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Why did Walder send Stevron to war?


Canon Claude

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The man is in his 60s, and has been the groomed heir to the Twins. Stevron soaked up pretty much all the honour and family values left in House Frey, and he’s at the age where other lords would be safely able to decline the invitation to fight (Swann, Manderly, Locke are all able to avoid war due to old age). Stevron has no reason to go to war except that his death was required so that he wouldn’t be around to protest the Red Wedding.

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41 minutes ago, Widowmaker 811 said:

 I doubt Stevron would have protested the red wedding after what Robb did to insult his family.

You sure? The general consensus that I’ve noticed is that Stevron wouldn’t have taken part in such a dishonourable action. Robb is certain that if Stevron had been alive, then his situation with the Freys would have been easier to resolve.

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2 minutes ago, Canon Claude said:

You sure? The general consensus that I’ve noticed is that Stevron wouldn’t have taken part in such a dishonourable action. Robb is certain that if Stevron had been alive, then his situation with the Freys would have been easier to resolve.

Am I sure?  No.  But then again, those who claim Stevron would have stopped the red wedding can't be sure either, regardless of what they may claim.  Stevron is an experienced man and if he was brought up by Walder to value family above all, yeah, he would support the plan because it puts the Freys back into good terms with the king and the Lannisters.  And they get to bail out on a dishonorable boy who insulted his family before his rebellion fails.

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31 minutes ago, Widowmaker 811 said:

Stevron is an experienced man and if he was brought up by Walder to value family above all, yeah, he would support the plan because it puts the Freys back into good terms with the king and the Lannisters.

Yeah but he would have to live with ruling a family that committed one of the most egregious breaking of Guest Rights in westerosi history. Whether the Freys feel justified in doing what they did, the RW ruined their reputation. Someone younger than Walder might consider that much more of a problem that they wouldn't want to deal with for the rest of their life. Or not, what do I know.

Stevron might have turned on Robb but I don't think he would do it in the same way if he was in charge. 

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2 hours ago, Widowmaker 811 said:

It was Ser Stevron's duty to lead the Freys.  He's the heir to The Twins and the next Lord of the Crossing.  I doubt Stevron would have protested the red wedding after what Robb did to insult his family.

Ser Stevron would NEVER have agreed to the RW you obviously read his character wrong IMO. 

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To answer to OP, Ser Stevron is heir to the Twins its his duty to lead his family into war and Ser Stevron seems the type to actually care about if the best man for the job leads since it means his familys safety another Frey like Hosteen would be seeking glory. ALSO Walder is close to death by leading the Twins army he is saying im my fathers chosen HEIR and noone else. 

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8 minutes ago, Stormking902 said:

To answer to OP, Ser Stevron is heir to the Twins its his duty to lead his family into war and Ser Stevron seems the type to actually care about if the best man for the job leads since it means his familys safety another Frey like Hosteen would be seeking glory. ALSO Walder is close to death by leading the Twins army he is saying im my fathers chosen HEIR and noone else. 

I also seem to recall that Lord Walder "rode" to the Trident for the Battle at the Ruby Ford. If he is in his early to mid 90's in the books, then he would be in his mid to late 70's during the Robert's Rebellion. Seems that Ser Stevron riding off with Robb is not out of the norm.

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1 hour ago, Raisin' Bran said:

I also seem to recall that Lord Walder "rode" to the Trident for the Battle at the Ruby Ford. If he is in his early to mid 90's in the books, then he would be in his mid to late 70's during the Robert's Rebellion. Seems that Ser Stevron riding off with Robb is not out of the norm.

Tywin is nearly 60 and Kevan is in his mid 50s.  Stevron really shouldn't have been expected to fight but leading in not without question. Aenys is about the same age as Tywin and he was commanding the Frey forces marching north (to die). 

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Grown men have been leading their families during the saga, as posters here say. Stevron is a very discreet one, though. Seeing lord Walder was too old to get out of the Twins for anything, maybe he needed Stevron to ride along Robb to monitor stuff. I have the notion that Walder didn't trust any of his sons and descendants for important leading matters save for Stevron. The Freys have good commanders and warriors, but not leaders.

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5 hours ago, Stormking902 said:

Ser Stevron would NEVER have agreed to the RW you obviously read his character wrong IMO. 

He wouldn't happy about it, but what if he had been forced to choose between his family and loyalty to king.

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12 hours ago, Kandrax said:

He wouldn't happy about it, but what if he had been forced to choose between his family and loyalty to king.

Staying loyal to your family is one thing, the RW was another thing completly. 

The Freys could have made there way back into the crowns good books by just abandoning Robbs cause and preventing Robb from returning North, to go to the extreme of breaking guest right and murdering the the Northern and RL nobility who hung there swords on the wall because they thought they were celebrating with friends is just INSANE and know house Frey is looked down upon WAY more then they use too.

Ser Stevron would have just called his swords home and bent the knee to Joffrey like Walder should of done. 

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On 5/15/2018 at 5:14 PM, Nittanian said:

"Ancient Lord Estermont" also accompanies Renly and then Stannis in ACOK.

I assume this is because the Baratheon brothers are his close kin and he actually wants to serve/protect them if he can. Also hes so old he probably wanted to die in battle and have songs wrote about him lol. 

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On 5/15/2018 at 2:28 PM, Canon Claude said:

The man is in his 60s, and has been the groomed heir to the Twins. Stevron soaked up pretty much all the honour and family values left in House Frey, and he’s at the age where other lords would be safely able to decline the invitation to fight (Swann, Manderly, Locke are all able to avoid war due to old age).

18 years before this Walder too his soldiers to the Trident durring Robert's Rebellion, he would have been a similar age to Stevron. As would have Jon Arryn during that conflict when he lead the Vale troops.  Stevron himself is only a few years older than the likes of Brynden and blind Nortbert Vance who are also leading men in this war. 

Yohn Royce has granddaughters old enough to marry Harry the Heir so he also may be of a similar age to Stevron as are the Greatjon's uncles who are expected to lead men in war. 

There is also Eldon Estermont, who is actually older than Stevron as was Jeor Mormont when he lead the Great Ranging and Corlys Velaryon during the Dance of the Dragons. 

Walder can no longer sit a horse, likely even leave the Twins, while Manderly too fat, Swann pleads illness rather than age as the reason he stays neutral and Ondrew Locke may be closer to Walder than Stevron in age. 

Stevron was healthy enough to ride, as shown by his attendance of the Tourney of the Hand, it would have been dishonorable for Walder to appoint another son at Stevron's expense. Health more than age is the issue and Stevron was healthy enough to lead men. 

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Stevron has no reason to go to war except that his death was required so that he wouldn’t be around to protest the Red Wedding.

What makes you think he would have protested the Red Wedding? All the Frey's were pissed with what Robb did, some more so that others, but none were happy about it. And Stevron after Jaime was defeated was someone who was in favor of negotiating with Tywin. His second wife being a Lydden may mean he had closer ties to the West than we know of. 

A better reason for him dying was it made Walder even angrier about Robb's broken promise. Walder had lost the heir he had been grooming for more than half a century. 

His father was querulous and stubborn, with an iron will and a wasp's tongue, but he did believe in taking care of his own. All of his own, even the ones who had displeased and disappointed him. Even the ones whose names he can't remember. Once he was gone, though . . . When Ser Stevron had been heir, that was one thing. The old man had been grooming Stevron for sixty years, and had pounded it into his head that blood was blood. But Stevron had died whilst campaigning with the Young Wolf in the west

When you consider the two mentions of Walder being pissed with apologies for the loss of life it makes sense that he would be particularly seething over the loss of his firstborn to a broken promise. 

 

"No harm was done—"
"No harm, the king says? No harm? Petyr fell from his horse, fell. I lost a wife the same way, falling." His mouth worked in and out. "Or was she just some strumpet? Bastard Walder's mother, yes, now I recall. She fell off her horse and cracked her head. What would Your Grace do if Petyr had broken his neck, heh? Give me another apology in place of a grandson? No, no, no.
 
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"the King in the North arises. Seems we killed some of your men, Your Grace. Oh, but I'll make you an apology, that will mend them all again, heh."
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In 1861, US Army had just 4 generals.

All of them were over 60, and all save one were over 70.

Winfield Scott was 74, Old, Fat and Feeble (older 140 kg), sick with gout and rheumatism besides, and unable to ride.

John Wool, on the other hand, was 2 years older than Winfield Scott, age 77 - and in better health, reasonably fit and could ride.

So it appears that men in their 60s and 70s who are in good health (like ser Stevron, Walder at the time of Trident, or Jeor Mormont) routinely travel with armies and command them, even if they are not expected to fight in front lines. It is the men with actual disabling illnesses who stay home.

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