar age to Lyanna and of the North. She might have told him either intentionally or accidentally of the location. I think he might not have been confined to the Black cells his whole time. Early on he might have been treated better only to be locked away later. If Lyanna confided in him some details like the Tower of Joy (which they may have visited more than once), he could then pass that onto Ned once rescued.


Edit: Reading other comments I think an Ethan Glover, Ashara Dayne combination might have been responsible.

Is your assumption that Lyanna spent time in KL then?

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On 5/8/2018 at 7:01 PM, HelenaExMachina said:

Is your assumption that Lyanna spent time in KL then?

Good point. I think she might have, I can't imagine her spending the entire war in the tower of joy. But I guess she wouldn't have been paraded around in court either.. Perhaps hidden out of the Redkeep in Kingslanding or the countryside.

Edit: My thoughts goes like this the Daynes most likely knew about the Tower of Joy/were supplying it. But Ashara is in Starfall when Ned brings back the sword. Not Kingslanding. I think he had to have a lead which is Ethan Glover whom he freed from the Black Cells. I could imagine that Rhaegar didn't have much of plan when he "abducted Lyanna". He might have stashed her Kingslanding, outside the Redkeep in a Manse while he made arrangments. We know Brandon came to Kingslanding looking for Rhaegar so he might have known he returned there. Artur Dayne seems to be Rhaegar's friend so he might have brought his sister to keep her company. She might have passed a message from Lyanna to Ethan at her request in case things went wrong.

Edited by GallowsKnight

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I think we'll never find out how ned found out where she was. I think sometimes GRRM will leave it to the reader.

It doesn't matter how he found her but that he did.I think its a little similar to the rhaegar/lyanna thing and whether she

was kidnapped or not. In the end,the outcome would've been the same. I think it comes down to how much detail

you want to give knowing that you already have 1300 pages written and do you really want to add more.

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It's funny that people are still debating this. I guess it makes sense, until George doesn't set something in stone, people will theorise until the end of days.

But George has already said how Ned knew where Lyanna was, and why Ashara Dayne killed herself. They are all a part of the legend of Bael the Bard. What happened to Lyanna and Rhaegar and what happened to Ashara and Ned is all there.

Quote

"All I ask is a flower," Bael answered, "the fairest flower that blooms in the gardens o’Winterfell."

And so it was done. But when morning come, the singer had vanished...and so had Lord Brandon’s maiden daughter. Her bed they found empty, but for the pale blue rose that Bael had left on the pillow where her head had lain.

Rhaegar takes Lyanna, and her brother Brandon(her father in the legend of Bael) goes after Rhaegar. He does not find Bael, just as he does not find Rhaegar after he takes Lyanna. He doesn't get killed in the legend of Bael, while the Mad King kills him after he goes to the Red Keep.

Quote

“The song ends when they find the babe, but there is a darker end to the story. Thirty years later, when Bael was King-beyond-the-Wall and led the free folk south, it was young Lord Stark who met him at the Frozen Ford...and killed him.

Ned, now the Lord of Winterfell(He is Bael in this part of the story, instead of Rhaegar who was Bael in the beginning) marches south to fight in the rebellion, and he wins.

Quote

“So the son slew the father instead,” said Jon.

No, lover slew brother. This bit is about Ashara Dayne and how Ned, once her lover, killed her brother Arthur.

Quote

“Aye,” she said, “but the gods hate kinslayers, even when they kill unknowing." When Lord Stark returned from the battle and his mother saw Bael’s head upon his spear, she threw herself from a tower in her grief. Her son did not long outlive her.

"The gods hate kinslayers, even when they kill unknowing", got that? Ashara knew where her brother Arthur was, what she did not knew is what Arthur was truly doing.

For Ashara, Elia's lady-in-waiting, what Arthur was doing for Rhaegar was completely wrong. Arthur had aided Rhaegar in "kidnapping" Lyanna, he tarnished his honor while harming the family of her once lover. Ashara told Ned where Lyanna was, and Ned proceeded to kill Arthur. Ned then brought back his sword(his head in the legend) to Ashara. He also brought a baby with him.

Ashara then comes to the tragic realization that the man who(likely) impregnated her and left her for another woman(thanks to the war), the man she once loved, killed her brother with her help. Ashara Dayne became a kinslayer.

Even worse, she also found out what Arthur was truly doing at the Tower of Joy, he wasn't keeping Ned's sister a hostage, he was protecting her son by Rhaegar from Ned's closest friend and ally: Robert Baratheon. Robert who condoned the butchering of Rhaegar's children and Elia Martell(her liege lord and friend). Ashara then kills herself by jumping from the tallest tower in Starfall after realizing what she had done.

Another interesting connection is this one:
 

Quote

 

"It never happened," Jon said.

She shrugged. "Might be it did, might be it didn't. It is a good song, though. My mother used to sing it to me. She was a woman too, Jon Snow. Like yours." She rubbed her throat where his dirk had cut her. "The song ends when they find the babe, but there is a darker end to the story. Thirty years later, when Bael was King-beyond-the-Wall and led the free folk south, it was young Lord Stark who met him at the Frozen Ford . . . and killed him, for Bael would not harm his own son when they met sword to sword."

 

Quote

 

"And now it begins," said Ser Arthur Dayne, the Sword of the Morning. He unsheathed Dawn and held it with both hands. The blade was pale as milkglass, alive with light.

"No," Ned said with sadness in his voice. "Now it ends." As they came together in a rush of steel and shadow, he could hear Lyanna screaming. "Eddard!" she called. A storm of rose petals blew across a blood-streaked sky, as blue as the eyes of death.

 

The song about Bael the Bard normally ends when they find the babe(Jon). The darker ending to it is when Ned goes to Starfall, and Ashara Dayne realizes what she did.

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